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From 939 on Franconia was a direct Imperial possession. In 1024 it was granted to Conrad the Younger and Conrad VI, the latter becoming King of Germany that same year. Why did Conrad decide make Franconia hereditary? Perhaps to give his family a base, as that Conrad had no lands of his own (I didn't notice, anway)?

Also, there are a lot of dukes of Swabia that have the same names as the dukes of Franconia, but when I look at the rulers' profiles, there is never any mention of Franconia. Did they rule both (and if so, why are they never noted as Franconian rulers), or is it just a (very big) coincidence?

Swabia Frederick I 1080-1105
Franconia Frederick I 1079-1105

Frederick I von Staufen (1050 – July 21, 1105) was duke of Swabia from 1079 to his death. He was the first ruler of Swabia of the House of Hohenstaufen. In 1089, Frederick married Agnes of Germany, daughter of Henry IV, Holy Roman Emperor. They had several sons and daughters, amongst which:

* Frederick II of Swabia (1090-1147), the father of Frederick Barbarrossa
* Conrad III, king of Germany (1093-1152)



Swabia Frederick IV 1152-1167
Franconia Frederick II 1150-1167

Frederick IV of Hohenstaufen (1145 – 1167) was duke of Swabia, succeeding his cousin, Frederick Brabarossa, Holy Roman Emperor, in 1152. He was the son of Conrad III, king of Germany (not crowned emperor) and Gertrude of Sulzbach and thus the direct heir of Germany. However, on his dying bed, Conrad III advised the electors of the Empire to choose Frederick Barbarossa instead.

See also: Dukes of Swabia family tree



Swabia Conrad II 1192-1196
Franconia Conrad II 1167-1196

Conrad II of Hohenstaufen (1173 – August 15, 1196) was duke of Swabia from 1191 to his death and Duke of Rothenburg (1188-1191). He was the fifth son of Frederick III Barbarossa and Eleanor, Countess of Burgundy and brother of Henry VI, Holy Roman Emperor. Conrad married queen Berenguela of Castile. He was murdered in Durlach in 1196.

See also: Dukes of Swabia family tree
 

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Mssr Roy said:
From 939 on Franconia was a direct Imperial possession. In 1024 it was granted to Conrad the Younger and Conrad VI, the latter becoming King of Germany that same year. Why did Conrad decide make Franconia hereditary? Perhaps to give his family a base, as that Conrad had no lands of his own (I didn't notice, anway)?

Also, there are a lot of dukes of Swabia that have the same names as the dukes of Franconia, but when I look at the rulers' profiles, there is never any mention of Franconia. Did they rule both (and if so, why are they never noted as Franconian rulers), or is it just a (very big) coincidence?
According to http://www.friesian.com/germany.htm#swabia, the only Duke who ruled both duchies was Henry I. He was also Emperor Henry III, the first Hohenstaufen Emperor.
 

Abdul Goatherd

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OK. Here comes a BIG answer attempt.

Mssr Roy said:
From 939 on Franconia was a direct Imperial possession.

Franconia was a rather special duchy that was always closely connected to the royal crown. It was, after all, the original "homeland" of the East Franks (the Austrasian domains within the German kingdom). All the other duchies were homelands of other subject tribes (Swabians, Bavarians, Saxons, Thuringians, etc.) So, there was this understanding that whomever was Duke of Franconia was especially entitled to become King of Germany (in an analogous way that the Duke of France was King of France, or the Duke of Cracow was King of Poland.)

[There is one great exception to break this rule: Eberhard (brother of Conrad I) was Duke of Franconia from 911 to 939, without claiming to be king in the election of 919 (although he did claim it in 936).]

Note: It seems like it was customary for German kings to divest themselves of their other German fiefs upon acquiring Franconia and the kingship. I am not sure whether that was a condition for election (so that the king is not too powerful) or simple expediency, but the pattern seems to hold for most.

In 1024 it was granted to Conrad the Younger and Conrad VI, the latter becoming King of Germany that same year. Why did Conrad decide make Franconia hereditary? Perhaps to give his family a base, as that Conrad had no lands of his own (I didn't notice, anway)?

I don't think Conrad the Salian held much of any lands prior to election. But he was a direct descendant of a very illustrious Franconian line.

[Briefly: Conrad's dad was Count Henry of Speyer and his uncles include Pope Gregory V and Duke Conrad I of Carinthia; his grandfather was the great Otto of Worms (Duke of Carinthia), his great-grandfather was the ill-fated Duke Conrad ("the Red") of Lorraine, and, through his great-grandmother, he was descended from Emperor Otto I. But the male line goes back much further to Salian Frankish chieftans.].

In 1024, most of the Salian family lands in Franconia (incl. Speyer, Worms, etc.) were actually in the hands of his cousin, Conrad the Younger (son of Conrad I of Carinthia). That was more-or-less confirmed at the joint election. But soon enough quarrels between the cousins led to the result that Conrad the Younger was forced to surrender everything to Conrad the Salian. Partly as a gesture of reconciliation with that side of the family, Conrad the Salian later invested Conrad the Younger with his ancestral title (as Duke Conrad II the Younger of Carinthia, 1036-39) and appointed his little brother as Bishop Bruno of Wurzburg in 1034.

So, territorially, up until his election, Conrad the Salian's only real base was his wife, Gisela von Wetterau, Duchess of Swabia (and widow of Ernest I of Swabia-Austria). But even that wasn't a very good basis for the future because she had two sons (Ernest II & Hermann IV) from her prior marriage that took precedence in Swabia over Conrad and his issue.

So, it is understandable that Conrad the Salian spent much of his kingship trying to secure his own son Henry the Black (future Henry III) a territorial inheritance. I've already mentioned how he secured Salian family lands in Franconia. But, before he died, Conrad got Henry invested with Bavaria (1026), pre-elected King of Germany & Italy (1028), pre-elected in Burgundy (1038), invested with Swabia (1038 -- after Conrad duly got rid of his stepsons) and then, on Conrad's death in 1039, Franconia itself (and that same year, Carinthia, too).

So, starting from nothing, Conrad ended up giving his son one of the largest inheritances in German Medieval history! :cool:

Also, there are a lot of dukes of Swabia that have the same names as the dukes of Franconia, but when I look at the rulers' profiles, there is never any mention of Franconia. Did they rule both (and if so, why are they never noted as Franconian rulers), or is it just a (very big) coincidence?

Henry III the Black divested himself of most of his inheritance. In other words, like the custom of so many German emperors, he held only Franconia and gave the rest of the fiefs away soon after becoming king.

Swabia was passed mostly by appointment and not inheritance, specifically:

-- in 1045, Henry the Black invests Swabia in the Count Palatine Otto of the Rhine (who becomes Otto II of Swabia).
-- in 1048, on Otto II's death, Henry invests it in the Rhenish Count Otto von Schweinfurt (Otto III of Swabia)
-- in 1057 on Otto III's death, Empress Agnes (mother & regent of Henry IV) invests Swabia in her son-in-law, Count Rudolf of Rheinfelden
-- in 1079 Henry IV deposes Rudolf of Rheinfelden and invests Swabia in his own son-in-law, Frederick of Staufen (Frederick I "Hohenstaufen" of Swabia)
-- in 1105 Swabia passes by inheritance to Frederick I's son, Frederick II Hohenstaufen of Swabia.

Franconia was passed differently:

-- in 1056, upon death of Henry III the Black, Franconia passes to his son Henry IV (along with German crown).
-- in 1076, Henry IV separates Franconia from the crown and invests it in his two-year-old son as Duke Conrad VII of Franconia (who is also simultaneously invested as Duke of Lower Lorraine; but later Conrad is pre-elected German king in 1087 and loses Lower Lorraine to Godfrey of Bouillon in 1089).
-- in 1093, Conrad VII goes into rebellion against his father and is disposessed of Franconia; the Franconian title rejoined to the crown (Conrad dies 1101)
-- in 1106, Franconia is passed along with the German crown to Henry IV's other son, Henry V ("the Younger") (pre-elected king in 1098, but went into rebellion too, but still got the succession)
-- in 1115 (the big date), excommunicated and on the ropes, Henry V tries to counter the growing influence of the Bishops of Wurzburg by investing his Hohenstaufen nephew, Count Conrad of Rothenburg (brother of Frederick II of Swabia) as Duke of Franconia.

So, although from 1115 onwards, Hohenstaufens held both Swabia & Franconia, they were held by separate branches.

In 1125, just before his death, Henry V, last of the Salians, granted his nephew Frederick II of Swabia all the Salian family property in Franconia (much of it by now virtually indinstinguishable from crown property) and designated him as his heir. But Fred II was passed over by the electors, who handed the kingship to Lothair of Saxony (Lothair III).

The attempt by Lothair to lay claim to crown lands in Franconia is what provoked the revolt of the Hohenstaufen brothers and set off the whole ugly Guelph-Ghibelline conflict. With his brother Fred II's permission, Conrad of Franconia-Rothenburg became anti-king in 1127 and full king (Conrad III) in 1138.

So resuming the story:

-- In 1147, Fred II Hohenstaufen of Swabia dies. His son ascends as Duke Fred III Barbarossa of Swabia.

-- In 1152, Conrad III dies. Franconia goes to his underage son, who styles himself Duke Frederick of Rothenburg, while the kingship passes on to his nephew, Duke Frederick III Barbarossa of Swabia (who becomes Frederick I of Germany). As part of the deal, that very same year, Barbarossa invests his cousin as Duke Frederick IV ("Rothenburg") of Swabia, thus uniting Franconia & Swabia in one person at long last.

-- In 1167, Frederick of Rothenburg-Franconia-Swabia dies, putting an end to that line. Now, Barbarossa passes Swabia to his eldest son, the three-year-old Duke Frederick V of Swabia.

-- in 1168 Barbarossa restores the Bishop of Wurzburg's ducal powers, investing him as Duke of Franconia, although the Hohenstaufens retained much control over the area through their extensive family lands and via imperial missi.

-- in 1169, the young Fred V died. So Barbarossa takes the step of having his next eldest (three-year-old) son pre-elected & pre-crowned as King Henry VI of Germany. Barbarossa invests Swabia in his even younger son, the baby Conrad, who takes up his deceased brother's name to become known as Frederick VI of Swabia.

-- 1188 Diet of Mainz rearranges things prior to the Crusade. Of particular relevance, Barbarossa invests his third living son, Conrad (not Fred VI, but a new Conrad, fourth son), as Duke of Rothenburg (i.e. Franconia, or rather head of the Salian/Hohenstaufen estates in western Franconia, with eastern Franconia still pretty much in the hands of the Bishops of Wurzburg.). His fourth living son, Otto, incidentally, is invested as Count Palatine in Burgundy (in care of his mother's inheritence)

-- 1190 Death of Barbarossa on Crusade, smoothly succeeded by his eldest living son, Henry VI.

-- 1191 Henry VI's brother, Fred VI of Swabia, dies of fever. So, Henry VI invests Swabia in their younger brother, Conrad of Rothenburg, who thus becomes Conrad II ("Rothenburg") of Swabia. You can see this as another period of "reunion" of Franconia & Swabia.

-- 1195 Henry VI invests yet another brother (a fifth or sixth son of Barbarossa) as Margrave/Duke Philip of Tuscany & Mathildine lands.

-- 1196 Conrad II of Swabia-Rothenburg dies. Henry VI invests Swabia in Philip of Tuscany, who thereby ascended as Duke Philip of Swabia. Note: the title of Duke of Rothenburg (or Franconia) ends here; the ducal title will be used only on occasion later by the Bishops of Wurzburg.

-- 1197 Death of Henry VI. His son Frederick II of Sicily's pre-arranged election as German king is blocked, so Philip of Tuscany-Swabia takes up the German kingship in 1198 to keep the seat warm for young Freddy.

-- 1208 Philip of Swabia is murdered. Although the Swabian monasteries recognize his nephew, Fred II of Sicily, as Duke of Swabia, the Guelph leader, King Otto IV of Germany, seizes control of the duchy, forcibly marries Philip of Swabia's only daughter and invests himself as Duke Otto IV ("Guelph") of Swabia.

-- 1212 Fred II of Sicily seizes control of Swabia from Otto IV and is acclaimed by Swabian vassals at Constance as Duke Frederick VII ("Hohenstaufen") of Swabia.

-- 1216 Fred II of Sicily invested Swabia in his eldest son & heir, who thereby ascended as Duke Henry II of Swabia.

-- 1235 Diet of Mainz. In punishment for his rebellion, Fred II disinherits Henry II of Swabia and invests the duchy in his second son who becomes Duke Conrad III of Swabia (he is simultaneously pre-elected as Conrad IV of Germany).

-- 1254 Death of Conrad IV, the last Hohenstaufen king of Germany, with only a two-year old son Conradin. His guardian (uncle Louis II of Bavaria) agrees to forswear any and all Hohenstaufen claims to the German kingship, in return for which the title of Duke of Swabia is guaranteed to Conradin. Louis II will help Conradin take effective control of Swabia c. 1262 and receive homage as Duke Conrad IV ("Conradin") of Swabia.

-- 1266 Conradin of Swabia breaks the deal and claims the German/Imperial crown.

-- 1268 Conradin of Swabia, last of the Hohenstaufens, is captured and executed in Naples. Conradin had designated Count Ulrich II of Wurttemberg as his heir in Swabia, but given the ugly circumstances, the deal does not go through. The title is dead and Swabia is just fragmented into pieces among the Margraves of Baden, the Counts of Wurttemberg, the Counts Palatine of Tubingen, Counts of Hohenzollern, Counts of Hapsburg, etc.

In sum: the Duchies of Franconia & Swabia were united only thrice -- under Henry III the Black (from 1039 to 1045), under Frederick of Rothenburg (from 1152 to 1167) and (a bit more ambiguously) under Conrad II of Rothenburg (from 1191 to 1196).
 

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...

You spend a lot of time indoors, don't you :D

Great answer though, so I guess it's worth it.

One question though...

What happened to the estates of Rothenburg in 1196 when Conrad II of Swabia-Rothenburg died? Why didn't Henry VI invest someone in Rothernburg like he did in Swabia?
 

Abdul Goatherd

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Aug 2, 2003
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Mssr Roy said:
...

You spend a lot of time indoors, don't you :D

Too hungover to do anything else yesterday. :D

Great answer though, so I guess it's worth it.

Thanks. :)

One question though...

What happened to the estates of Rothenburg in 1196 when Conrad II of Swabia-Rothenburg died? Why didn't Henry VI invest someone in Rothernburg like he did in Swabia?

I suspect Henry VI wanted to reserve the remnant of Franconia for little Fred of Sicily (as he was lining him up for kingship, he would need at least some German domain). But then that succession plan got all messed up in 1198 and it seems to have gotten lost in the shuffle.

I am going to guess that "Rothenburg" (i.e. the Hohenstaufen lands in Franconia) probably accompanied the crown again and was tossed around during the civil war between Philip and Otto IV. As they had their own home domains (Swabia & Saxony respectively), I suspect they both used Franconia as a pork barrel, handing out bits and pieces of it in return for support. Apparently, Fred II was also rather liberal with it.

I am not sure what emerged when the dust finally settled. It is probably unsurprising that many free imperial cities popped up from the ruins of Salian/Hohenstaufen land -- e.g. Frankfurt, Worms & Speyer in the western bit and Rothenburg & Nuremberg in the eastern.

The part not taken up by cities was divvied up among local lords and neighbors. In the east, the main beneficiaries were probably the Bishops of Wurzburg (of course; they were still the official "Dukes of (East) Franconia" -- hence their shield in EUII), the Counts of Hohenlohe and, most famously, the Hohenzollern Burggraves of Nuremberg (who proceeded to accumulate Ansbach, Bayreuth and other east Franconian territories before catapulting themselves north to Brandenburg).

The westerly parts were divvied up between the Archbishop of Mainz, the Count Palatine of the Rhine, the Landgrave of Hessen (then also of Thuringia) and a few others.
 
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