Thanks for the breakdown. Will probably buy Cossacks after the hotfix comes out.
Also do we have an abbreviation for Cossacks yet?
Also do we have an abbreviation for Cossacks yet?
EU4 - Dev Diary - December 3rd 2015
- Thread starter Wizzington
- Start date
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Thanks for the explanation, though to me its still too expensive sorry.
I will wait for a sale.
I will wait for a sale.
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It was done in a test game to access the new mechanics.
Can I ask what type of games you usually play? My games are usually conquest heavy oriented towards WC that is how I like to play so I am always ta war. This mechanic detracts me from the game I like to play especially because whatever balance I was able to make can be instantly ruined by the acquisition of new lands mostly because I will inherit the other countries estates. This is too much micro for the pathetic benefits the estates give (by comparison with projection mechanic) but I would not mind to micro it or ignore it taking an economical handicap if rebels, massive stab and legitimacy hits were not in the equation or the reward was bigger. I find that the best solution for my problem is to simply exploit the mechanic by using it in a way it was probably not intended to be used (...) but that does not fix the annoying amount of event pop ups.
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I generally play conquest-heavy, but not going for WC, more to see 'how far can I push the limits of this nation with the constraints I suffer', and 'how well can I exploit opprotunities'. I don't consider myself good enough at exploiting the system to WC, I can understand how dealing with the estates in addition to WC level AE would be frustrating.
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Exactly, and this is the reason why I am amont the people who think that the Cossacks should be priced at 15€ rather than 20€ and the reason I passed on Common Sense until it went into sale. If I substract all the features that I don´t care about (Horde mechanics in the Cossacks, as I am not interested in playing Hordes neither currently nor in the foreseeable future) and just value the features I would like to pay for, in my individual assessment the value of the expansions drop significantly.
In the cossacks, I´m mainly interested in 3 features I consider important as they influence the majority of countries I like to play: Estates, Diplomacy overhaul and native policies. Name your heir might be an interesting, minor bonus. Diplomacy overhaul is a package for me, including all the new war/subject interactions, feedback and so on. Diplomacy with all the minor changes can be considered a mega change instead of major+several minors.
So my personal calculation ends up at 20,1 points (diplo 10+ estates 6+ native policies 3+ name heir 1,5)
For Common Sense I was interested in improved subject interaction (medium), province development (major to mega in terms of influence on gameplay), government ranks (major) and parliament mechanics (medium to low) - so, taking the best best case I end up at 10+6+3+3 = 21
Furthermore I´m still a bit confused at the combination of features that make it into an expansion. I´d much rather prefer game-changing mechanics that affect the majority of countries to be bundled together in a bigger exansion, which might as well cost 20-30€ (diplo-improvements, development, government ranks, estates) and see all the small nation-specific changes put together in a more coherent and maybe smaller expansion designed specifically with a clear focus on a region and theme, not the wild mix of stuff thrown together.
That way, an expansion like "The Cossacks" or "El Dorado" could focus on the entirely of Eastern Europe and Central Asia or the New Wold Native Nations, while other major expansions would flesh out the overarching, core game mechanics like warfare, diplomacy, economy and trade, colonization, religion, internal politics and so on. In doing so, you might even entice to buy one of the region-specific expansions, but right now they are too shallow to make me interested in playing a country in the region just for the new mechanics and too expensive to pick up the expansion at full price just for the core mechanic changes.
So I am usually sitting by and waiting for sales, while I would most likely pay full price if you were just bundling your products differently
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COCKS, size varies (depends on which type is used)
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Ditto on the second point at least. I would be very interested in buying small DLCs that focus on nations or areas.
However, I can see how those might be a harder sell than a bunch-of-stuff expansion like they are producing. They've also decided to go the opposite way with bundling cosmetic DLCs into "content packs".
@Wiz , nice expansion, buggy at points, but still nice.
On a bit unrelated note, you did mention as part of the region rework that the new system is province/area/region/sub-continent.
The reason for bringing this up is that I saw the "Near East" sub-continent is actually spread across 2 continents.
I wanted to know how continents fit into this [if at all]?
Hey Wiz - you called this a Dev Diary - Is there anything that you guys are developing and care to share or was it only a ruse to make us read your explanation of the price?
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Wiz is a Developer. It is a Developer Diary, not a Development Diary.
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I eagerly await the hotfix and patch. Lots of new features that need fixes and tweaking.
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It says it's a development diary...
But clearly this is relevant to how they develop feature lists for expansions, which is likely happening for the next one, if it isn't yet written in stone.
Cheers for the DD Wiz, and big props for the transparency (and to the community for appreciating it, by and large) . From my angle, the expansion is plenty fine in terms of mechanics - it deepens the diplomatic game and actually puts some 'managing your country' gameplay in place, which for a game about managing countries is a good thing . Haven't played enough (I reckon you need 20-40 hours to fully appreciate new mechanics, and I'm a ways off that) to really get a good feel for how it's balanced out, but love what you've done, and think the pricing was fine.
. From my angle, the expansion is plenty fine in terms of mechanics - it deepens the diplomatic game and actually puts some 'managing your country' gameplay in place, which for a game about managing countries is a good thing . Haven't played enough (I reckon you need 20-40 hours to fully appreciate new mechanics, and I'm a ways off that) to really get a good feel for how it's balanced out, but love what you've done, and think the pricing was fine.
Well it's nice to see an answer from Paradox about this. Even if i think it's still overpriced, i understand now how/why you priced it on 20€
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I usually wait for at least 50% sale to get a game.. But you guys do such great work, that I will most likely buy it right after I finish 13.2 Spain playtrough!
As a filthy casual (only 550 hours) I tend to watch Let's Plays as much or more than playing, and in previewing this expansion I was motivated to actually log into the forums and offer a bit of feedback from the perspective of someone less dedicated to the franchise in terms of actual hours spent playing:
Cossacks seems neato, like $7.99 neato. I like playing hordes and some of the other mechanics seem...well, neato, but nothing seems actually "expansiony"(tm). In fact the "expansion" seems more like classic DLC for a game: Something you want to play with but not a whole new book in a great epic set of novels.
That's the sum of my opinion on the matter, but I'd like to just expand on this in light of the context of EUIV development as a whole so far: Things update faster than I play. I'm sure this has been discussed from time to time but it feels like EUIV is really 15 games that have been released (patched) sequentially over a quite short period of time. I'm certain this has been heavenly for people that play often but it's just confusing as hell for a casual as by the time I've learned to play the game well, it changes (yes I know I can use previous versions, and have done so). I don't know if in hindsight you'd have done things differently, but I'd almost have released 3 games in the same period rather than keep the core game in constant flux. There's actually something attractive about a *static* game for some of us, sometimes, and I wonder how much Paradox is missing out on this population?
Back to the topic at hand: If I'd only been watching Let's Plays and hadn't already fallen in love with the game I would be quite put off by the $20.00 price. As it is I just feel annoyed in having to price track it down to something I feel is more in line with how I value the game.
I'm glad you discussed your model of expansion pricing, and my criticism is only in hopes of helping you maximize profits and happy customers long-term.
-Casual
Cossacks seems neato, like $7.99 neato. I like playing hordes and some of the other mechanics seem...well, neato, but nothing seems actually "expansiony"(tm). In fact the "expansion" seems more like classic DLC for a game: Something you want to play with but not a whole new book in a great epic set of novels.
That's the sum of my opinion on the matter, but I'd like to just expand on this in light of the context of EUIV development as a whole so far: Things update faster than I play. I'm sure this has been discussed from time to time but it feels like EUIV is really 15 games that have been released (patched) sequentially over a quite short period of time. I'm certain this has been heavenly for people that play often but it's just confusing as hell for a casual as by the time I've learned to play the game well, it changes (yes I know I can use previous versions, and have done so). I don't know if in hindsight you'd have done things differently, but I'd almost have released 3 games in the same period rather than keep the core game in constant flux. There's actually something attractive about a *static* game for some of us, sometimes, and I wonder how much Paradox is missing out on this population?
Back to the topic at hand: If I'd only been watching Let's Plays and hadn't already fallen in love with the game I would be quite put off by the $20.00 price. As it is I just feel annoyed in having to price track it down to something I feel is more in line with how I value the game.
I'm glad you discussed your model of expansion pricing, and my criticism is only in hopes of helping you maximize profits and happy customers long-term.
-Casual
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