either add a way to guarantee access to zro, or remove zro from the game

[Somebody248]

I've never seen Living Metal on the galactivc market unless I had acces to a node myself. I believe the same is true for Zro, but I rarely watch out for it, and it's more common than LM, so I can't be sure.

And, yes, even as Machine Empire or Synthetic ascended I often get the Psionics tech (and then Zro Distillation) with the help of Racket or Curator scientists.

I have both Zro and Living Metal available on the galactic market in my current game, despite not having a deposit of either resource in my own space. All you need is for any member of the galactic community to have any amount of a resource in their stockpile for everyone to be able to buy that resource. In this game, the AI found and mined Zro, and I got 40 Living Metal from a trade with the caravaneers. (I still don't have living metal tech though, so I currently have no way to use the resource.)

That said, the internal market does require you to find a resource yourself. If you're not in the galactic community or the galactic market hasn't been founded yet, you're using the internal market and need your own supply.

As for making zro more common, one idea would be to make salvaging a psionic entity or fallen empire fleet with psi components give a small amount of zro, assuming this isn't already how it works. Once you have some zro, you should be able to buy more from the market.

 

[Bankipriel]

psionic is the only ascension path that has it's bonuses and benefits tied completely to a strategic resource, and it's too easy to get locked out of access to it. if you can't secure a node of zro, you can't get any of the ship modules that use it, nor can you use the edicts that require it. i'm on the second game in a row where i got blocked in before i discovered a node to mine zro, and i have no way in my territory to access it and can't buy it on the galactic market.

I agree with your sentiment.


However, there are *so* many rough edges to this game, I would strongly encourage you to dip your toes into the vast array of mods. The water is more than fine. I've played with a mod that normalizes zro production for so long I thought your post was in error when I first read it before I remembered: oh yeah, the base game *doesn't* have zro production techs.

I'm not saying they shouldn't add it. I'm all in favor of requesting changes to the base game. However, in this instance, you can also grab from a number of popular tech mods and solve this problem for your next game.

cheers

 

[amib]

I've played with a mod that normalizes zro production for so long

which mod? the only mod i can find that gives me zro production is Extra Ship Components, and more components to research is the last thing i want. if the default UI let me swap the green for any other color, i wouldn't use mods at all except the mod i have the sorts the buildings in planet view so that research stations and temples and stuff are together with each other instead of scattered all over

 

[Bankipriel]

which mod? the only mod i can find that gives me zro production is Extra Ship Components, and more components to research is the last thing i want. if the default UI let me swap the green for any other color, i wouldn't use mods at all except the mod i have the sorts the buildings in planet view so that research stations and temples and stuff are together with each other instead of scattered all over

I do, in fact, use the Extra Ship Components NEXT mod, which offers several options.

However, if you search for "zro" in the workshop, there are several options just on the first page. If it were me, I'd probably try this one first: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1591092294

 

[amib]

I do, in fact, use the Extra Ship Components NEXT mod, which offers several options.

However, if you search for "zro" in the workshop, there are several options just on the first page. If it were me, I'd probably try this one first: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1591092294

looks like it hasn't been updated in 4 years and causes the AI to spam the zro building to the exclusion of all else

 

[Ikael]

Giving Zro synthesis as a part of the Psionic Ascension (say, as a particular covenant bonus or a Shroud technology) always seemed like an obvious solution for this problem.

 

[Nevars]

Giving Zro synthesis as a part of the Psionic Ascension (say, as a particular covenant bonus or a Shroud technology) always seemed like an obvious solution for this problem.

I don't think it's obvious to the dev at all.

Remember they don't want anything to be guaranteed with psionic, ability to choose your own covenant? That's step too far, it's must be rng, etc.

So tying essiantial resource that psionic need on rng (map seed) is consistent if really disappointing.

I guess the shroud tech prob work cuz you still need to gacha to get them so fulfilling the dev critaria on psionic must be unreliable (and weak lol).

 

[Dr Pippy]

My biggest complaint about Zro is that I often end up with it in my borders and I can't mine it to sell on the market when playing a machine empire. If it exists it should be minable even if I can't use it personally. Or just don't show it to empires that can't mine it - please - for the love of all that's holy...

I think everyone can research Zro Distillation in 3.6, although it's a very low chance if you're not going Psionics.

The whole "Exotic Resources" system is in dire need of a rethink. Zro, Nanites, Liquid Metal, and Dark Matter are all just a mess. They do absolutely nothing most of the time, but because they're so inconsistent the few things that care about them also do absolutely nothing most of the time.

Honestly, I'm with you on the "Just get rid of it" front. The purpose they serve is a *bad* purpose. If you make them able to be synthesized, they're just normal Strategic Resources. If you make them too impactful, it becomes a frustrating die roll. If you make them not very impactul, it makes them a *stupid* die roll. There's no scenario where their core concept exists and they're also a good part of the game people enjoy.

For some context here, I have a current playthrough on a 400-star galaxy on the 3.6 beta where I've conquered the entire galaxy, with no L-Cluster. My current income for the exotic resources are

• Dark Matter: 110.5/month (of which I'm trading for 80/month on the internal market, since I'm not part of the Galactic Community)
• Zro: 37.8/month (as a Driven Assimilator lol)
• Living Metal: 3.6/month (which is a little surprising since there should be at least 5 deposits after beating the Contingency)
• Nanites: 1.8/month (again, no L-cluster, although even with the L-cluster sometimes it's not much more than this)

Current edict costs for the Living Metal and Nanite Edicts are 120.70 per month. None of the exotic resources exist naturally in quantities large enough to support this without using the market heavily (i.e., to boost natural income by a factor of at least several). In the case of Nanites, which you can't trade for, I'd have enough to run the Nanite Actuators edict (+10% research speed) for a single year after saving up for just over 67 years.

Can't say for sure if this indicates something wrong with the state of edict costs, exotic resource availability, or both, but I'd suggest that an edict cost/resource income ratio of 67 for an end-game empire is facially absurd.

 

[M@ni@c]

Let the Shroud Beacon starbase building produce 1 Zro.

 

[DYNIA]

psionic is the only ascension path that has it's bonuses and benefits tied completely to a strategic resource, and it's too easy to get locked out of access to it. if you can't secure a node of zro, you can't get any of the ship modules that use it, nor can you use the edicts that require it. i'm on the second game in a row where i got blocked in before i discovered a node to mine zro, and i have no way in my territory to access it and can't buy it on the galactic market.

you can buy zro after galatic market is formed even you didn't discover it, idk what is your problem

 

[Vastet]

That is not true. Only if an empire in the galactic community is mining a resource will it appear in the galactic market.

 

[blaadjesboom]

The worst part is that sometimes I feel that the game is reading my mind. If I plan on going Psionic, there's not a drop of Zro to be found anywhere. But if I start a new game and plan on going biological, I'll get two or three deposits seemingly right in my back yard. Get out of my head. (Yes pun intended).

I don't really want to see it go away, just maybe a way for a psionic species to find it. Maybe a after a certain amount of time, you can have an anomaly pop up, saying our new psionic abilities have allowed us to detect something in this asteroid/star/etc that our normal sensors missed, or something like that.

I agree maybe a shroud event that reveals a hidden zro deposit on the map