Edge of Europe - A Belgian Interactive AAR

[NikoHoI3]

A lawyer enters the Chamber

"I would like to announce that Monsieur Thibault Potiquet has passed away peacefully in his sleep at the age of seventy-five. That is all."

 

[Harpsichord]

Senate Based on Population: Aye
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Aye
Child Labor Act of 1876: Aye

 

[viola]

Senate Based on Population: Yes
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain
Child Labor Act of 1876: Yes. This act is utterly insufficient and can't stop the outrageous institution of Child Labor. Unfortunately it's also the only thing we can get under this Reactionary government.

The opposition to a truly Democratic, and therefore proportional, Upper House shows the true face of the Conservative party of Belgium: Authoritarian, Anti-Democratic, Aristocratic and unrepentant Beauffortist. The decision to allow these dangerous Absolutists into the government is simply disastrous! We have already seen what happen when the Conservatives are in power, a coup is inevitable in the long run!
The Red Legion will remain watchful and shall be ready to defend Democracy from any Reactionary plot. The Belgian workers will not let these deluded aristocrats to take away their hard earned rights.

- Carl Coppens, Socialist representative

 

[DensleyBlair]

Senate Based on Population: Yes
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain
Child Labor Act of 1876: Yes. This act is utterly insufficient and can't stop the outrageous institution of Child Labor. Unfortunately it's also the only thing we can get under this Reactionary government.

The opposition to a truly Democratic, and therefore proportional, Upper House shows the true face of the Conservative party of Belgium: Authoritarian, Anti-Democratic, Aristocratic and unrepentant Beauffortist. The decision to allow these dangerous Absolutists into the government is simply disastrous! We have already seen what happen when the Conservatives are in power, a coup is inevitable in the long run!
The Red Legion will remain watchful and shall be ready to defend Democracy from any Reactionary plot. The Belgian workers will not let these deluded aristocrats to take away their hard earned rights.

- Carl Coppens, Socialist representative

Reactionary government? Sir, are you and I living in the same country?

~Willem Bentinck, Minister of Justice

 

[G.K.]

Once again, I warn you all that changing nonpartisan Senate to yet another chamber with less power is dangerous. The idealism of our left wing colleagues is adorable, but leads them to rather unwise actions that may damage Belgium for years.

Regulating whether 15 year old can work is also unwise, unnecessary, and may put many families in poverty. Yet, I agree that kids should spend their time in school or with their parents rather than operating machines. I have my serious doubts about this, and when the voting on this bill starts, I'll leave the chamber.

Mr. van Kaas's proposal has my full support.

Senate Based on Population: No
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Yes
Child Labor Act of 1876: Abstain

 

[Ab Ovo]

A lawyer enters the Chamber

"I would like to announce that Monsieur Thibault Potiquet has passed away peacefully in his sleep at the age of seventy-five. That is all."

When the news reaches him, Herriot observes a moment of silence for his former opponent.

Senate Based on Population: Nay
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain
Child Labor Act of 1876: Aye

~Isidore Herriot,

Deputy of the Regional Assembly of Wallonia
Minister Emeritus of Wallonia
Comte de Braine-l'Alleud

 

[theAhawk]

Senate Based on Population: No

"If you're going to do this damn silly thing, don't do it in this damn silly way." ~ Captain Luc Poisson

 

[DensleyBlair]

"If you're going to do this damn silly thing, don't do it in this damn silly way." ~ Captain Luc Poisson

((Are you quite sure about that? ))

 

[Dyranum]

Senate Based on Population: Yes
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Yes
Child Labor Act of 1876: Yes

 

[Somberg]

I am bewildered at the number of abstentions on the revised constitution proposal. If you want a more organized constitution vote for it. If you want to keep the constitution as it is then vote against it. This proposal is non-partisan in nature, it benefits no one but the people of Belgium and does not intend to change the function of the government. As such, it should not be treated as if it did. Should you disagree with the contents of the Constitution then feel free to propose an amendment that would remedy it, but please, do not abstain on this proposal because of such disagreements. It is important that we have an organized and clear document as the foundation for our nation and no one can deny this.

~ Christiaan Loewen, Deputy for Antwerp and Leader of the BSU

 

[ThunderHawk3]

((As far as I'm aware, this should also be being voted upon.))

((Whoops. Sorry, entirely my fault. I'll put it up next time around.))

 

[DensleyBlair]

((Whoops. Sorry, entirely my fault. I'll put it up next time around.))

((No worries. ))

 

[Revan529]

Senate Based on Population: Yes
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain
Child Labor Act of 1876: Yes. This act is utterly insufficient and can't stop the outrageous institution of Child Labor. Unfortunately it's also the only thing we can get under this Reactionary government.

The opposition to a truly Democratic, and therefore proportional, Upper House shows the true face of the Conservative party of Belgium: Authoritarian, Anti-Democratic, Aristocratic and unrepentant Beauffortist. The decision to allow these dangerous Absolutists into the government is simply disastrous! We have already seen what happen when the Conservatives are in power, a coup is inevitable in the long run!
The Red Legion will remain watchful and shall be ready to defend Democracy from any Reactionary plot. The Belgian workers will not let these deluded aristocrats to take away their hard earned rights.

- Carl Coppens, Socialist representative

I find it far more worrisome that you are instructing a radical militia to "remain watchful" due to the Conservatives, along with many Centrists, opposing a highly radical move by an otherwise moderate Prime Minister; furthermore, maintaining the Senate as is is by no means anti-democratic or authoritarian, for it is merely preserving the rights of the Prime Minister and our Sovereign to appoint the most qualified men for the job; Does Monsieur Coppens prefer elected demagogues to capable appointees, or perhaps he has Senatorial ambitions himself?

I will give your comment about this League being nothing more than a bunch of "absolutists" no more credence than I would the rest of your radical... spiel, I believe the word is. Your fearmongering is both pathetic and worrisome, and I fear indicative that the left is still, after a term in government, not ready to assume the helm of this nation.

I would like to finish this brief statement by saying this; the Conservative League has no militia group at the ready to "protect the rights of workers," nor does the Centrist Alliance. To my knowledge, only the socialists, the communists, and the separatists maintain such vile organisations.

~ Marechal Jean-Joseph de St Sebastien, Baron de Harfleur and Minister of War

 

[DensleyBlair]

Senate Based on Population: Nay
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Aye
Child Labor Act of 1876: Aye

~Willem Bentinck, Minister of Justice

 

[Gen. Marshall]

Senate Based on Population: Nay
Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Aye
Child Labor Act of 1876: Aye

I must once again remind people that the constitutional revision is merely a matter of different wording. The content of the Constitution stays exactly the same. I see no reason to vote against the proposal.

~ Gen. Wilhelm van Stern

 

[ThunderHawk3]

((Some people have been asking me exactly what the Based on Population reform will do if it passes [I haven't take a tally but a spot check says it's failing right now]. In the absence of other information, I assume that the only change will be that Senators will be elected directly by the population rather than appointed and that they will allocated in proportion to population rather than equal numbers from each of the Belgian provinces. Other provisions, such as the current constitutional rules about how the senate conducts business, the size of the senate, and the requirement that its members remain nonpartisan, would presumably remain the same.))

 

[atomicsoda]

Senate Based on Population: Yes This is fine for a bougeoise reform but the workers demand legal trade unions and basic rights and will exercise their rights one way or another despite the current reactionary administration and its oppression of workers organizations.

Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain, I will not reaffirm this constitution but I will not oppose this reorganization. Its passage is guaranteed and I must say I deeply resent the leader of my party rudely telling people not to abstain on this vote. I rarely abstain but this vote is one where an abstention makes a lot of sense as this bill does absolutely nothing. Mr. Loewen and many others abstain on actual bills frequently where it is important to support or oppose. I have never heard Loewn criticize people for that nor has Loewen been criticized by me or others for his many abstentions. I do not understand his obsession with this bill, which has no effect and faces no opposition. Our leader shows more passion for this administrative rewording than fighting for the workers and I have lost confidence in his leadership of the BSU. He is a career politition who has lost touch with the workers and the people as shown by this obsession with this bill that delivers nothing to the people. Why did he say nothing of those who abstained on the Child Labour Act? Why is the political leadership of all parties so focused on this constitutional revision the elites drew up behind closed doors and foisted on the people.

Child Labour Act of 1876: Yes A very minor step for basic reform.

Simon Giroux - Deputy for Charleroi - Belgian Social Union

 

[unmerged(718634)]

Senate Based on Population: Yes This is fine for a bougeoise reform but the workers demand legal trade unions and basic rights and will exercise their rights one way or another despite the current reactionary administration and its oppression of workers organizations.

Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain, I will not reaffirm this constitution but I will not oppose this reorganization. Its passage is guaranteed and I must say I deeply resent the leader of my party rudely telling people not to abstain on this vote. I rarely abstain but this vote is one where an abstention makes a lot of sense as this bill does absolutely nothing. Mr. Loewen and many others abstain on actual bills frequently where it is important to support or oppose. I have never heard Loewn criticize people for that nor has Loewen been criticized by me or others for his many abstentions. I do not understand his obsession with this bill, which has no effect and faces no opposition. Our leader shows more passion for this administrative rewording than fighting for the workers and I have lost confidence in his leadership of the BSU. He is a career politition who has lost touch with the workers and the people as shown by this obsession with this bill that delivers nothing to the people. Why did he say nothing of those who abstained on the Child Labour Act? Why is the political leadership of all parties so focused on this constitutional revision the elites drew up behind closed doors and foisted on the people.

Child Labour Act of 1876: Yes A very minor step for basic reform.

Simon Giroux - Deputy for Charleroi - Belgian Social Union

Mijnheer Giroux I don't believe Mr. Loewen's actions have constituted a lack of support for the Child Labour Act. Since arriving in Brussels he has been fighting for reform. Yet at this point he made statement in defense of Abstentions of a Advisory Bill that will serve to improve the severely flawed language of the Current Constitution that has already brought upon serious consequences. Inability to understand our Constitution has and can again lead to needless debate that will continue to distract us from the true Socialist cause for decades on.

~ de Vos

 

[Somberg]

Senate Based on Population: Yes This is fine for a bougeoise reform but the workers demand legal trade unions and basic rights and will exercise their rights one way or another despite the current reactionary administration and its oppression of workers organizations.

Proposal to Revise the Belgian Constitution: Abstain, I will not reaffirm this constitution but I will not oppose this reorganization. Its passage is guaranteed and I must say I deeply resent the leader of my party rudely telling people not to abstain on this vote. I rarely abstain but this vote is one where an abstention makes a lot of sense as this bill does absolutely nothing. Mr. Loewen and many others abstain on actual bills frequently where it is important to support or oppose. I have never heard Loewn criticize people for that nor has Loewen been criticized by me or others for his many abstentions. I do not understand his obsession with this bill, which has no effect and faces no opposition. Our leader shows more passion for this administrative rewording than fighting for the workers and I have lost confidence in his leadership of the BSU. He is a career politition who has lost touch with the workers and the people as shown by this obsession with this bill that delivers nothing to the people.

Child Labour Act of 1876: Yes A very minor step for basic reform.

Simon Giroux - Deputy for Charleroi - Belgian Social Union

I believe you blowing my defense of the revision of the Constitution out of proportion. Ever since I entered Parliament I have been fighting for the interests of the workers, and I am offended that you would believe that I suddenly lost touch with them. As Mijnheer de Vos stated, it is important to ensure that we have a clear constitution that will not distract from our fight for the workers through its vague and confusing language. I do not believe it is wrong for me to ensure that no one abstains on something that really does not deserve to be abstained on. This does benefit the people, however, as it benefits the people to have a clear and well organized constitution with which they may refer to. Once this measure passes, I can assure you that I shall resume my call for social reform that will be beneficial to the interests of the workers and Belgium as a whole.

~ Christiaan Loewen, Deputy for Antwerp and Leader of the BSU

 

[G.K.]

The radicalism coming from BSU, whose deputies speak of their militias being ready to fight the legitimate, moderately comservative government they often call "reactionary", and call for legalization of trade unions, which often serve as terrorist cells against industries, clergy and innocent people are more than slightly worrying.

It's not surprising that the socialist movement is isolated in Belgian politics, and as long as the movement itself can't stay on a way of peace, it shouldn't be allowed to participate at all. Political terrorism, no matter how noble target it seeks, should be banned from Belgium forever.