Do Heretics ever get a religious head? And what about the Papacy?

[Lord Curlyton]

Relatively new to CK2, compared to other P-Dox games, and decided to become a Fraticelli while playing as William the Conqueror. After much blood, sweat, and tears I've managed to unite the British Isles under my rule and have converted the majority of the population to the Fraticelli heresy. My MA has gone above 80% and I just sacked and conquered the Papacy after causing the collapse of the HRE by helping get a heretic member of my dynasty installed as emperor (thanks, ERE alliance!).
However, even though I'm sure that my MA is now quite greater than Catholicism AND I own Latium outright, it seems that I am unable to either declare my version of Catholicism as the One True Way or even appoint my own Religious Head as a way of legitimizing Fraticellism. Will I ever be able to?

Also, what happens to the Pope and Papacy now that they are landless, apparently? Do Catholics still even have a Religious Head anymore? I didn't get a message stating the Papacy was re-founded somewhere else and I haven't gotten any message about potentially uniting the Catholic Church.

 

[dorukdorucu]

Sadly no, heretics can never get the full religious benefits for now. One theoretically could make some events like Mending the Great Schism but i don't know if anyone has tried it. Check the mods forum, maybe they have something there. However there is no way that i'm aware of in vanilla to do such a thing. As with the papacy, since it is a titular titular as far as i know, the pope has probably just relocated to somewhere else. He may even own land inside your borders at least, thats what happened to my cathar Raolf de Normandie of Britannia.

 

[Comradebot]

Nope, you can't create religious heads in vanilla (think there's a mod for it). Some of the Orthodox heresies and the only Miaphysite heresy have their own religious heads, but none of the Catholic heretics have one. However, given the actual nature of Fraticelli, them not having a religious head may be accurate.

 

[zeress]

The pope will either forcibly remove on of his bishops from power to take the land for his own, or if he has no vassals left he will simply "reside" in Rome. Catholicism can never lose its' religious head in CK2. And none of the heresies, aside from the already mentioned one, can gain a religious head unmodded.

 

[Lord Curlyton]

Thank you for your replies, I suspected as much. As a funny little aside, I just Holy War-ed for the Duchy of Burgundy and found where the Pope moved to, since he had been "Residing in Rome" for a bit: the Bishopric of Tournus. I wonder if I should let him keep that Bishopric...

 

[dorukdorucu]

Thank you for your replies, I suspected as much. As a funny little aside, I just Holy War-ed for the Duchy of Burgundy and found where the Pope moved to, since he had been "Residing in Rome" for a bit: the Bishopric of Tournus. I wonder if I should let him keep that Bishopric...

NO, Let the heretic burn!

 

[Lord Curlyton]

As much as I like the thought of going all Warhammer 40k on him, it turns out to be quite useful to have the Catholic Pope abide in the middle of my empire: whenever he bothers to call a Crusade for France (I've yet to see the Pope push for a Crusade against anyone but me after the first two initial Crusades) I can just go roflstomp his Bishopric for an instant 100% Warscore and end of Crusade. Catholic MA is dropping quite nicely now.

 

[dorukdorucu]

As much as I like the thought of going all Warhammer 40k on him, it turns out to be quite useful to have the Catholic Pope abide in the middle of my empire: whenever he bothers to call a Crusade for France (I've yet to see the Pope push for a Crusade against anyone but me after the first two initial Crusades) I can just go roflstomp his Bishopric for an instant 100% Warscore and end of Crusade. Catholic MA is dropping quite nicely now.

Oh well i guess that's nice i've started a new game and will consider doing it. Thanks for the tip.

 

[telegraph]

How about combining an antipope and a heresy? Maybe this will work:
1. make an antipope.
2. make him your court chaplain and send him to research.
3. when he comes to you with a heresy - accept it.

This way you both wll be heretics and he will be an antipope. maybe this way h will become a heretic pope?

 

[Lord Curlyton]

I managed to get a heresy event within a couple years after taking over England as William the conqueror, so I didn't have much/any time to get an antipope up and running, though it was on my to-do list.

 

[masteriw]

How about combining an antipope and a heresy? Maybe this will work:
1. make an antipope.
2. make him your court chaplain and send him to research.
3. when he comes to you with a heresy - accept it.

This way you both wll be heretics and he will be an antipope. maybe this way h will become a heretic pope?

I think that even if you press his claim for the Papacy it won't work, he'll just be the Catholic religious head.

 

[dorukdorucu]

I think that even if you press his claim for the Papacy it won't work, he'll just be the Catholic religious head.

This, as i said earlier one theoretically CAN mod the heresies to have religious heads etc. just like the monophysite and nestorian ones however it would take quite some time and probably will disqualify you from multiplayer.

 

[markmid]

Not run it myself yet to test but:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...-Basilica-Tribuo-quot-A-religion-overhaul-mod

Looks to be what you are looking for? Still updating to the latest patch. I am using Norse mod at the moment which gives holy orders, events and a religious head etc to the norse religion.