Domestic Sliders

[ForzaA]

Plutocracy-Aristocracy: Neutral, as in, can't choose -- depends on the country.

Decentralisation-Centralisation: Centralisation

Narrowminded-Innovative: Neutral, as in, somewhere in the middle

Free Trade-Mercantilism: Free Trade

Defensive/Offensive Doctrine: Offensive, shock >>>> siege, especially since ships do benefit from shock, but don't from siege.

Naval-Land: I prefer land countries, but will ofcourse go naval with countries like ENG, POR.

Quantity-Quality: Quality

Serfdom-Free Subjects: Serfdom; cheap infantry, low stabcosts.



....but I'm curious why this is suddenly a question

 

[unmerged(6147)]

It all depends on the type of game you play.

-------------- SP ------------------

I always play for WC at VH in SP. This means stab costs, BB reduce rate and diplomats are of prime importance.

In fact the sliders are easily described by
- the two top ones as far right as possible
- the 3rd (inno) to the right in the beginning and then as far left as possible
- the rest as far left as possible (well, I usually only go to defensive 2)

------------- MP ---------------------

In MP this is trickier. One has yet to achieve a WC in MP

I believe the standard ones are Pluto, Centra, Offensive, Quality. And some say RUS should go to low quality in MP as well, I don't know why. Personally I learned a trick with the offensive slider from drake which I have used in one campaign and it worked well.
That is 4 sliders.

Land/Naval depending on nation. POR/HOL always naval, AUS always Land, etc. ENG is trickier. That is 5.

Then we have the mercantilism slider. I believe that one is rarely moved by the players (other sliders are more important) and thus is tends to reflect starting values and event changes more than any intentional move.

Lastly the two really interesting ones.

Free citizens-serfdom. Here we see two schools. One preferring income and one preferring low stab costs. The jury is still out on this one although I know for certainty what I prefer.

And lastly the inno slider. Arguably the most difficult one. I always prefer a high value in the start (low tech cost, high stab cost, few colonists and missionaries: this almost always reflect your needs in the early game) and low value at the end. This is the only slider I really move first in one direction and then in the other.

 

[unmerged(19088)]

I'm choosing the liberal sides too..

Plutocracy over Aristocracy, because it gives tradebonus and also a plutocracy benefits more people than an aristocracy.. (many burghers vs few lords)

Centralization over Decentralization, because it helps techs and income..

Free Trade over Mercantilism, because it gives colonists and freedom to the people

Innovativeness over Narrowmindedness, because it gives better techs, sad that the missionaries go but..

Defensive over Offensive, because it gives siegebonuses, and you usually loose fewer men (so they are happier), but it requires careful planning

Naval over Land, because it gives more colonists, and reduces overseas pen.

Quality over Quantity, because it gives morale, also large armies may suffer attrition

Free Subjects over Serfdom, because people wanna be free, and it gives morale

So for me it is: PLU, CEN, FTR, DEF, NAV, QUA, FSU, INN

 

[Sute]{h]

Hmm... looks like the decentralization isn't very popular. Perhaps something should be done to make it more even and harder to choose. I would suggest having decentralized country get a lower penalty for non-state culture provinces. Normally you get a -30% income penalty. My suggestion would be to let a full decentralized country suffer only a -20% income penalty while a fully centralized country gets a -40% income penalty. Makes sense in my head since the countries that succesfully centralized typically didn't have a lot of non-culture provinces.

 

[unmerged(23409)]

Only one person has chosen decentralisation.

 

[unmerged(9563)]

Centralization is the only one I really care about, but if I'm ever in the mood :
Neutral (Leaning plutocratic if I have good monarchs now & in the future)
Free Trade
Narrowminded (Latin) Innovative (Others) - Although when I have enough Infra and centralization, I'll just go with whichever one is easier to chose in events
Offensive
Land (almost always)
Quality (To +1 Fire)
Free Subjects or Serfdom depends on whatever events I get. I'm not going to take a huge stab hit just to keep free subjects or serfdom up.

 

[unmerged(20077)]

I'm intrigued by someone choosing Decentralisation when it's clearly a disadvantage... the only thing it helps with is recovering stability. Perhaps whoever voted for it always plays the Timurids or China...

 

[|AXiN|]

Decent is also good if you have many, many vassals - ie in SP

 

[unmerged(38752)]

Decent is also good if you have many, many vassals - ie in SP

I am actually enjoying Decentralisation now in a Brandenburg game in MP. It gives me the third highest MP (after Russia and Austria) while I am the smallest country (by far) due to the vassal bug. Certainly helps poor little BB to survive, though I will no doubt move it up to catch up in tech as I conquer more provinces and thus have more "real" MP.

 

[unmerged(45766)]

Hmm... looks like the decentralization isn't very popular. Perhaps something should be done to make it more even and harder to choose. I would suggest having decentralized country get a lower penalty for non-state culture provinces. Normally you get a -30% income penalty. My suggestion would be to let a full decentralized country suffer only a -20% income penalty while a fully centralized country gets a -40% income penalty. Makes sense in my head since the countries that succesfully centralized typically didn't have a lot of non-culture provinces.

I entirely agree. And expand.

Decentralization should reduce the penalty for wrong-cultured provinces (both tax, RR and income) while high centralization should increase them.

And innovative should reduce the penalties (tax at least) for wrong-religions (maybe following the proportions of your tolerance sliders), since tolerance should bring less religious problems (which is quite the contrary for now : stabcosts decrease with narrowminded, number of missionaries and chances of random conversions increase).
For religions, I'd make Innovative influence the degree to which you can tolerate different religions (and maybe the amount of total tolerance), and tolerance sliders should in turn modify the tax penalty.

But that's my own opinion.

 

[Sute]{h]

I agree with the suggestion on the innovative slider as well. These changes will improve the position of historical empires. For instance the Ottoman Empire was actually quite innovative and decentralized, and their attempts to conform to a modern state by centralizing actually weakend the imperial integrity. Also they enjoyed quite a support in their European holding until they became more narrowminded in an effort to increase support from their muslim subjects.

 

[Carolus Rex]

Another good thing about the sliders is that now we have centralized discussion about them, as opposed the decentralized ones we've had in the past.

I went with
Aristocratic
Centralized
Neutral
Free Trade
Off. Doc.
Land
Quality
Neutral
WTF is teh slider?

 

[Mazyrian]

I think that Innovativeness should reduce the stab cost for different religion provinces; so, at Inno 10 all provinces would have a stab cost of 25. This way narrowmindedness would reduce stability costs for homogeneus empires and innovativeness for multireligious

 

[Stolen Rutters]

Aristo to keep my BB down. I always play to take every medium to mid wealth same-culture province so BB tends to be an issue over time.

Centralization to counteract...

Narrowmindedness - for that missionary and low Stab from all those new provinces I need to digest. I love Inno... it's just so painful when I am not mono-religious.

Free-trade and Mercantile - I let this one move as it wants to, and then only in the direction that will help me short and medium term, since I know it will want to move by itself before too long.

Offensive keeps them pesky invaders running. I try to overcome the lack of siege advantage by sieging as many provinces as I can afford to at one time.

Land or Naval depending on country. Mostly Land unless my nation is too mercantile to give me colonists when I need them.

I try to avoid moving my quantity-quality slider toward quality until after I grow my troop limit above 15-20. Some smaller nations need that extra soldier to take a province down.

The larger I am, the more I like Serfdom over free subjects.

 

[Stonewall]

1. Plutocracy - Aristocracy
2. Decentralization - Centralization
3. Narrowminded - Innovative
4. Free Trade - Mercantilism
5. Defensive- Offensive
6. Naval - Land
7. Quantity - Quality
8. Free Subjects - Serfdom

 

[unmerged(28030)]

I really see no advantage to free trade. The benefits of mercatilism are far better.

 

[unmerged(38752)]

I really see no advantage to free trade. The benefits of mercatilism are far better.

A nation with plenty of cash (like Spain at the start) can benefit far more from the extra merchants and colonists than from a little reduction of merchant placement costs.