"EU4 Dev Clash #9 - "Happy Three Friends" - Tuesdays 15:00 CET

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Katzura

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@Katz, at how many accumulated points do you value the early Mughal ideas?

How many do you estimate ignoring by going for North instead of South India?

I do not expect the first and second place team to be super close in terms of points, so I don't think the loss of accumulated will hurt our team.
What I get instead is a better idea set along with not painting a huge target on my team by being in the score lead. Remember kids, first place usually have a blue shell coming from behind :D
 

Bratyn

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Can we get a confirmation that Meneth suffered a coalition last session? Jake was so focused on India he almost completely missed it and we don't know what exactly happened.

I suddenly had 20-30 nations request military access from me. Checked over to see the Ducat Party at war with everyone in the HRE, as well as France and Castile. Turns out Venice tried some sneaky stuff and it blew up in their faces. They peaced out in only a month or two, surrendering, and ended up releasing a lot of stuff in Greece.

Omnomnom... ;)
 

KaiserJohan

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I suddenly had 20-30 nations request military access from me. Checked over to see the Ducat Party at war with everyone in the HRE, as well as France and Castile. Turns out Venice tried some sneaky stuff and it blew up in their faces. They peaced out in only a month or two, surrendering, and ended up releasing a lot of stuff in Greece.

Omnomnom... ;)

Been there, done that! :)
 

KaiserJohan

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Haven't noticed any checks on what idea groups everyone is taking, has anybody else? Muscovy with quantity and constant drilling could be v. powerful

For me Defensive/Economic and next Quality/Offensive... (and then maybe exploration >:D). I believe Johan the First went for Aristocratic and Ottos went Quantity. Rest unsure.
 

Groogy

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Nah, we are still stuck in the Eternal Order until the very bitter end.
Next stream is just going to be two teams beating down on a corpse.
WearyHandsomeArgali-size_restricted.gif
 

Groogy

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If you are a vassal you don't generate score, so it would be a problem for your team

what I wan't to see is if The Ethereal Order can make some diplomatic moves today, to give someone else the medicine of a 2 Front war

Spoilers, but no we couldn't
 

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The Year Of Our Lord 1557
eu4_map_KGR_1557_10_16_1.png
eu4_map_KGR_1557_10_16_2.png


####################
## STATS FOR MP ###
####################
Current Score
  1. Ottomans 2745 (+2.83)
  2. Russia 1855 (+1.70)
  3. Ming 1726 (+1.97)
  4. France 1429 (+1.27)
  5. Bahmanis 1157 (+0.14)
  6. Great Britain 631 (+1.27)
  7. Mughals 588 (+0.14)
  8. Mamluks 572 (+0.69)
  9. Austria 452 (+0.70)
  10. Castile 380 (+0.00)
  11. Persia 364 (+0.35)
  12. Venice 232 (+0.42)
  13. Poland 227 (+0.00)
  14. Prussia 100 (+0.28)
  15. Hamburg 75 (+0.00)
  16. Denmark 51 (+0.35)
  17. Aragon 50 (+0.28)
  18. Lübeck 36 (+0.14)
  19. Maldives 29 (+0.07)
  20. Verden 14 (+0.00)
Current Team Score
  1. Turkic Supremacy 2745
  2. Team Johan 1955
  3. Team Deccan 1187
  4. Team Timmy 952
  5. The Renaissance Ducat Party 685
  6. Team Keeping It Real 572
  7. The Eternal Order 0
Development
  1. Ming 1276
  2. Ottomans 969
  3. Mughals 829
  4. Bahmanis 807
  5. France 792
  6. Mamluks 640
  7. Russia 626
  8. Persia 516
  9. Vijayanagar 475
  10. Prussia 450
  11. Great Britain 440
  12. Ayutthaya 394
  13. Austria 386
  14. Crimea 355
  15. Khiva 336
  16. Odoyev 323
  17. Korea 309
  18. Tuscany 303
  19. Hosokawa 281
  20. Yemen 274
Income
  1. Ming 150.29
  2. Ottomans 139.97
  3. Bahmanis 90.25
  4. Mamluks 68.71
  5. France 67.96
  6. Great Britain 59.56
  7. Prussia 55.21
  8. Mughals 54.90
  9. Venice 53.74
  10. Russia 52.00
  11. Austria 51.69
  12. Aragon 51.52
  13. Vijayanagar 38.84
  14. Persia 35.73
  15. Crimea 33.80
  16. Aq Qoyunlu 33.28
  17. Kilwa 33.00
  18. Hosokawa 32.35
  19. Tuscany 28.73
  20. Ayutthaya 27.92
Max. Manpower
  1. Russia 149k
  2. Ottomans 115k
  3. France 79,584
  4. Bahmanis 77,875
  5. Ming 73,097
  6. Mamluks 66,882
  7. Aq Qoyunlu 64,929
  8. Prussia 61,370
  9. Mughals 55,050
  10. Crimea 47,521
  11. Vijayanagar 46,607
  12. Persia 45,956
  13. Adal 43,720
  14. Great Britain 37,735
  15. Croatia 35,381
  16. Ayutthaya 35,323
  17. Korchin 34,916
  18. Austria 34,250
  19. Kilwa 30,267
  20. Aragon 28,959
Standing Army
  1. Ottomans 150k
  2. Ming 109k
  3. France 80,000
  4. Mamluks 78,000
  5. Russia 77,000
  6. Bahmanis 67,000
  7. Austria 57,747
  8. Mughals 56,000
  9. Prussia 49,000
  10. Great Britain 46,000
  11. Vijayanagar 45,000
  12. Hosokawa 42,000
  13. Persia 40,000
  14. Crimea 38,000
  15. Adal 31,930
  16. Ethiopia 26,000
  17. Kilwa 25,936
  18. Aq Qoyunlu 25,000
  19. Aragon 22,083
  20. Odoyev 22,000
War Fleet
  1. Ottomans 5/24
  2. Prussia 3/26
  3. Ming 9/10
  4. Great Britain 17/0
  5. Denmark 0/13
  6. Hosokawa 0/12
  7. Sweden 0/11
  8. Tunis 0/11
  9. Venice 0/10
  10. Aragon 0/9
  11. Kilwa 6/0
  12. France 5/0
  13. Brunei 5/0
  14. Mughals 0/4
  15. Malacca 4/0
  16. Uesugi 0/4
  17. Vijayanagar 3/0
  18. Adal 3/0
  19. Holland 3/0
  20. Pasai 2/0
Trade Fleet
  1. Great Britain 33
  2. Maldives 24
  3. Bahmanis 22
  4. Pegu 19
  5. Makassar 16
  6. Ottomans 15
  7. France 15
  8. Morocco 15
  9. Sunda 14
  10. Lübeck 14
  11. Bremen 14
  12. Pasai 13
  13. Malacca 12
  14. Vijayanagar 12
  15. Hamburg 12
  16. Ming 10
  17. Ashikaga 10
  18. Aq Qoyunlu 10
  19. Oldenburg 10
  20. Kilwa 9
Technologies
  1. Mamluks 39
  2. Prussia 38
  3. Sweden 38
  4. Norway 38
  5. Denmark 38
  6. Venice 38
  7. Austria 38
  8. Tuscany 38
  9. Mainz 38
  10. Ottomans 37
  11. France 37
  12. Morocco 37
  13. Holland 37
  14. Aragon 37
  15. Naples 37
  16. Great Britain 36
  17. Lübeck 36
  18. Aq Qoyunlu 36
  19. Saxony 36
  20. Crimea 35
Great Power
  1. Ottomans 905
  2. Ming 812
  3. France 740
  4. Mamluks 598
  5. Russia 596
  6. Mughals 595
  7. Persia 482
  8. Great Britain 446
    [~]Austria 434
    [~]Prussia 420
    [~]Bahmanis 387
    [~]Vijayanagar 352
    [~]Crimea 331
    [~]Tuscany 283
    [~]Denmark 270
    [~]Yemen 256
    [~]Aq Qoyunlu 248
    [~]Aragon 241
    [~]Odoyev 205
    [~]Venice 181
 

Bratyn

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Kinda peeved I couldn't make it for this session. This war with Mamluks has been in the making for 3 sessions by now, and every time something came up that meant we couldn't. The Genoa debacle delayed a war in the second half of the first session. The mad dash for Iberia and requiring to grow Crimea for land that could be sacked delayed a war in the second session. ForzaA's unfortunate 'brb' for 15mins last session (which happened literally as we were moving our troops to the border in preparation of a war) and the AI's subsequent alliance with France delayed a war that session. And now, at the moment supreme... I of course couldn't attend. Typical.

But many kudos to @Meneth for graciously standing in for me and lending his expert skills to guiding the Ottomans through this session, and so well in accordance to my plans. Wonderful play in that war, and glad Aq Qoyunlu finally got some land ;)

Just going to point out the Ottomans alone outnumber any other entire team in standing army.

Not hard with quantity ideas. But the quality comparably isn't as good as other people who have taken Defensive or Quality.

As for the fearmongering... The only thing that'll happen if everyone gangs up on the Turks is that everyone in a periphery position is going to be able to blob like mad. We're already seeing what is happening in India, and we've got (P)Russia in the north which is possibly one of the most powerful military combos possible in the game.
 

Bratyn

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Given that everyone - except for Team Timmy - is in the periphery, and the alternative is letting you blob in Spain and let you pick them of one by one, I would know what to choose.
Furthermore, there's no way they'll destroy you in one session.
They have to attack you and do it soon, or they are giving up already.

Have you looked how much development is still left in Spain? Not much. My growth into AI will grind to a halt when I run into the France/Mamluks blob (my allies' AI growth has already long halted), whereas Russia and Prussia have a completely empty Scandinavia and HRE to expand into, and the players positioned in Europe are quite weak and won't be a match for them when they come knocking. -Especially- not when the inevitable partition with Mamluks happens.

The issue is the same for Mamluks, who have entire Africa to expand into and the perfect springboard to go colonialist. If the Ducat party gangs up on the Turks, the only thing they'll achieve is that, rather than having one team to contend with, they'll be held in a vise by Mamluks (coming from Iberia and into Italy) on one side, and (P)Russia on the other.

The same again for Timurids. Focusing on us means they'll be left in a vise between (P)Russia and India, and possibly even Mamluks.

The only two teams who have any real direct interest in eliminating us would be the two teams who otherwise would have nobody checking their moves, i.e. (P)Russia and Mamluks. Is it a coincidence they are the ones to instigate action against us the most?
 
Last edited:

Meneth

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How terrified of the Turks Johan was at the end of the last session was fairly telling.
Johan does what Johan does best; play on people's fear of other players so that they'll overlook him. As Bratyn mentions, the Russian team is in a great position; they have all of Northern Europe to expand into.
 

Bratyn

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(P)Russia knows they need time to fully come into their own as most powerful military alliance in the game. Using Ottomans as a lightning rod and redirecting everyone's attention to us allows them to grow unhindered and utterly squash everyone by the time people are done with us.
 

Bratyn

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Did you not see that war against the Mamluks? I mean, it's perfectly possible that you missed it. Keeping It Real was KO in the blink of an eye.

Did you not see Mamluks had 20k manpower left when they peaced out, compared to Ottomans being far in the minuses already? Not to mention it was a 3v2 war. With another 40k-50k player troops on Mamluk side those battles in mountains would have likely been lost.
 
Last edited:

Meneth

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compared to Ottomans being far in the minuses already?
-60k to be precise, though that was largely due to me wanting to force a quick peace and thus accepting more losses than were truly necessary by attacking into mountains.
 
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