E3 2012: New Expansion for Hearts of Iron III Announced!

[Alex_brunius]

Complexity is one thing, the fact whether the game's features are designed with the AI in mind is sth different.

....

Player-only features are a disaster for the AI. They sound cool on paper, but they don't make the game more challenging.

Well a overly complex game with loads of features often is the same thing as a game with loads of player-only feature. Just say'n

I would guess a feature takes about 3 times as much time to develop if the AI also has to be able to use it 100%, so by logic that should mean you can either have a game without AI, or one with 1/3:ed as many features but full AI challange. This is ofcourse just an estimation, but I base it on claims from Paradox that about half the HoI budget is spent on AI and still many features are player only.

 

[Cybvep]

Strategy games without the AI are good as long as they are MP-only, but this is not case here. You know just as well as I do that the most common complaints are AI-based one way or another ("The Soviet Union is defeated in 6 months - the game is broken!", "Germany is stuck in Norway", "Nation X won't join my faction despite having 200 relations and being fully influenced!", "Why does the UK perform suicidal amphibious invasions?", "Japan is passive in the Pacific", "The UK leaves its ports undefended!", "France doesn't defend Maginot Line provinces properly!" etc.).

 

[Alex_brunius]

I agree about the importance of AI.

That's also why I would rather see expansions over a new HoI game, because the AI doesn't have to be developed from scratch but can be refined gradually from a decent level

 

[Paglia]

Anyone knows when the Development diaries will begin? There is a "once a week" disclosure of content on Facebook but not much to put under your teeth. Well nto enough to feed the Ogre in me :blush:

 

[plasticpanzers]

There was a post by Podcast from PI that he is on vacation (I expect most if not all of PI are)
for 2 weeks in Sweden. Expect him to review the current 3.062 patch and TFH after that i
suppose.

 

[Paglia]

There was a post by Podcast from PI that he is on vacation (I expect most if not all of PI are)
for 2 weeks in Sweden. Expect him to review the current 3.062 patch and TFH after that i
suppose.

OK ! Thanks !

 

[Alex_brunius]

Hmm, do you happen to know where he posted that info plasticpanzer?

 

[bomaye]

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...3.062-beta&p=14073345&highlight=#post14073345

 

[Liondrome]

A new Hearts of Iron can possibly be even more complex then the current one. (If they go the same route as happend when they went from HoI2 -> HoI3).
If that is the case then the AI will have an even harder time to keep up.

In short, an engine like you want "without limitations" would spell disaster for the AI, the reason the AI appeared to be more competent in HoI2 was because the game was so much more simple, there wasn't so many things you could do wrong...

All i would have liked to see is an engine that opens more doors for modders. But if not possible at the moment then no need to think about it. (Well, untill HOI 4 that is.)

If you don't think the current engine is moddable you need to try to mod some other strategy games, seriously!

I also think most players use counters so they don't care about unit textures really

Dude i love HOI 3. Almost 200 hours played and still loving it, also have tried many mods, hence why i would have liked to see more, did not just know earlier that the engine was limiting them. (Or the game developers that matter since some things cant be implemented.)

Also did you mean like Supreme Commander, C&C. World In Conflict, Wargame European Escalation, Total War series? And i could go on.

I do play strategy games, a lot of them, love them. ^_^

And yes i use the counters too. And i did not mean unit textures. Embarrasingly enough i meant the unit picture on production tab. (They are crap, and kind of bug me everytime when making a unit since if im going to seeing something a lot it could be atleast good looking.) Same could be said about the unit textures perhaps but i prefer the counters.

 

[keepsbreakindow]

Any word on "assume military control" coming back? Not having it takes the fun out of being a part of the allies.

 

[comsubpac]

Any word on "assume military control" coming back? Not having it takes the fun out of being a part of the allies.

its almost certainly not coming back. you can use allied objectives / ask for expeditionary forces though.

 

[keepsbreakindow]

its almost certainly not coming back. you can use allied objectives / ask for expeditionary forces though.

That's too bad and takes me out on this one. The expeditionary force thing doesn't work. Australia and New Zealand don't send any troops to the uk and it turns out to be a disjointed load of crap when playing as allies. Maybe they will wise up with 4.

 

[Alex_brunius]

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...3.062-beta&p=14073345&highlight=#post14073345

Ah thanks!

 

[bomaye]

The empty build ques/wasted IC for USA, is that related to sleeping AI or am I missing something?

 

[SuiciSpai]

more cats in diplomatic mode!

 

[No idea]

I agree about the importance of AI.

That's also why I would rather see expansions over a new HoI game, because the AI doesn't have to be developed from scratch but can be refined gradually from a decent level

I agree. There are still ridiculous things about the AI that need to be adressed (and I guess that they are not too difficult to fix). Just one example: Yesterday (FTM 3.05) I saw Rommel commanding a GAR x 3 division protecting Helsinki from an unspecified "inminent" (ironic mode off) threat while the Axis was conducting Barbarossa. A total waste of one of the best german generals.

And there are a few more exmaples of little things that should be easy to fix.

 

[ctolm]

its almost certainly not coming back. you can use allied objectives / ask for expeditionary forces though.

I have played through at least a dozen games of HOI3 in each of it's incarnations as well as some of the bigger mods and the only expeditionary force I have ever gotten was while playing as Germany when Italy sent me 1 division after the fall of France. I have tried every thing I could find that's been suggested in the forums to no effect.
Why did they get rid of it? The armies and army groups of World War II, especially on the allied side were made up of forces from multiple countries and and operations were planned out between countries. The only way at the moment to simulate that in single player (and I imagine that most players play largely in single player) is to allow the player to take charge of not just the armies of their allies but also the make up of their armies and corps.

 

[comsubpac]

I have played through at least a dozen games of HOI3 in each of it's incarnations as well as some of the bigger mods and the only expeditionary force I have ever gotten was while playing as Germany when Italy sent me 1 division after the fall of France. I have tried every thing I could find that's been suggested in the forums to no effect.
Why did they get rid of it? The armies and army groups of World War II, especially on the allied side were made up of forces from multiple countries and and operations were planned out between countries. The only way at the moment to simulate that in single player (and I imagine that most players play largely in single player) is to allow the player to take charge of not just the armies of their allies but also the make up of their armies and corps.

but nobody had full control about all forces of every allied country. yes, the objectives system needs some tweaking but it is not as bad as you describe it and most likely all we will ever get.
the old system gave the player too much power and was just one big exploit.
btw, hoi3 is a new game so it doesn't really matter how the situation was before. you can't get rid of something that never existed.

 

[keepsbreakindow]

but nobody had full control about all forces of every allied country. yes, the objectives system needs some tweaking but it is not as bad as you describe it and most likely all we will ever get.
the old system gave the player too much power and was just one big exploit.
btw, hoi3 is a new game so it doesn't really matter how the situation was before. you can't get rid of something that never existed.

No one had full control but they did have a say. Everyone was at the table discussing strategy. No one did anything without the approval of the coalition except the US in the pacific. I can't work out with an ai controlled uk on when to invade France or Italy. I either do it by myself or not. This game is virtually useless if you play as one of the allies unless they add it. I don't want to play as Germany every time, especially when I'm only fighting a fractured group of allies and the ussr. This game has a ton of potential but without this option it is useless. I can deal with a weak AI but not without this. It is quite simple really. If you don't want to use the option then don't. But add it for those of us who do.

 

[comsubpac]

No one had full control but they did have a say. Everyone was at the table discussing strategy. No one did anything without the approval of the coalition except the US in the pacific. I can't work out with an ai controlled uk on when to invade France or Italy. I either do it by myself or not. This game is virtually useless if you play as one of the allies unless they add it. I don't want to play as Germany every time, especially when I'm only fighting a fractured group of allies and the ussr. This game has a ton of potential but without this option it is useless. I can deal with a weak AI but not without this. It is quite simple really. If you don't want to use the option then don't. But add it for those of us who do.

allied objectives?