how would you propose we show data in the racial and ethical makeup of your race? where is the tooltip for that.
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Does Stellaris have a ledger?
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how would you propose we show data in the racial and ethical makeup of your race? where is the tooltip for that.
There are too many blasphemers in this thread. The lack of adoration of massive lists of information and multi-coloured pie graphs is deeply unsettling.
What kind of nerd doesn't like spreadsheets?
What kind of nerd doesn't like spreadsheets?
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The kind of nerd who doesn't live in the 90's and likes proper, modern, efficient GUI design.
No offense intended, but the things you people are suggesting are the things that made HOI3's interface so abysmal. More information does not equal better.
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Spreadsheets and pie charts are used for the real work of government and business. Infographics are used to stretch the truth and leave more space on the webpage for ads. If you were a real Star Emperor, you (or at least your High Ministers) would have to look at a lot of spreadsheets
This is not a good way to communicate data, no matter what the chattering classes of the moment believe: https://xkcd.com/1273/
OK, I exaggerate my case a little. But I'm not asking for the main interfaces of the game to be spreasheets. I just want the spreadsheet to be there in the back, for when I want more detail. Like in Victoria II. You never really need to drill down to look at individual POPs and see exactly what they're thinking/buying (the secret of Victoria II is that you don't actually need to understand the economy, it's not like the real 19th century politicians ever did), but it's fun to do sometimes.
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Considering that many, many pieces of software the government uses are horrendously designed? That doesn't really mean much.
A little? That is a horrendous strawman. The entire point of a GUI is to provide users with the maximum amount of information in the easiest to understand way. Of course, there is a time and place for hard numbers, but they should be avoided when possible. Especially in cases when they are superfluous.
Then the question becomes, why spend time on developing a feature that very possibly only the minority will even use? I don't work for Paradox, but it is very possible these feature was deemed non-essential and pushed into a dusty corner with all the other features that would be added if they had nothing better to do.
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sigh. my concerns were never responded to. what is wrong with the eu4 ledger and how would you better propose internal affairs be organized.
What affairs do you need to know that aren't already provided to you with the current interface? And why do these things warrant extra development time?
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going back to the metaphor of eu4. if i wanted to know exactly what cultures occupied my empire, without a ledger i would have to add up the basetax of all the provinces of #culture_type and then take my total basetax and divide that number by the basetax of a specific culture, to find out their precentage in my realm. with the ledger, i can easily find a pie chart that gives me easily digestable %'s
in stellaris, this could mean the difference between counting by hand the different amounts of various races inside my empire, or instead going to the ledger, finding the exact number of pops in my entire empire, how many of each race, ethos breakdown, etc, etc. i fail to see how this is not a benefit.
This isn't EU4, nor does any of this information exist in Stellaris aside from races and ethos.
How does any of this information impact the game whatsoever? All of the effects caused by ethos drift and xenophobia are already represented. Same with the pop size of your empire, we've seen it multiple times. Hell, you can see the planet and pop size of other empires even.
Most of what you described already exists. And what doesn't isn't really important to the game.
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Consider revising your phrasing, then. Few people are interesting in working hard to figure out what you mean, especially when you can't be bothered to write more than a sentence, or even capitalize properly.
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how does any of that information impact the game? that information wouldn't be included if it didn't impact the game! of course id like to see a detailed breakdown of the ethos that are adhered to in my realm, as well as what races compose a certain% of the population! it helps from a roleplaying perspective, seeing how your empire is expanding, and into what groups, and it also helps you make decisions related to xeno rights because it allows you to develop a sense of when they are beginning to become a significant minority. it helps prevent uprisings, and allows you to know at a glance what ethos are becoming dominant that arent a part of your empire, instead of having to shuffle through planets to get a vague idea of the numbers.
i brought up eu4 becuase i was using a device known as a metaphor. in eu4 the culture breakdown in the ledger is the easiest way to know who is close to becoming an accepted or unaccepted pop. stellaris is not the same, but it is similar, in that youd want to know what ideas were being passed around your empire at a glance, as opposed to checking all your planets individually.
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Not necessary as you are already made aware of any sort of ethos drift already. Which is really the only reason why you'd need to be aware of ethos's.
The effects of everything you described are already represented on the GUI. You don't need to know which ethos there are, because it already tells you which planets are threatening to rebel.
All the information you need to prevent rebellions already exists. It's happiness. That little happiness number pretty much encapsulates everything you described. That is all you need to know.
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yes youre made aware of ethos drift, but only of event driven "primer moments" that get your pops in far away worlds drifting. you arent made aware of every ethos swap made in your empire and as far as im concerned the more ways to observe this the better.
why not? first of all, like i said, it could prove very valuable for preventing rebellions or keeping a tab on your empire, but even beyond that i dont need to tell you that the ledger is immensely valuable for anyone who is looking to construct an after action report full of RP. its what makes the parts of the game MEAN something when you construct it afterwards for an audience.
so? not to the extent id like. thats like saying "if you really needed to, all of the province information is given to you when you click on a province." yeah, it is, and when im ruling a 100 province empire its a PITA to click on every province one by one and write down what cultures they follow, what their basetax is, and if they are accepted or not. that is why we have mapmodes, and that is why we have a ledger. and before you say "but stellaris doesnt have cultures!" i know that, stellaris has pops of different race and ethos type, this is just as important, if not more so, to be able to ascertain at a glance!
have you played eu4?
this is paradox, thats not how this works! not only is that not the extent of what i need to know to keep down rebellions, but even if it was, this is information i want to know so i can keep track of my game in the first place! the ledger wouldnt neccisarily contain any information you couldnt find by checking your factions ledger and then cycling through planets, but it allows you to access it in a formatted manner. the pops are part of why a lot of us play paradox games. in ck2, there is nothing more satisfying than going to the religion portion of the ledger and seeing what religions have the most provinces. that IS the game. there is no way in which this is a negative.
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I need ledgers. Both for my nerdy satisfaction and so I can increase my immersion. Where else am I supposed to get my Imperial Census Data?
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I also would like to have access to massive amount of data about my empire. It's just fun to see how the numbers are growing as your empire growths.
Information about other empires may still remain hidden. But different portions of these data could be revealed by espionage missions (future DLC?), for instance.
Information about other empires may still remain hidden. But different portions of these data could be revealed by espionage missions (future DLC?), for instance.
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It is sci-fi game for Blorgs sake. It is only natural that we get ledger like information. This is the game where we supposed to have detailed information on anything we manage where in EU4 it was given for gameplay ease.
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I personally think the map looks really cluttered with energy, minerals, etc on the map. I hope that can be toggled on/off, but seriously you need to be able to sort your planets and mining bases to know where your economic power lies and hence what your power bases are. I like to do this quickly via a list that can be sorted with a click of the mouse. Otherwise I will end up resorting to pen and paper. I'm slightly disappointed with this decision although I will reserve final judgement until I have my copy and have played it for a while.
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I understand that, unlike EU4 / CK2, the component of exploration of the unknown is much more important in Stellaris that in other paradox games.
So, if I EU4, playing for example Ulm, I can peek at the Aztec army composition, although historically Ulm has not the slightest idea although the mere existence of the Aztecs, in Stellaris, even knowing of the existence of the "Ziconian Coalition" would almost be a "spoiler" of the game mood.
However, the ledger is a great tool to handy access all the information about your empire. Information you may actually get just clicking on every planet/colony but you collect in a more easy and structured way.
The same is true, IMHO, for a lot of other data about the Empires you know , you have trade /with, are member of your alliance/federation etc..
So, I really would have a Ledger with the collection of all the information I already know and/or I can "manually" get just clicking back and forth.
If it will not be in Stellaris 1.0 , I hope it will be added in a future patch/expansion .
So, if I EU4, playing for example Ulm, I can peek at the Aztec army composition, although historically Ulm has not the slightest idea although the mere existence of the Aztecs, in Stellaris, even knowing of the existence of the "Ziconian Coalition" would almost be a "spoiler" of the game mood.
However, the ledger is a great tool to handy access all the information about your empire. Information you may actually get just clicking on every planet/colony but you collect in a more easy and structured way.
The same is true, IMHO, for a lot of other data about the Empires you know , you have trade /with, are member of your alliance/federation etc..
So, I really would have a Ledger with the collection of all the information I already know and/or I can "manually" get just clicking back and forth.
If it will not be in Stellaris 1.0 , I hope it will be added in a future patch/expansion .
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How many times has EU4 forced you to use the ledger to do anything?
Zero; everything can be done from the main screen. The ledger is for people who just love COLLATING AND ORGANIZING GLORIOUS DATA.
I obviously don't want the entire game to be spreadsheets, but the more spreasheets we have in menus and debrief screens the better.
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