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Amphibious mechanized and amphibious tanks are considered "marines", so they do get the bonuses from the Marines tech line. However, you are mistaken: those techs don't give a defense bonus, they give org and soft attack.
They are, but the marine upgrade techs apply specifically to the marine battalions, not the marine category. Surprisingly, amphibious tanks are not counted as 'special forces' under the special forces tree, only the amphibious mechanized.
They are, but the marine upgrade techs apply specifically to the marine battalions, not the marine category. Surprisingly, amphibious tanks are not counted as 'special forces' under the special forces tree, only the amphibious mechanized.
You are correct per several preliminary tests conducted today with one possible lone exception. Amphibious tank Battalions are counted towards the special forces battalion cap in the division designer. Otherwise, your statement, "Surprisingly, amphibious tanks are not counted (considered) as 'special forces' under the special forces tree, only the amphibious mechanized" is correct with respect to research tree effects (yellow text added by me for clarification). It seems that this is a bug; either the research descriptions are incorrect or the amphibious tank battalions were inadvertently omitted.
I know that you are well versed in HOI4, but I have provided additional detail for the benefit of those unfamiliar with HOI4. I plan on running confirmatory tests in the near future.
All tests started in 1936 with the country Bhutan (BHU) and only Man the Guns DLC activated. Bhutan was picked because it has no spirits, no doctrines researched, and only Basic Equipment and Mountain Infantry I researched. The console was used to add experience and to perform instant research. Battalion size templates were created as they became available. These templates were examined before, during, and at the end of each unlocked research. Researches unlocked include:
Unlocked at test start
Basic Equipment
Mountain Infantry I
Special Forces
Marines I (enables Marines)
Marines II (Marines soft attack +5% and organization +5.0)
Marines III (Marines organization +5.0)
Special Forces (Special Forces hot & cold acclimatization gain factors +5%)
Advanced Special Forces Training (Special Forces defense +5% and organization +5.0 and division training time increase +10.0%)
Extreme Environment Training (Special Forces hot & cold acclimatization gain factors +50% and supply grace +48.0 hrs and division training time increase +10.0%)
Elite Forces (Special Forces soft attack +5% and organization +5.0 and hot & cold acclimatization gain factors +20% and supply grace +48.0 hrs)
Mobile Infantry
Trucks
Mechanized I
Basic Amtrac (enables Basic Amphibious Tractor and Amtrac Battalion)
Armor
Great War Tank
Light Armor
Light Armor I
Light Armor II
Amphibious Armor
Basic Amphibious Tank (enables Basic Amphibious Tank and Amphibious Tank Battalion)
Test results and commentary:
The division composition indicator was "smart enough" to recognize that a single amtrac battalion is 100% mechanized irrespective of division naming.
The division composition indicator was "smart enough" to recognize that a single amphibious tank battalion is 100% armor irrespective of division naming.
The division designer was "smart enough" to assign a special forces tag to Marine divisions, single amtrac battalions, and single amphibious tank battalions with respect to special forces battalion count.
The amphibious tank battalion stats were unaffected by researches Marine I, Marine II, Marine III, Special Forces, Advanced Special Forces Training, Extreme Environment Training, and Elite Forces.
The amtrac battalion stats were affected by researches Special Forces, Advanced Special Forces Training, Extreme Environment Training, and Elite Forces.
The amtrac battalion stats were unaffected by researches Marine I, Marine II, and Marine III
Pending work:
Perform confirmatory testing and document results and test methodology
Write a bug report using supporting documentation and observations
Publish confirmatory test results on this forum
Screenshot:
Bhutan templates with Special Forces icons. Note: special forces count not shown, but total count of 6 special forces battalions was correct during game test.
Thanks for that. I don't really like editing my posts after I've made them, unless I feel like I absolutely have to. And after I had already posted it and tried reading through it, I noticed how much room there was to interpret that statement in different ways. Hopefully now that you've pointed it out, fewer people will get lost and I won't have to edit it myself to prevent that.
I believe it is this. In the files for the units, all 4 breeds of amphibious tanks are missing the "category_special_forces" from their "categories =" list. A-mek, and the mar/mou/para do have it.
A short cut to seeing what tech bonuses apply to what sorts of things, is that when there is a sort of special category being mentioned (like special forces, front line, tank and armour variants) you can mouse over the icon in the research pop up, to show the list of battalions/companies in that group.
Those icons and that list of battalions/companies don't change if you have NATO icons turned on, and is why I don't want to play with that setting anymore. If some of them are going to be the PDX icons no matter what I do, I might as well just use the PDX icons and have everything be consistent.
The division composition indicator was "smart enough" to recognize that a single amtrac battalion is 100% mechanized irrespective of division naming.
The division composition indicator was "smart enough" to recognize that a single amphibious tank battalion is 100% armor irrespective of division naming.
The division designer was "smart enough" to assign a special forces tag to Marine divisions, single amtrac battalions, and single amphibious tank battalions with respect to special forces battalion count.
I'm not really sure what the division naming has to do with it? The div-comp indicator is based off the number of the battalions that fall into a certain type, compared to the total battalions. I currently don't know what makes the different battalions count as the different things like infantry, artillery, truck, mechanized, armour, special forces. Trying to compare the differences between the line artillery (which is artillery, not infantry) towed artillery (which is artillery, not truck) and the SPG (which is armour, not artillery) hasn't been able to show me what the difference is.
Interestingly, the rocket artilleries are all artillery (rather than infantry, truck, or mechanized), but only the original motorized rocket artillery counts as 'rocket', which I still don't think has ever been used.
Confirmatory testing completed which verified your findings. Bug report 1574473 issued. Please reference the bug report for the test methodology and test observations. Sorry that the testing and reporting took so long; it has been a busy week for me.
