easiest nation to form Italy with?

[unmerged(463193)]

what's the easiest nation to form italy with?

i've never played in the italian region so i don't know.

 

[PlayerHOI]

Should be Milan.

 

[BlargHonk]

Milan. If things go well, you get protection from the emperor(usually Austria), or you could ally with France. Your earliest rival is Venice, who usually gets curb stomped the Otto-blob, and to the south is a target rich environment of one/two province minors, with the only threat in that region being Naples. In theory, you could easily for Italy in a few decades... as long as one of the many Mediterranean blobs doesn't kick your sandcastle over, conquer Rome, or form a big coalition.

 

[irgendwas1984]

Mhh in my games Milan ofte gets beaten from Savoy or Tuskany (wich blobs then) eventually one of them?

 

[WeissRaben]

Milan, then Tuscany. Both start with one needed core, so their conquests can be shorter. Someone like Savoy, on the other hand, needs to start from the beginning.

 

[Porsenna]

I vote Tuscany - start with two rich provinces, one of which you need to form italy with, and borders 3 of the other 4 you need to own and core in order to form it with. I just started a Tuscany game today and conquered and cored Siena and Ancona within the first 4 years, and I just fabricated a claim on Rome...

Also if you get luck Cosimo will last a while -he's a GREAT leader 6-5-5. He managed to last this long... I'm hoping he'll last long enough for me to found a dynasty with him by flipping over to monarchy.

 

[unmerged(463193)]

thanks guys

 

[CharlieSheen123]

Tuscany

 

[desiriel]

I agree with the previous posters. Both Milan and Tuscany seem both solid choices. I got Italy unified with Venice but it was a real pain as I had to struggle with all my neighbours and get and aggression antipathy all over the Mediterranean.
From time to time a Coalition going from to the Ottomans to the Creek tries to destroy me.

 

[scarletrose]

While I do agree that Milan and Tuscany are the two countries that have more advantages when it comes to forming Italy I need to point out that among the Italian nations Venice is the only true European superpower.
It's not hard at all to grab all the provinces you need to form Italy as Venice.
On the other hand as Venice you have one of the best center of trades as a capital, great naval and trade power, a couple of vassals, Crete and a capital that is pretty much impossible to take if you have a decent navy (and as Venice you have a decent navy for sure).
The real problem with Venice is that it's not part of the HRE and you will probably never be. Italy has a national idea that gives you bonus authority so.. being in HRE is pretty good.
On the other hand before you become Italy you will probably gain stradioti and venetian inquisition.
Also, if you want to take that route you can turn Venice and future Italy in a colonial power, something other Italian countries will have trouble with.

so... IMHO... Milan and Tuscany makes it slightly easier to form Italy and gives you an HRE Italy.
Venice gives you a far more promising base for your future Italy. once you become Italy you have probably some colonies, full control of both coasts of the Adriatic sea, and almost full control of the Mediterranean trade.

 

[Mgoblue201]

I played a quick game as Tuscany based on the recommendations in this thread and expanding at the outset isn't too difficult. Cosimo's stats should easily allow you to field a competent general and gain an early tech advantage if you focus on military. Combined with the 6,000 man army, it should be possible to annex a few of the small neighbors easily. Even Naples, for all its size, is quite beatable. My alliance with Austria made things a lot easier. I did have one close call when Savoy declared war on Milan, whom I was attempting to vassalize, and brought in England and (my former ally) Aragon into the fight, but Austria answered my call and saved the day.

 

[CharlieSheen123]

I played a quick game as Tuscany based on the recommendations in this thread and expanding at the outset isn't too difficult. Cosimo's stats should easily allow you to field a competent general and gain an early tech advantage if you focus on military. Combined with the 6,000 man army, it should be possible to annex a few of the small neighbors easily. Even Naples, for all its size, is quite beatable. My alliance with Austria made things a lot easier. I did have one close call when Savoy declared war on Milan, whom I was attempting to vassalize, and brought in England and (my former ally) Aragon into the fight, but Austria answered my call and saved the day.

Be very careful when vassalizing Milan. France usually comes after Milan --

Also make sure that Austria has a land path to France for the eventual war because if their troops can't reach the warzone then you're done. My recommendation: alliance, marriage, etc with Spain/Aragon ASAP, then slowly start working on England with relations to get them allied also. There's gonna be the eventual France war bc France wants Savoy and Milan and then you


In fact, unless you can predict 15 years ahead, you should be using your manpower up each year to build troops. I think you recoup like 2-3k a year so build 3 units every year and start saving them up. You'll need at least 40-50 standing armies to get you started (if castille, aragon, england all join) - maybe less if Austria can join.

NOTE: Lombardia has very strong defensive terrain. Either keep a defensive stack in there before the war, or just like... well whatever you do, Do NOT attack a big stack that's sieging there because you'll get like -3 from terrain and -1 from river and that's gonna hurt even at 100% discipline. Not to mention that the sneaky A.I. likes to pick unit types that have like 5 defense and only 1 attack per stat (eg Landsknecht), because they know they're just gonna outmaneouver you and you'll end up having to attack -_- This is the Italian province where your jaw drops as your stack of 40's morale plummets in combat against a stack of 25

So on that note, pick all-out offensive units.

 

[Viperswhip]

Also, the key to winning in this game is to field a navy bigger than, well, England. A big navy means they have to attack you through the North, and not land troops everywhere. Easy to focus your defense.

 

[Bagelking37]

In one of my games, Venice is making the most progress (Italy isn't going to form, though, I'm certain). In another, it is Naples. With Naples, you should wait until Castile gets into a PU with Aragon, thereby releasing you from the PU with Aragon. Shouldn't be too long until that happens. Only issue is, sometimes Castile's AI may not do the decision in the event where it gets into a PU with Aragon, so there's something to note. You also may end up beating Castile back (you may have noticed that they seem to love to fight), which you don't want to do, so don't help Aragon at all if you choose Naples.

 

[unmerged(461810)]

I found it easy with venice. Take first northern part not in hre (papal state) and then naple. Naple is very week. You need to take a break there and make sure that people forgot you were expending. After that you go for milan when the emperor is busy at war.

 

[Rabid]

Tuscany is probably the best if you want a really fast formation, because of the fantastic starting ruler and the earliest access to Rome and Urbino. Getting that core of 5 easily defensible provinces in the middle of Italy with only Siena having HRE penalties really helps.

 

[TheChronoMaster]

I'd say Milan -- you start with the most difficult territory necessary for Italy (Lombardy), and you have easy access to the other necessary provinces within the HRE through Diplo-annexation, if you focus on vassalizing the local minors. After that, a quick war with the Pope for Rome, and you can have Italy with relative ease.

 

[Mgoblue201]

Be very careful when vassalizing Milan. France usually comes after Milan --

Also make sure that Austria has a land path to France for the eventual war because if their troops can't reach the warzone then you're done. My recommendation: alliance, marriage, etc with Spain/Aragon ASAP, then slowly start working on England with relations to get them allied also. There's gonna be the eventual France war bc France wants Savoy and Milan and then you


In fact, unless you can predict 15 years ahead, you should be using your manpower up each year to build troops. I think you recoup like 2-3k a year so build 3 units every year and start saving them up. You'll need at least 40-50 standing armies to get you started (if castille, aragon, england all join) - maybe less if Austria can join.

NOTE: Lombardia has very strong defensive terrain. Either keep a defensive stack in there before the war, or just like... well whatever you do, Do NOT attack a big stack that's sieging there because you'll get like -3 from terrain and -1 from river and that's gonna hurt even at 100% discipline. Not to mention that the sneaky A.I. likes to pick unit types that have like 5 defense and only 1 attack per stat (eg Landsknecht), because they know they're just gonna outmaneouver you and you'll end up having to attack -_- This is the Italian province where your jaw drops as your stack of 40's morale plummets in combat against a stack of 25

So on that note, pick all-out offensive units.

Austria and France already share a border due to the event where they split Burgundy. I do have a question, though: does diplo-annexing a vassal trigger the unlawful territory event? If so, is there a way to take imperial territory without triggering it?

 

[Rabid]

I will rescind my earlier statement, having actually tried it Tuscany isn't as good as I thought since Cosimo di Medici is ahistorically old and seems to die almost immediately in every game (he's about 20 years older than he was IRL).

 

[fire_em]

Diplo annex isen't that easy in italy you have pay attention on who is rival against who.If you ally with someones rival you get a hit to relation. I had to conquer all of north italy as Milan. I can form Italy but i like the Milans national ideas more so i haven't. Even though 15 bonus to inf is dam good. The way i played it i had to attack when someone is at war and then wait for my aggretion lv to fall. When someone forms a coalition against you it's time to cool down for a while.