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Riekopo

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I've played a few random games of Imperator now and I've never seen Antigonid Macedon form like in real life. Pretty disappointing. I think the game needs more missions and more scripted historical characters and events. In fact, I have to say that all of my games have ended up very non-historical and it's pretty disappointing.

I have to wonder if the mission system is basically forcing the AI to act in a unhistorical way?...

Q: Why does the forum software interrupt my typing with a popup every time I try to make a new thread? It's really annoying.
 

herrickrcw2

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The current faction Phrygia, the leaders name is Antigonus Monophthalmus.

In real life, Antigonus had a son named Demetrius. After the battle of Ipsus Demetrius was still able to hold Greece and he eventually conquered Macedon, this is where the name Antigonid dynasty comes from because Demetrius continued Antigonus's legacy.

The ruler of Macedon in IR is named Cassander, he was the one who assassinated Alexander the great wife and children.

So if you truly want the Antigonids to rule Macedon then you know what to do.
 
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Harlehus

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The current faction Phrygia, the leaders name is Antigonus Monophthalmus.

In real life, Antigonus had a son named Demetrius. After the battle of Issus Demetrius was still able to hold Greece and he eventually conquered Macedon, this is where the name Antigonid dynasty comes from because Demetrius continued Antigonus's legacy.

The ruler of Macedon in IR is named Cassander, he was the one who assassinated Alexander the great wife and children.

So if you truly want the Antigonids to rule Macedon then you know what to do.
What? Can you play as Demetrius?
 

blackbirdgriffi

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What? Can you play as Demetrius?
Demetrius the besieger? if so then yes you can play as him once the previous ruler Antigone the one eyed dies, he will inherit his fathers realm and IIRC his diadochi claims as well (not sure about that last part though. It wont be antigonid macedonia though (well you might be able to form Macedon if you full conquer Cassander maybe, not sure about the formables).

I have a question for you guys, given the situation in which the antigonids are, wouldn't it make more sense to just keep ones holding and conquer from there? If the antigonids never lost their holdings in eastern medditeranea it wouldn't make sense for them to think that they need to consolidate their strengh in Macedonia as both demetrius and Antigonos Gonatas did wouldn't it? or am I missing something
 

Rubidium

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Demetrius the besieger? if so then yes you can play as him once the previous ruler Antigone the one eyed dies, he will inherit his fathers realm and IIRC his diadochi claims as well (not sure about that last part though. It wont be antigonid macedonia though (well you might be able to form Macedon if you full conquer Cassander maybe, not sure about the formables).

I have a question for you guys, given the situation in which the antigonids are, wouldn't it make more sense to just keep ones holding and conquer from there? If the antigonids never lost their holdings in eastern medditeranea it wouldn't make sense for them to think that they need to consolidate their strengh in Macedonia as both demetrius and Antigonos Gonatas did wouldn't it? or am I missing something
Do you mean if they had won Ipsus? They would have certainly kept their holdings in Asia and tried to reconquer the rest of Alexander's Empire (the whole reason that Ipsus happened is that the other Diadochi, including his former ally Cassander, were afraid he was going to try this). It's worth noting that when Seleucus ended up controlling essentially all of Antigonus's empire a couple of decades later, his next move was to try and conquer Greece and Macedonia. I'm not sure where the Antigonids would have ruled from in this case, but they certainly would have wanted to control Greece/Macedonia along with the rest of the empire.

Or do you mean after Ipsus, when Demetrius was holding on to a handful of garrisons like Tyre? In that case they would take whatever they could get (although Demetrius, at least, never seems to have given up on the dream of reuniting the empire, judging by his final campaign), which turned out to be Macedonia.
 

blackbirdgriffi

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Yeah, that's what I meant as in since Ipsos didn't occur in this games it feels non sensical to ask for antigonid makedonia if the antigonid kingdom in anatolia + levant was still under their control, they would indeed more likely than not seize greece and makedonia and then later on take the wrestle the eastern satrapies under the control of seleukos or go for egypt.
 
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EricMN93

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In this post we had an interesting debate about unifying kingdoms and how to have claims to a kingdom. One of the things that was discussed was the issue of Phrygia ruling Greece.

One of the ideas that was debated is that if you have x requirements you could claim a foreign throne to give a relative.

Another idea was that if a civilization loses all the territories but still has an army, then they can continue the game and try to claim a foreign throne.
 

Hertyeer

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I've played a few random games of Imperator now and I've never seen Antigonid Macedon form like in real life. Pretty disappointing. I think the game needs more missions and more scripted historical characters and events. In fact, I have to say that all of my games have ended up very non-historical and it's pretty disappointing.

I have to wonder if the mission system is basically forcing the AI to act in a unhistorical way?...

Q: Why does the forum software interrupt my typing with a popup every time I try to make a new thread? It's really annoying.
I disagree, clearly you didn't played the old paradox games and you are not familiar how hated railroad events were so much so they nuked it for good for the most part
 
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There is a Form Macedon Decision that is supposed to allow this, but it’s currently bugged. The Diadochi and their Satrapies don’t have it. Only Epirus and Paeonia (and as Paeonia should have an own culture this is wrong as well).

did anyone report it as a bug?

Another idea was that if a civilization loses all the territories but still has an army, then they can continue the game and try to claim a foreign throne.
You propose this because of the Cretan states after the unification ultimatum, right?
 

EricMN93

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There is a Form Macedon Decision that is supposed to allow this, but it’s currently bugged. The Diadochi and their Satrapies don’t have it. Only Epirus and Paeonia (and as Paeonia should have an own culture this is wrong as well).

did anyone report it as a bug?


You propose this because of the Cretan states after the unification ultimatum, right?

Rather, it is a direct reference to Phrygia. after losing all the territories in Asia, Demetrius was able to get the Macedonian throne
 

Eric The Red 33

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In game terms, did the Antigonids really lose all of their territories before moving into Greece or did they still have some? In game they actually start with some territories in Greece at game start, though I admit landless armies going on to carve out new kingdoms would be a neat mechanic.
 
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Harlehus

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In game terms, did the Antigonids really lose all of their territories before moving into Greece or did they still have some? In game they actually start with some territories in Greece at game start, though I admit landless armies going on to carve out new kingdoms would be a neat mechanic.
Do you mean historic terms? If so the Antigonids had ambitions in Greece before they lost their possesions in Asia Minor at the battle of Ipsus. Then Demetrius seeing that he could not re-conquer his fathers lands in Asia Minor turned his arms against Macedonia and became king there.
 

DC123456789

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In game terms, did the Antigonids really lose all of their territories before moving into Greece or did they still have some? In game they actually start with some territories in Greece at game start, though I admit landless armies going on to carve out new kingdoms would be a neat mechanic.
No, they still controlled their fleet and managed to keep control of a few coastal areas after Ipsus, then took over Greece before they lost their other areas. I don't think there was any point at which the Antigonids didn't have any territory under their control.
 

Mackus

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No, they still controlled their fleet and managed to keep control of a few coastal areas after Ipsus, then took over Greece before they lost their other areas. I don't think there was any point at which the Antigonids didn't have any territory under their control.
That clears it up a bit. There are basically two arguments floating around as to how Antigonid Macedon should form in-game.
First is that random Antigonid becomes king of pre-existing Macedon tag (especially if local dynasty dies out).
Second is that Phrygia conquers Macedonia, and then tag-switches to Macedonia.

If Antigonids never lost all of their territory, it means the second option should be the historical one, but first one could also be scripted to happen under specific circumstances.
 
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EricMN93

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That clears it up a bit. There are basically two arguments floating around as to how Antigonid Macedon should form in-game.
First is that random Antigonid becomes king of pre-existing Macedon tag (especially if local dynasty dies out).
Second is that Phrygia conquers Macedonia, and then tag-switches to Macedonia.

If Antigonids never lost all of their territory, it means the second option should be the historical one, but first one could also be scripted to happen under specific circumstances.

At this time there were many puppet governments and the like, so there should be a 3rd option.

There should be a casus belli to put a family member (if you are a monarchy) or a puppet government (if you are a Republic) in a foreign country.

In the case of the kingdom of Antigonid or other kingdoms after the death of its current ruler, we could choose whether to continue playing with the same civilization or playing with the other country where our son rules.
 

blackbirdgriffi

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There should be a casus belli to put a family member (if you are a monarchy) or a puppet government (if you are a Republic) in a foreign country.
I hope that gets implemented at some point for that's kinda how the romans expanded or at least it's the most common "casus belli" they tended to use.
 
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