This has happened to me multiple times in a row now -- I spend effort to breed a good heir with perfectly fine traits and some good base stats, then I grant him some land to manage (so that it goes back to me when I play him and I can redistribute my demesne however needed), but within a few years he gets ultra crappy traits. I could not even possibly exaggerate what happens; it's ridiculous. He goes from having 5-6 positive traits, loses just about all of them, and gains the exact opposite traits in their place, plus some more bad traits. How does this happen? It's been 3 times in a row now. I'm beginning to simply cheat good heirs now instead of caring about breeding them, just because this is so ridiculous.
Does your heir always get really crappy traits when you grant him land?
- Thread starter DeaTh-ShiNoBi
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Once they're landed, they get events just like you, and the AI likes to spam summer fairs, feasts, and all that sort of stuff, while choosing randomly for the outcome. Also, characters with a high number of green traits have a higher chance of getting events that will lose them those traits. I guess it's the game's way of balancing things?
Okay thanks, that explains it perfectly. I have noticed that they seem to have "Fabulous Feast" or "Holding a Grand Fair" or something like that about 100% of the time. It's pretty frustrating though. How exactly do you breed heirs if they're just going to make themselves suck inevitably?
Well, I tend to just not land them (unless they're not in the plans to inherit); that keeps them in your court and stops them from doing anything stupid. The prestige penalty is annoying, but I'd rather ensure the strong continuation of my dynasty, rather than worrying about an amount of prestige that will become insignificant as you accumulate more titles/vassals.
You can try Elective succession, which will let you handpick your heir from close relatives, although this requires excellent vassal management.
You can try Elective succession, which will let you handpick your heir from close relatives, although this requires excellent vassal management.
Surprisingly the better you trained yor heir the less stupid he seems to behave. Raising a strong Genius as heir for my Fatimid Caliphate right now, little Abdullah holds four duchies and 12 counties at age 7 with his stewardship skill of 12 ^^.
Also had very good success lately when granting my son and heir a border duchy, made him declare his own holy war on the neighbours which I just had took the land from and ship in his 2k retinue, along with the allied Wali-Emirs of the dynasty. (Appoint Doges for decadence exploit, they do not marry).
But yes in 80% of the time you'll get a slothful heir if he's landed. But that is better then the depression unlanded sons often pick up.
Also had very good success lately when granting my son and heir a border duchy, made him declare his own holy war on the neighbours which I just had took the land from and ship in his 2k retinue, along with the allied Wali-Emirs of the dynasty. (Appoint Doges for decadence exploit, they do not marry).
But yes in 80% of the time you'll get a slothful heir if he's landed. But that is better then the depression unlanded sons often pick up.
The only reason I give out land to a family member sometimes is, because he is the heir and doesn't produce any children (there seems to be a cap, if your court is too large) or because I have an ambitious duke with a high intrigue skill (he might invite your heir and then try to press his claims or make him a bishop), but the rule is: NEVER EVER give out land to family members, specially not to your heir (because of the exact reason that you're describing here).
Case in point, my current King (kingdoms of Croatia and Serbia) had a county in Germany. Now my only male Heir is a foreign Dwarf. Oh the joy!
I have found it work to best for me, to just keep your heir landless, in your court, that way you can start educating his children as well.
Don't get your court above 30 until then they will breed like always.
And the rule is so plain wrong, i place my family in EVERY county i get, espacially dukal titles. Always! (not as muslim)
There are pros and cons. You don´t want powerful pretenders, therefore having people with claims as powerful dukes can really screw your game. Remember, not always things go according to plan and if the king dies and you assume the game as his 1 year old son, having the duke of Aquitaine + Poitiers with his 6 county demesne and 20 diplomacy as your enemy can be... nasty.
If you have no external enemies, then by all means expanding the dinasty is good. However, if you can find yourself in a position where a civil war can weaken you too much to be attacked by external enemies as well (asnd France is the classical example since England and HRE usually have claims on you), then you want to centralize power and have pretenders only as counts or barons.
If you have no external enemies, then by all means expanding the dinasty is good. However, if you can find yourself in a position where a civil war can weaken you too much to be attacked by external enemies as well (asnd France is the classical example since England and HRE usually have claims on you), then you want to centralize power and have pretenders only as counts or barons.
I've asked this is the mod forum before but never get a response: Is it possible to make the fairs, feasts, etc. prohibitively expensive, or better yet just remove the events from the game? I've tried modding them myself by trying to make the chance of negative outcomes extremely low (which would also help the AI) but it didn't work.
You have a very roundabout way of modding. ^_^ Instead of editing the outcomes, why not just change the AI's chance of selecting a choice? Feasts and such are in Crusader Kings II/decisions/minor_decisions.txt, just change the factor under ai_will_do to factor = 0, so the AI will never make those decisions. Alternatively, just blank everything in minor_decisions.txt, but I don't see why you'd want to remove the decisions for yourself as well.
Well, I normally have 0 revolts during my playthroughs. If you give out land to your brothers or younger sons (or simply sons, that won't inherit the throne) you will normally have revolts as soon, as you get a new ruler.
As others have said, its because the AI tends to spam those minor decisions & pick randomly. Hunting, with its numerous options to get craven and bad events if you are is a particular offender (it will usually grant them craven, slothful and possibly wrathful in a couple of years).
Solution: don't land your heir.
Land a kind genius heir, and you'll play a kinslaying wroth slob when you die. That's CK2 for you.
OK, on the flip side, does that mean if you have an heir with lousy traits, you grant him a county and somehow he'll get better, humm? :happy:
My current ruler was somehow able to lose his patience and ambitious trait even without getting landed befor he even became the new ruler. He would have been one of my best rulers of all times otherwise.
Lol, it makes you want your character to die, just so the heir can succeed before they get into too much trouble.
but this is great, thanks so much!Sigh. The random trait events are really annoying me. I'd prefer to have a real choice, like in CK1, and a smarter AI.