Edge of Europe - A Belgian Interactive AAR

[sealy300]

((You might want to add a translation there. I can understand you perfectly, but solely foreign-language posts are against the rules in the English-language forums. ))

((Parlez vous Français? ou Es tu Français? And is anyone Dutch or Belgian? I know BR is, I am interested to see who from Belgium is governing it))

 

[Scrapknight]

I cannot vote for this unless this is changed to universal suffrage, we cannot deny women to vote if they can already do so.
Cognatic Succession Amendment: AYE
Referendum Amendment: AYE

Jean di Picardie.

Deputy di Picardie,

This was a result of the bill being drafted before votes were granted to women. The change shall be made immediately.

- Pierre Savarin, P.M.

 

[Gen. Marshall]

((Parlez vous Français? ou Es tu Français? And is anyone Dutch or Belgian? I know BR is, I am interested to see who from Belgium is governing it))

((I'm Dutch, and Google Translate-capable with French and German.))

Joint Elected Senate Amendment of 1898: Nay
Cognatic Succession Amendment: Nay
Referendum Amendment: Nay

[MLP]

- Senator Sir Max van Brabant, OPL

 

[sealy300]

Deputy di Picardie,

This was a result of the bill being drafted before votes were granted to women. The change shall be made immediately.

- Pierre Savarin, P.M.

Fair enough, I see no other issue with this amendment.
Joint Elected Senate Amendment of 1898: YAY

BSU
Jean di Picardie, Deputy pour Artois

 

[DensleyBlair]

((Parlez vous Français? ou Es tu Français? And is anyone Dutch or Belgian? I know BR is, I am interested to see who from Belgium is governing it))

((Non, je suis Britannique, bien que j'apprenne français depuis douze ans.))

((No, I'm British, although I've been learning French for twelve years. ))

Considering the government's silence on the matter, I wish to present a two new bills to the Chamber floor.

Conditions for Dissolution Bill​

1. Upon the passage of any bill altering the franchise, Parliament shall be dissolved.
2. Dissolution shall occur within thirty (30) days of the bill receiving Royal Assent.
3. A general election to elect a new parliament shall be called within seven (7) days of dissolution.

Retroactive Dissolution Bill​

1. Should the Conditions for Dissolution Bill (1898) receive Royal Assent, it shall be retroactively applied to include the Amendment to the Franchise Act (1897).
2. The current sitting parliament shall be dissolved within thirty (30) days of this bill receiving Royal Assent.

The Hon. J. B. H. Van der Wyngaert​

 

[sealy300]

No, none of you are... perhaps that's why the monarchy still survives, despite your "best efforts."

~ Lt. General P.M. Pilon

I think the honourable General forgets his history, Napoleon Became the emperor of France and had little to do with over throwing the de bourbon monarchs, instead making himself supreme dictator, would you prefer that?

Jean di Picardie

((Non, je suis Britannique, bien que j'apprenne français depuis douze ans.))

((No, I'm British, although I've been learning French for twelve years. ))

((Same here, the schools really do force you to do it don't they.))

 

[Gen. Marshall]

((Non, je suis Britannique, bien que j'apprenne français depuis douze ans.))

((No, I'm British, although I've been learning French for twelve years. ))

((Surely, you mean "since I was twelve years old"? That's what it says in French and it's also what makes more sense, given that you are 14/15.))

These bills have my support. In the interest of democracy, it is only logical for parliament to represent the franchise as-is, whatever my opinions regarding that franchise may be.

- Senator Sir Maximiliaan van Brabant, OPL

 

[DensleyBlair]

((Surely, you mean "since I was twelve years old"? That's what it says in French and it's also what makes more sense, given that you are 14/15.))

((Nope, I mean "since twelve years". It's how the French represent lengths of time – unless I've been taught falsities. That, and I have been learning the language in at least some form since I was three. ))

 

[sealy300]

((Nope, I mean "since twelve years". It's how the French represent lengths of time – unless I've been taught falsities. That, and I have been learning the language in at least some form since I was three. ))

((I concur, J'ai habité pendant dix ans, I have lived there since ten years, the ans goes at the end))

 

[Gen. Marshall]

((Nope, I mean "since twelve years". It's how the French represent lengths of time – unless I've been taught falsities. That, and I have been learning the language in at least some form since I was three. ))

((I'm beginning to suspect that you had a near-death experience when you were 10, and decided to start counting your age all over at that point. I don't say these things often; but you're really, really way too smart, and I imagine that your parents are as well. I'll go ahead and believe your French, this time

Apologies for the OOC, I just had to say that.))

 

[viola]

Joint Elected Senate Amendment of 1898: Yes
Cognatic Succession Amendment: Yes
Referendum Amendment: Yes

As far as I'm concerned a King that has not been approved by its people through a Referendum lacks any legitimacy whatsoever, it's more and more evident that the Belgian people do not want a Monarchy anymore and it's only an entrenched minority that is denying the will of the people. The King should abdicate at once.

And of course I'm not surprised by the opposition to the elected Senate reform, once again the Conservatives show their antidemocratic character and the "Liberals" prove that they are simply Conservatives in disguise. To see that at the doors of the XXth century Belgium is still locked into Feudal institutions and that the nature of the constitution make any meaningful reform absolutely impossible is, simply put, disgusting.
Belgium politics have unfortunately proved to be unreformable, the Belgian Social Union should waste no time anymore trying a hopeless compromise with forces that have no interest in reform nor with the will of the people.


[BSU]
- Carl Coppens, Socialist Deputy

 

[Dyranum]

((It seems like my incorporation amendment has been forgotten...))

 

[Maxwell500]

Joint Elected Senate Amendment of 1898: No
Cognatic Succession Amendment: No
Referendum Amendment: No

[RU]

 

[NikoHoI3]

Joint Elected Senate Amendment: Nay
Cognatic Succession Amendment: Nay
Referendum Amendendment: Nay

[RU]

Valentin-Alexandre Klinkenberg,
MP for Schaerbeek

 

[Jack LEagle]

Joint Elected Senate Amendment of 1898: Yes
Cognatic Succession Amendment: Yes
Referendum Amendment: Yes

Dirk Hendrickx [BSU]

 

[Otto of england]

Joint Elected Senate Amendment: Nope
Cognatic Succession Amendment: Nope
Referendum Amendendment: Nope

[RU]

- Jules van de Velde

 

[Davout]

Joint Elected Senate Amendment: Yes - Not ideal but an improvement on where we are at. I am uncertain how a non-partisan Senate could elected since all people have their natural political inclinations and true fence sitters are the last people we want in positions of authority.
Cognatic Succession Amendment: Yes - This is consistent with the recent enlargement of the suffrage.
Referendum Amendendment: Yes - I hope that this resolves the issue finally as we are wasting too much time on form and not enough on the substance of social justice and the affairs of state.

As I have received no news from my ministry that there has been any change in our industry, I advise that the status will remain quo for the Ministry of Commerce, with ongoing guarantees but no anticipated draw down of funds from consolidated revenue to have to honour such guarantees.


Frederic Burke
BSU

 

[unmerged(718634)]

Joint Elected: Abstain
Cognatic Succession: Aye
Referendum Amendment: Aye

[SDP] ((I remembered, took an hour, but I did)

Theodore Castle, CEO of Castle F&O

 

[Dyranum]

I would like to pose a question in regard to the Elected Senate Amendment. Could M. Savarin explain the following:

Article 9
Deputies are popularly elected by universal suffrage in each constituency. Voting results are calculated using the D'Hondt method.

Article 10
Constituencies within the same region shall encompass roughly the same population as each other. Constituencies shall be reapportioned in a manner prescribed by law every ten years after a census has been taken.

These two articles are quite strange. For one, the modified art. 9 is identical to art. 4, with the exception of granting universal and equal suffrage, in stark contrast to the latter one which discriminates based on age. However, it refers to "Deputies"... which is quite peculiar for a Senate amendment, and creates a legal conflict wih art. 4. Surely this must be a mistake?
Secondly, the modified art. 10 is useless, and competes with art. 2, since the constituencies used by the Senate - according to this amendment - are the same as those used for elections to the Chamber of Deputies. A better way of going about this issue would have been to simply not have this new art. 10, for art. 2 already covers that issue.

A separate question, regarding the Referendum Amendment, posed to whoever proposed it: Is this not a bit specific for an act?

Cognatic Succession Amendment: Abstain. The formatting could be better, but the spirit of this amendment is laudable.

- Random Kaasist Deputy

 

[Syriana]

There appears to have been confusion during the tabling of my proposed referendum bill as to its actual purpose, which I have been hitherto unable to clarify due to my immediate duties; therefore, I would ask the Speaker to hold off on declaring the results until the issue can be reflected in this light.

The Referendum Act does not attach constitutional or legislative power to the outcome of the referendum and as such should not be a constitutional amendment. Its sole purpose is to allow a popular consultation on the matter, returning a majority for either the retention of the monarchy or the advancement of a republic, so that the Chamber shall be made aware of the public's disposition. That is all it requests and delivers. I did consider attaching a section that would explicitly outline that the Chamber should then legislate to reflect the popular will, but considering every previous proposal has been drowned by incessant - and, if I might be frank, irrelevant - legalese, I felt it sufficient to simply let the people have their say. It is my hope that the honourable gentlemen here assembled - exercising their prerogatives in the national interest and accountable to their constituents - shall acknowledge the outcome of the referendum and legislate accordingly.

In light of this, I request that the bill be reconsidered as a simple legislative motion, not a constitutional amendment.

Supreme-General
Xavier-Pierre Florian Thaddée
GKLS DSO POM FPS
Chief of the Defence Staff​