Vladimir II said:
I think it will be the smallest province in hoi2, the zone A was delimited by the curve done by the actual border.
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
I think it will be the smallest province in hoi2, the zone A was delimited by the curve done by the actual border.
If you want, I have a complete cabinet for Pindus and am working on techteams and leaders- would that be useful for you? 
Also, I'm interested as to whether we'll have the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia as a puppet of Germany.
And *ahem* any way we can include the Jewish Socialist Bund in an event in this? Would certainly make governmental changes in Lithuania and Poland much more interesting!
Also, I'm interested as to whether we'll have the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia as a puppet of Germany.
And *ahem* any way we can include the Jewish Socialist Bund in an event in this? Would certainly make governmental changes in Lithuania and Poland much more interesting!
Crush3r said:
Quoting myself here.
mehmet: That would be absolutely great! Send them to Vladimir, or post them here when you are finished. BTW: You can ask one of the members here to modify the map for your mod if you wish. That way you can add more provs to Tannu Tuva and Mongolia, so they are more fun to play.
Vlad: I closed it because there were no new people likely to participate in the debate. Plus we kind of agreed about the approach to claims and divisions.
Last edited:
Rush3r: The claim on Klagenfurt will remian. It will look stupid, and incompatible with Yugoslav country shape, but it will remain, defined in scenario file, and revolt.txt.
General_Grant: Indeed, you are right. I only made a funny comment regarding Rush3r's vote.
mehmet12: Of course we will appreciate your help. Just send me all the data you have.
franzer: this map of Trieste from Wikipedia could help. Indeed it is a small part of land, but we could expand it a little to the West, in Italy. Basically, the province will remain Italian, only if Yugoslav player decides to claim it, and USSR support that claim, and start WWIII. I have made the flag and shield for independent Trieste, but we will need ministers, leaders techteams (not to o many, as it is a small region). , Could you find those things, franzer?
General_Grant: Indeed, you are right. I only made a funny comment regarding Rush3r's vote.
mehmet12: Of course we will appreciate your help. Just send me all the data you have.
franzer: this map of Trieste from Wikipedia could help. Indeed it is a small part of land, but we could expand it a little to the West, in Italy. Basically, the province will remain Italian, only if Yugoslav player decides to claim it, and USSR support that claim, and start WWIII. I have made the flag and shield for independent Trieste, but we will need ministers, leaders techteams (not to o many, as it is a small region). , Could you find those things, franzer?
Vladimir II said:franzer: this map of Trieste from Wikipedia could help. Indeed it is a small part of land, but we could expand it a little to the West, in Italy. Basically, the province will remain Italian, only if Yugoslav player decides to claim it, and USSR support that claim, and start WWIII. I have made the flag and shield for independent Trieste, but we will need ministers, leaders techteams (not to o many, as it is a small region). , Could you find those things, franzer?
I have found the 'proofs' of the yugoslavian claim on Klagenfurt: 10 october 1920 happened the Carinthian Plebiscite:
-59.1 % votes for Austria;
-40.9 % votes for Yugoslavia;
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carinthian_Plebiscite)
After 8 may 1945 "Tito's partisan army marched into Carinthia from Yugoslavia, proclaiming Yugoslavian military control. British forces rolled into Carinthia and brought the Yugoslav control in southern Carinthia to an end on 20th May 1945".
"Yugoslavia pursued its claim against Carinthia until 1949, when the Allies overruled Yugoslavia's claims at the Paris conference in June of that year and proclaimed Austria's borders were to remain the same as at the beginning of 1938".
For Trieste: the situation is complicated, in 1947 was created the Free territory of Trieste under English/American control (zone A) and the zone B under yugoslavian control,in 1953 there was nearly the military conflict (from 1949 Italy was in the NATO), in 1954 Tito accepted the passing of zone A to Italy in change of the recognition of the yugoslavian administration on the zone B but the sovereignty remained Italian, in 1975 with the treaty of Osimo Italy accepted the Yugoslavian sovereignty on the zone B.
If you want represent the situation historically Istria must have an other province the Zone B, for the zone A I think that it can be expanded until the Natisone River but I think is better represent the Italy-Yugoslavia border following the Isonzo River, however I think that the possibility that URSS supported Yugoslavia in 1953 is low, in this period the situation of the red army wasn't good.
Why don't make a 1945 scenario (And the Cold war mod is in development...) ?
For the ministers, leaders, techteams I can search but is very complicated.
Last edited:
All right. It appears that the referendum was in 1920, not in 1918, as I said, and that the difference was arround 10% percent, not 2-4% as i said, but still,it is not a big difference, and is suficient for a claim on Klagenfurt.
About Trieste: as you said, zone B was under YPA control, so it should be merged with Capodistria province (as too many microscopic provinces is not good solution). And as you sad, zone A had its souvereignty. So, only zone A could be an independent province/nation, with its flag, shield and government. Which will later become a part of Italy.
Indeed, USSR would not support YUG in 1953, as Stalin was still in rule, and Tito and Stalin were not in good relations after. 1948, and Yugoslavia was not in alliance with USSR. However, before 1948, YUG and SOV were allied, so in HoI engine, if YUG declares war on ITA, or vice versa, they will automatically pull all other allied countries in the war, and since YUG is allied with SOV, BUL, HUN, ROM, POL, CZE, DDR, while ITA with ENG, USA, FRA, BRD, HOL, BEL, LUX, NOR, DEN, CAn, AST, NZL, etc. it will become WWIII in a moment.
I know the issue about copyright. Well, you can at least give us a list of ministers, leaders, techteams by names, and we will find images for them.
About Trieste: as you said, zone B was under YPA control, so it should be merged with Capodistria province (as too many microscopic provinces is not good solution). And as you sad, zone A had its souvereignty. So, only zone A could be an independent province/nation, with its flag, shield and government. Which will later become a part of Italy.
Indeed, USSR would not support YUG in 1953, as Stalin was still in rule, and Tito and Stalin were not in good relations after. 1948, and Yugoslavia was not in alliance with USSR. However, before 1948, YUG and SOV were allied, so in HoI engine, if YUG declares war on ITA, or vice versa, they will automatically pull all other allied countries in the war, and since YUG is allied with SOV, BUL, HUN, ROM, POL, CZE, DDR, while ITA with ENG, USA, FRA, BRD, HOL, BEL, LUX, NOR, DEN, CAn, AST, NZL, etc. it will become WWIII in a moment.
I know the issue about copyright. Well, you can at least give us a list of ministers, leaders, techteams by names, and we will find images for them.
Vladimir II said:
under Yugoslavian control but not under Yugoslavian sovereignty, so Zone B should be italian territory but occupied by Yugoslavian Army, I mean Italian Flag with upon the Yugoslavian flag
Vladimir II said:
OK but the control of this 'event'/conflict should belong to the URSS, if URSS wanted the war then War otherwise URSS would have said to Tito calm down yourself, idem for Italy the control belong to USA and UK, the WW3 could have declared only by URSS or USA and maybe UK not from Yugoslavia or Italy.
I do not mind of creating both zones. But only if mumia can add those two small provinces. I will not pressure anything.
And we will program ITA and YUG AI not to cause WWIII.
And we will program ITA and YUG AI not to cause WWIII.
People, Trieste is too small to click on. If it's going to be implemented, it should have a chunk of Eastern Venezia. Zone B is already well represented in Capodistria and Pola. At the end of the war, borders will be Trieste (ITA) - Capodistria (Koper - YUG). War will be started if SOV or USA decide to allow the participant countries to engage in military action (low probability).
EDIT: And YUG should claim Trieste from 1936, along with the claims on the other 2 provs. That will make the Klagenfurt claim fit aesthetically:
EDIT: And YUG should claim Trieste from 1936, along with the claims on the other 2 provs. That will make the Klagenfurt claim fit aesthetically:
Last edited:
I think this is better:
I have used the rivers Isonzo and Natisone (drawn roughly)
I have used the rivers Isonzo and Natisone (drawn roughly)
Last edited:
Good idea but maybe Natisone river should be moved a little to the west to make Trieste clickable.franzer said:I think this is better:
I have used the rivers Isonzo and Natisone
Sincerely, I would support Rush3r's proposal, as I agree with Rush3r's arguments.
mumia said:
Consider that The province of Trieste delimited by the Natisone is already an enormous exaggeration
franzer said:
Post-WWI Yugoslav intentions on Trieste included a larger area, but the refrained from claiming anything larger than that strip after WWII, so it's justifiable as a good compromise.
Considering that we have finished discussion about Austria (just add river Mura arround Klagenfurt) and Switzerland, and we made provinces Fiume, Trieste, Capodistria and Pola, while waiting Frak+Frei's map of Germany, should we then finish Italian provinces, to end the discussion about Souteastern Europe?
Again I agree with you. I think that Rush3r's solution for Trieste would be good.Crush3r said:
In that case, franzer, could you post again your map of Italy, so that mumia could see your changes? Thank you.
Crush3r said:
Consider that this game is from 1936, with my solution we consider all the territory considered in the treaty of Rapallo of the first world war
So Trieste in borders:Vladimir II said:
So plan should be:Vladimir II said:
1. Italy
2. Germany
3. Benelux?
And then I think I should start draw map with IDs.
In August and first half of September I will have much less time to work on map (work/unwanted exams in September). In second half of September I should work on 100%.