early coalitions

[Rexos]

I'm playing as Daimyo, again, cause I want to form japan asap but in a also good state, without loans, with right techs and ideas, ecc......but......
I played with Uesugi and did it in 61 years, really not that good, but I stated every regions and I had no loans, all was fine, I tried again and I could have done it by 1475-80, but I had way too much loans, no states, no manpower and Ashikaga and the other clans were all against me for the AE( this was the very first time the shogun declared war on me, and I could not stand their 35k vs my 10k, and all the forts) so I started again but......what can I say....

https://imgur.com/a/JVTM4

A coalition formed in 1447....and they declared war on me too....I don't care about the armies but I can't make separated peaces this way, that means less provinces can be taken, and less money, a lot less....i just want to expand quickly but in the smooth way....is there something I should do to avoid this? the watch is watching, I have to be quick, so I can't just wait for the AE to go away....should ally my neighbors, so the coalition does not form, and then attack their allies and kick them all out? I could take less provinces after the war but I only took 3 provinces and I didn't even fully annexed anyone.....if I'm greedy, the coalitions forms, if I wait the time ends, if I take less provinces the truces make me wait....and so the time ends.....I have only 2 allies, cause I don't want to wait the truces when I'll be wanting to annex them......what should I do....?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

The fastest way to take any nation to 0 AE is "full annexation".

General strat is to ally a group of them, take enough land from others so that they can't all help the shogun, then have enough that you + allies beat shogun + remaining subjects.

Try not to take land off non-cobelligerents unless you're going all-in on everyone but allies very soon. You can also create truce with one block of enemies, take land from another, and be allied to a 3rd and just declare right when truce ends to keep them split, but Japan is too small for that. Just kill everything after first couple wars.

 

[Rexos]

That's what I though, but....if I kill all the clans in the north before the coalition fires, in 3 years(just to say), then the AE will be so high that will make the clans of the south to make a coalition.....I would like to eat everyone and then beat the shogun, but they are so king towars their daimyos, and won't let me be so quick....and if I not take lands from non-cobelligerents, as I said the truce will make wait too long, the best would not making the coalitions form at all

 

[TheMeInTeam]

1. Ally 3-4 nations
2. Take land directly from war leader only from 2-3 target nations (fleece others for cash), or whatever gets you close to coalition range.
3. Declare on shogun which forces your allies in. Take Kyoto/full annex Ashikaga.
4. Your allies now go independent, and you get any Ashikaga vassals that were loyal in that war as vassals. You can now turn on your allies, if they don't already break the alliance.

Coalitions shouldn't be forming unless you're doing something strange.

 

[Rexos]

Coalitions shouldn't be forming unless you're doing something strange.

like....taking lands....from the clans that....are supposed to fight....

 

[atwix]

what should I do....?

see how much ducats one warscore is, when offering peace to coalition. make sure all nations that can attack you are in coalition. loan up 100% warscore in ducats, offer it to coalition.

15 years od truce with all, and you go bankrupt the day after peace deal. then you got 10 years to burn AE, make claims, and prepare for some SERIOUS Japanese mayhem.

read coalition guide linked in my signature also, it gives tons of tips how to avoid them.

 

[Rexos]

see how much ducats one warscore is, when offering peace to coalition. make sure all nations that can attack you are in coalition. loan up 100% warscore in ducats, offer it to coalition.

15 years od truce with all, and you go bankrupt the day after peace deal. then you got 10 years to burn AE, make claims, and prepare for some SERIOUS Japanese mayhem.

read coalition guide linked in my signature also, it gives tons of tips how to avoid them.

So you are suggesting me to....kill myself to reborn from the ashes stronger than before?

I gave a try to this new strategy(for me)
https://imgur.com/a/CRccg

and it could be great but.......the damn call for peace is now killing me with tons of WE

Anyway I'll try that later

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Here's a quick run from current patch:



Grabbed a few allies, used -50% AE from CB early on, then just all-in took nations out in separate peace deals after my ally Uesegi declared war for emperor. I beat them to Kyoto so we stayed subjects + lost alliance when Uesegi peaced out. Everyone left in Japan is in coalition range...but also in a truce. I just annexed former ally hosokawa, and beating down Uesegi should make anything the shogun tries to do before I come for him myself irrelevant.

Korea has ~60 AE, a lot of Japan is closer to 200. Doesn't matter. Ming only has 22ish AE. I had to use mercs but thanks to taking money from targets no loans yet.

If you start as a larger daimyo this is a bit easier since you don't have those trash level 3 forts with a force limit of 4 or 5 to play around at the start and you have less development to conquer.

 

[Rexos]

but you can't do separate peace when attacking the shogun....

used -50% AE from CB early on

....wat?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

but you can't do separate peace when attacking the shogun....

....wat?

If you have claim the unique daimyo CB reduces AE.

Uesegi declared for emperor while I was already fighting a few nations, which prevented them joining. That's probably why Uesegi declared actually, it saw that several daimyo couldn't join since they were at war with me.

I responded to that by occupying Kyoto and annexing the daimyo in separate war with me, then helping Uesegi win the war. I was shogun with no Daimyo by 1476 or so. Korea had ~80 AE, Ashikaga had 330 AE when they got annexed, Ming had about 25 AE.

No coalitions were able to form due to declaring out of truce and/or too few potential members.

 

[Rexos]

I started talking about coalitions, but the real problem was ashikaga, I couldn't annex too many provinces at once, so I started occupying them....all of them and I kept doing that until the call for peace gave +0,50 WE every month, then I occupied something like 36 provinces and I took them all, the rebels killed each other so I had to deal with only a few of them, Ashikaga had only 4 provinces and there were left 2 other daymios....I did what I wanted to by 1469-70....got the tributary from ming after 5 years(the had 150 AE) and then straight to Korea.....thanks to everyone

Anyway I always used the Sengoku CB, but I was so fast that nothing could contain the AE....
I really don't understand how someone could do it in before 1465 at least