EU: The Next Generation

[Slargos]

Originally posted by Hive
@Duuk
Maestro ain't quitting because he 'bailed' on us, he's quitting because he's travelling to China for 2 months and after that to USA for the rest of the year.

As to his play style, I agree that it's pretty bad to lose your HRE election as Austria. But we all make mistakes every now and then (Especially in Unleashed 1) and I'm sure we'll see more mistakes to come. I don't doubt that Maestro has been playing long term, and that's the imortant issue IMO.

Well. In all fairness, it looks suspicious when he knew he was going away, to then start a new game and go off on an aggression spree... I can see where Duuk is coming from.

But hey, I'm not complaining. I had lots of fun fending off the german horde..

 

[Hive]

Originally posted by Slargos
Well. In all fairness, it looks suspicious when he knew he was going away, to then start a new game and go off on an aggression spree... I can see where Duuk is coming from.

But hey, I'm not complaining. I had lots of fun fending off the german horde..

I understand why Duuk might wonder about this, but I just don't think Maestro would do that. I think it's rather a result of him being afraid that Brandenburg would gobble it all or something (of course, I don't know - but this is my guess). He's also Austria in AoD, and he didn't do anything 'qustionable' there when we played this monday.

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Originally posted by Duuk
I assumed Maestro would bail out on us. He was aggressive too early in the game as Austria, when Austria isn't exactly a world spanning power. He raised his BadBoy high enough that he lost the HRE election (hard to do as Austria!) and thus couldn't march troops to support his inner cores.

His bombastic comments made him enemies of EVERY player-run nation around him except for Venice, who saw that getting raped for Austria's stupidity wasn't all that great.

He turned down peace when he was obviously beaten, preferring to destroy himself than lose 1-2 provinces. Because of this, he lost almost all of Hungary and Venice lost a province.

They aren't wrecked permanently, but hopefully the next Austrian player can take some time and be peaceful. The Imperial Diplomatic Corps could use the rest anyway

*Sigh* Oh how wrong can you be... let me explain some things. (ok i didnt write an aar cuz i simply did not have the time yet) but here is some explanation of my actions. First of all I started out very peacefull (like i always am as many players can confirm) and was dowed early in the game by France who demanded Brabant, Artois and Franche Comtee. Gladly my Spanish ally jumped in and we were able to come to a white peace. Then I believe YOU started to herass me over things that my ally Hungary was doing.. namely annexing two minors wich it always does... Keep your ally in check you screamed.. well how do I do that u idiot... Hungary even dowed Poland wich I imediatly white peaced. So untill this far not a single warmongering action from me. But Duuk the ignorant Sultan dowes Hungary and takes a few provinces from em... ok i think to myself fair enough dont worry bout it and move on. Also Brandenbug and Poland (poland who i've been trying to get some decent relation with as we are natural allies) dowed bohemia in another attempt to gain something from a still very weak Austria. Sufficient to say i kicked their asses back to their homeland. And i get blamed for protecting Bohemia?? Can u get any dumber Duuk? Then Helvetia annexes baden, wurtemburg and some more german minors... then Helvetia dowes my ally bavaria. Of course I protect my ally and take back the provinces that helvetia and the palatinat has conquered. Nothing strange about this ass well do you think? After that I annex Friesland and Geldre in conjuction with actions from Brandenburg.. nothing weird or agressive about that too. All in all till this time... i have dowed twice as i had been dowed six times till then. This gangbanging cycle repeated itself when our alliance (portugal, spain, venice) decided to take action against france. Austria was again not the driving force behind this but again we got blamed for this all by all nations who supposed to 'check' Austria. Resulting in the Ottos dowing me again. White peace was soon signed with France and I could concentrate on annihalating the Ottos. This was going quite well (especially after suleyman had died) so accepting white peace when a war is turning for the better is stupid? No my dear Duuk YOU are. It was only when Brandenburg, Poland, and Helvetia and France again decided to gangbang me when the war took a turn for the bad. Brandenburg was beaten back quickly but fighting on 4 front is impossible at this stage for Austria.

And as for the case of losing the title of Emperor.. this always happens when austria dedides to take the 1000 ducats with the Hapsburg marriage and run the empire from Vienna. Another ingenious remark of you duuuk.. not. This was btw not even a problem since i had acces thru almost every german nation. Get your facts straight mister!

All in all i think you quite lost your way here Duuk and are a little to confindent about your own rightiousness. Its just sad to see that there are 4! nations there to check Austria but not one to check them. But anyway i never complain about when things go bad in a game cuz its just a game. But yeah you were right after this sunday I bought me a ticket to China because I was afraid of you duuuk. (OMG) Seems to me there is only one agressive fool and thats YOU! Oh and the final dow count was: Austria for 3 - Austria against 13. The term checking Austria really got a new dimension in this early stage, wich i must admit does not seem very honorable or fair to Austira imo.

I sure hope you are in the final sessions of unleashed 1

 

[Hive]

Wooo, that sure is a lot of anger Maestro...

For the record, I only claimed that I was acting against Austrian aggression in a RP perspective. It's clear that my goal was to gain land (notibly Silesia, my core).

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Originally posted by Slargos
Well. In all fairness, it looks suspicious when he knew he was going away, to then start a new game and go off on an aggression spree... I can see where Duuk is coming from.

But hey, I'm not complaining. I had lots of fun fending off the german horde..

I refer to my former post and will add that the plan was to take the trip on the 23. october. But since my presence in China was required earlier the date got shifted a month. As one of the most dependable players in Unleashed 1 i sure am overwhelmed by this trust in my integrity

 

[arcorelli]

Well, in my humble opinion Austria was not very warmongering in the session (not more than the turks). And Austria tends to have difficult relations with their neighbours. So, I do not believe that the play of Maestro was very problematic (for Austria or for the game), although I think that he should got a more active diplomatic policy

But regarding the complaint that there is too many nations checking Austria. There is nations to check the nations that check Austria. Poland got their natural enemies too, France is surrounded by Habsburgs, Brandenburg should not be very confident. I think that was simply that northern europe and the baltic were relatively peaceful areas when western and central europe were not.

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Originally posted by arcorelli
Well, in my humble opinion Austria was not very warmongering in the session (not more than the turks). And Austria tends to have difficult relations with their neighbours. So, I do not believe that the play of Maestro was very problematic (for Austria or for the game), although I think that he should got a more active diplomatic policy

But regarding the complaint that there is too many nations checking Austria. There is nations to check the nations that check Austria. Poland got their natural enemies too, France is surrounded by Habsburgs, Brandenburg should not be very confident. I think that was simply that northern europe and the baltic were relatively peaceful areas when western and central europe were not.

True but it was clear from the start that i would not get any help in any way form Brandenbrug and Poland after probing them. So my diplomatic policy evolved around Spain, Venice and Portugal. But you simply cant deny that this gangbanging on austria seems a bit of the scale. Again i'm not complaining about this but just an observation. I would probably have done the same if i had been Brandenburg or Poland or even Ottos for that matter. The only thing that bothers me is being accused of short term management, wich simply wasnt the case. Its just that if all your neighbours are keen on tearing Austria apart before it even comes to strength and diplomacy hasnt worked, actions have to be taken. I mean should I have just handed over Bohemia to Brandenburg and Poland and Hungary to the Ottos? I think not. As u can understand these things restricts the diplomatic aspect to a larg extend. Its like when i sent a proposal for a non agression pact to Poland and recieve an answer like: not unless you hand over Silesia. Sacrificing provinces to have better relations with my neighbours just seems to be a neverending tale of diplomatic screwovers to me. So thats were diplomacy ends, sadly. As for the Ottos I totally understand that they concentrate on the destruction of Austria, its their historical right, just dont accuse me on a personal level of being agressive, short term playing and so on.

 

[unmerged(10915)]

Well, thing is you should have accepted peace with OE right away, that was your only error that i could see.
The Turks arent exactly afraid of inflation and due to this weakness, you should be able to steamroll her in some centuries.
Think about it, if Poland is aggressive against you, they wont have as much space to mess with Russia. And when the Swedish time of glory comes around, noone will help her either. She is just burning bridges and helping a country that will want her most valuable provnices in the future (Danzig et al), while desecrating her most staunch (at least if its concerning Brandenburg, Austria doesnt want to be the lowly one in Germany) supporter in Austria.

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Originally posted by Mulliman
Well, thing is you should have accepted peace with OE right away, that was your only error that i could see.
The Turks arent exactly afraid of inflation and due to this weakness, you should be able to steamroll her in some centuries.
Think about it, if Poland is aggressive against you, they wont have as much space to mess with Russia. And when the Swedish time of glory comes around, noone will help her either. She is just burning bridges and helping a country that will want her most valuable provnices in the future (Danzig et al), while desecrating her most staunch (at least if its concerning Brandenburg, Austria doesnt want to be the lowly one in Germany) supporter in Austria.

Yes with hindsight you are right about the WP with OE but at that moment i still had 60k+ forces with a leader and suleyman dead, so it was a gamble but certainly not a hopeless one. As for the rest an excellent observation i'd say.

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Originally posted by Hive
Wooo, that sure is a lot of anger Maestro...

Yeah accusing me on a personal level really pisses me off.. but i guess an AAR just wasnt enough for Duuk to display his god-complex.

 

[Hive]

Well, as I stated earlier I don't think making an honest mistake is the same thing as playing short term.

Apart from that, this really shouldn't be an issue anymore since Maestro is out of TNG.

But I do feel we may experience some struggle in the north in the final sessions of EU1...

 

[Mem de Sá]

Originally posted by Hive


But I do feel we may experience some struggle in the north in the final sessions of EU1...

Hehehe

 

[Duuk]

Originally posted by Maestro (r)
Yeah accusing me on a personal level really pisses me off.. but i guess an AAR just wasnt enough for Duuk to display his god-complex.

Your personal attacks on me are bullshit. I can phrase it better if you like:

Austria was played by an idiot that felt he'd win every war, which was plainly not the case. He was too damn stupid to accept a minor defeat and instead wound up losing enough to be mildly crippled. Glad to see you go.

Now, to get back into the game with a breath...

I think the player that takes over Austria should set a goal based on Austrian history to this point: Keep the Netherlands and DO NOT let them revolt. This would check France, which would be something that the crop of Austrians would see as a plus due to their wars with France. Also, it will bring needed income to check the Ottoman threat. Seems perfectly well to roleplay that and see if you can hold them

 

[arcorelli]

Originally posted by Duuk
Your personal attacks on me are bullshit. I can phrase it better if you like:

Austria was played by an idiot that felt he'd win every war, which was plainly not the case. He was too damn stupid to accept a minor defeat and instead wound up losing enough to be mildly crippled. Glad to see you go.

May we continue without any more personal attacks or remarks?

 

[Mem de Sá]

Originally posted by arcorelli
May we continue without any more personal attacks or remarks?

Yes, yes
Lets return to the mild climate that made Europe Unleashed Classic so beloved by all who subbed in it

Only irony is permited, hehe

Swastria...

And I must say I dont think Maestro played short term, his explanation is very good to me. He always played long term in EU Classic, even when i did not agreed that the way he choosed to his country was the best longterm

Sure, not even I played the best game longterm sometimes atacking Dutch, Sweden and Austria in EU1 alone is not very clever! But very understandeble given my monarch, and If i was to continue playing i would not have peaced out (as my sub wisely did) because I thought I had a chance... and France would have been ugly crushed.
Probably the same Maestro made in this game

 

[Mem de Sá]

Originally posted by TheArchduke
How so?

Well, the names of the provincies dont make any sense with reality , what to say of its boundaries

Only as an exemple Recife is actually capital of Pernambuco after dutch invasions (was Olinda before), not a provincie. Diamantina should be in the interior. The coast should be Bahia. Many others names are wrongly placed. Itaimas should be São Vicente or São Paulo, i think. Salvador should be Rio de Janeiro (as Salvador was not a provincies but the capital of the colony).

But I saw a photo of the map of Victoria wich shows parts of Brazil and it seems very accurate the southern frontier of Brazil. This time I think Paradox will get it right

 

[TheArchduke]

Originally posted by Camisa 10

But I saw a photo of the map of Victoria wich shows parts of Brazil and it seems very accurate the southern frontier of Brazil. This time I think Paradox will get it right

You always learn something new everyday.

People plz don´t start arguing. That´s the main reason why I am in this game as the people in EU1 were really nice as far as I saw and weren´t such egos that they argued..

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Originally posted by Duuk
Your personal attacks on me are bullshit. I can phrase it better if you like:

Austria was played by an idiot that felt he'd win every war, which was plainly not the case. He was too damn stupid to accept a minor defeat and instead wound up losing enough to be mildly crippled. Glad to see you go.

Atleast my attacks are based on facts rather then your unfounded bullshit. Maybe your right about some things from an rp perspective but to take it to a personal level (wich you sure as hell did) is simply pathetic. Its a game remember?? Obviously you didnt read my post. But may I ask where this hate against me comes from? Was it that asskicking I gave you in Unleashed 1 where you showed up in the last sessions to play a poor weak Russia only to be commanded by a powerfull Sweden? (me ) I bet it is.. you seem childish enough for it... Ok enough with the insults

You know the thing that made Unleashed 1 such a very enjoyable and great game was the fact that we all could get along like friends... even at war, hell we had even more fun at war. We all had a kind of respect to eachother and the awareness that its just a game and you supposed to have fun. Not going on a negative personal tour when someone doesnt bow to your demands but talk about it.. make propaganda and so on but most of all have fun. We sure as hell dont need players like you Duuk to ruin such an atmosphere.

-Case closed

 

[arcorelli]

Please guys, can we let the thing rest and forget it? And please, no more personal attacks or remarks in the rest of the game, can we?

And so, we can return to our beloved game. If anyone wants his title changed in the shiny new map of Europe posted in the AAR thread, you can send your message to the danish courts, although I think they are very accurate, specially the swedish one

 

[unmerged(16217)]

Sorry guys... really didnt wanna make a big deal out of it. I'm already sorry that I ever dignified it with comments... my bad... but as i said.. case closed and lets forget about it.

No doubt that ya'll have another great Unleashed game and i really hate bailing out on it...RL's a bitch I hope that if i come back next year ya'll save me a spot on possibly Unleashed 3. Or maybe i could even sub sometimes when i can get a decent connection up somewhere on that big asian continent.