Disfavored: forced choices?

[wimplestiltskin]

i got angry cause the disfavored path closes many (manyyyy) doors, but it made sense cause they dont budge, they dont care, they have their way and go with it no matter what, and it makes sense they eradicate everyone
the part that didnt make sense was the cairn choice in the stone sea, you have to be a douche and you have to make an unreasonable choice
however i made graven ashe bend the knee and that part was fun

then i went a chorus playthrough cause i wanted my mage to learn everything he can (seems you are closed to some magic by choosing the disfavored...)
so far i found a couple of sigils i didnt have before, and the game goes good, even made friend with the unbroken, conscripted them to the chorus...
and then i get to the oldwalls breach... damned gregor wont budge... so no matter what you do you are screwed

This is my issue. It seems that the only really versatile and dynamic playthrough, is the rebels. There you get to pick and choose who you ally with. It makes sense that tiersman desire independance and are only really willing to side with a fellow revolter against Kyros, I just feel that in the world of Tyranny, another path, presented as the lesser of evils (ie the solo Fatebinder) would have been a nice compromise between the rigid stupidity of the northern factions while sticking with Kyros over all and the path of outright rebellion. It's not like our PC is a nobody who's ability to get stuff done is questionable. Even the most recalcitrant opponent would be open to being swayed towards serving Kyros through the fatebinder, if it meant their societies wouldn't be entirely enslaved and wiped out. They might not bend the knee to Ashe or Nerat and I wouldn't blame them, but a fatebinder that had shown some level of respect and diplomacy and an interest in the long term prosperity of the tiers, would be a more attractive choice for submission. You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. That would have been a playthrough more fitting with the solo route in my opinion.

 

[Akka le Vil]

i got angry cause the disfavored path closes many (manyyyy) doors, but it made sense cause they dont budge, they dont care, they have their way and go with it no matter what, and it makes sense they eradicate everyone

It makes sense for THEM. I don't see how it makes sense for YOU. It seems that the writers just forgot that :

1) We aren't part of the faction we chose to storm the Halls.
2) We aren't supposed to conquer the Tiers in their stead, we're supposed to investigate their actions.

 

[Luckmann]

I actually made a thread just for stuff like this right here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...ive-moments-spoilers-lets-make-a-list.983069/

The game is unfortunately full of things like this, and it's just very frustrating when you have to do things. I don't even mind that much to be "on rails" in some regards - even if it would be far more preferable not to be - but it's frustrating as hell to be forced to play "out of character". I want to at least have the option to present my character appropriately, even if it doesn't change the outcome.

 

[faljen_isus]

dont get me wrong, when you blight the stone sea i understand the military aspect of depleting the food stores of the chorus

what i dont understand is why cant i reason with them on the line of "give me a week, ill eradicate the chorus, we dont need to do this, we still have to rule this goddamn land after we eradicate them and having a whole realm full of refugees that cant grow a carrot is a longterm horror show"

of rather, talk to the ashe to allow me to go help the chorus to get close to nerat so i can take him out (vice versa also)

they gave us a good taste of what they can do, now they just have to do it

also, when you get near the end, you have 2 unlocked edicts, out of 5... it bloody screams "to be continued" and the screams are deafening

 

[thevmag]

also, when you get near the end, you have 2 unlocked edicts, out of 5... it bloody screams "to be continued" and the screams are deafening

Depending on what your early game choices allow you to do in later game, you can get the full 5: break three edicts, get one from Bleden Mark, and Spire Library research gets you the final one.

 

[faljen_isus]

in my disfavored play bleden hated me, i exhausted the spire library, and was locked out of burning library...

 

[thevmag]

Yeah. Who would have guessed that "which army is most tactically suitable to storm a keep" would be the biggest choice you make in the whole game

 

[wimplestiltskin]

in my disfavored play bleden hated me, i exhausted the spire library, and was locked out of burning library...

You gotta go solo to get Bleden to be pally. Then to get the edict from him, you have to prioritse meeting Bleden over reporting to Tunon.

Its not that the game is bad, it's just a rough diamond that could easily have been a true gem. Who knows, maybe dlc or sequels will bring it to its maximum potential, the last dlc for PoE certainly made some huge improvements to that game. They just came so close, I think thats why so many of us are griping.

 

[faljen_isus]

well the disfavored are by far the best choice... and they lock you out of half the game xD

 

[wimplestiltskin]

well the disfavored are by far the best choice... and they lock you out of half the game xD

im not so sure, the rebels seem to be the most developed path with the most flexibility and attention. Which could make sense if the developers decided at an early stage that the game would end with confrontation with Kyros. I think they heard all the apprehension from some people about being evil and playing for the bad guy and so focused primarily on the "good guy" approach to the detriment of other paths.

 

[faljen_isus]

i meant the best military choice between the 2 armies to take the citadel
apparently for the game it is best to choose the rebels to have the best experience

 

[Luckmann]

Yeah. Who would have guessed that "which army is most tactically suitable to storm a keep" would be the biggest choice you make in the whole game

Yeah, it's genuinely a bit disheartening that that is pretty much the one time you get to make a major choice like that. Practically everything else seems pretty locked past that, with very little leeway. Makes me wonder what the point of the overall reputation system is, since what you did prior doesn't really matter in regards to the Chorus and the Disfavored (one will love you and the other hate you, based on that decision alone), and in relation to everything else, it's going to be decided by triggers anyway - unless you join the rebels (which at that point in the story feels a bit nonsensical, truth be told; it's far too early for such a decision, character-wise) you're only really going to get Wrath with the Unbroken, etc.

 

[Shinros]

im not so sure, the rebels seem to be the most developed path with the most flexibility and attention. Which could make sense if the developers decided at an early stage that the game would end with confrontation with Kyros. I think they heard all the apprehension from some people about being evil and playing for the bad guy and so focused primarily on the "good guy" approach to the detriment of other paths.

Eh I personally enjoyed the solo/anarchy route I quite enjoyed the insight belden mark gave me save tunon he would be the only guy who could guess kyros intentions for the tiers and reading his short story and his reasoning why he is helping you raises some implications of what the heck kyros is planning with the PC.

To me going solo was an enjoyable experience I would not make a whole topic detailing the disucssion if I did not feel it was not "developed".

It's just that different paths reveal different lore points or confirms them I feel.

 

[zorb25]

im not so sure, the rebels seem to be the most developed path with the most flexibility and attention. Which could make sense if the developers decided at an early stage that the game would end with confrontation with Kyros. I think they heard all the apprehension from some people about being evil and playing for the bad guy and so focused primarily on the "good guy" approach to the detriment of other paths.

I agree, that Rebeliion path is probably the best one narrative visee. But I think, it is caused by it being the original path of the game. It flows narratively better from beggining to end, but is kinda hhidden. It offers a lot of the promised context of hard choices affecting fate of Tiers and choosing who lives and who dies, with Anarchy serving as the"evil path". Archons feel like they were added later, when the game shifted on you being evil, but do not quite flow as well to the established story. They do not kinda work with the spires, while Rebellion and Anarchy do flow into the Spire part of the story more fluidly.

 

[thevmag]

well the disfavored are by far the best choice... and they lock you out of half the game xD

I let the Chorus throw their bodies against the gate, then claimed it for myself. Disfavored were wounded from practically facing the whole insurgency themselves, Chorus was too busy preserving their own numbers to help, and neither were willing to share the glory of victory. Letting the Chorus take the losses before claiming the keep for the only loyal servant of Kyros (ie, me) was the obvious choice for me

Doing a rebel run this time, feels like I have to go out of my way to do it. Not the most intuitive thing, aiding and abetting the enemy with little prompting and justification. The shock of my companions felt justified.

 

[Shinros]

I agree, that Rebeliion path is probably the best one narrative visee. But I think, it is caused by it being the original path of the game. It flows narratively better from beggining to end, but is kinda hhidden. It offers a lot of the promised context of hard choices affecting fate of Tiers and choosing who lives and who dies, with Anarchy serving as the"evil path". Archons feel like they were added later, when the game shifted on you being evil, but do not quite flow as well to the established story. They do not kinda work with the spires, while Rebellion and Anarchy do flow into the Spire part of the story more fluidly.

Er anarchy is not the "evil" path unless you want it to be while playing it I did not feel "evil" at all. My pc was quite lawful and loyal to kyros laws. Funny enough you are most likely working for the most loyal Archon out of all of them save tunon.

It starts out with mark saying right out the gate that you were right for punishing nerat and ashe's infantile antics with "Justice raw and bloody". Both armies were stupid if the PC was not there doing all the lifting the edict of execution would of ended you.

Even when you got to the spire the armies felt like fighting each other than fighting rebels I am not going tolerate or reward that nonsense. You are still part of the court all tunon does is pretty much give you a small warning while you work with mark in the shadows.

Why he is helping you I won't reveal due to spoilers.

You should see some of the stuff you do in the chorus run in the solo route you have more freedom to handle things "YOUR" way you can slay all before you or parley with certain factions. In my first route the bronze brotherhood and the forgebound really dig me and yet the sages did not because my PC felt their punishment was justified. Stalwart are stubborn no matter what you do.

Now I do think that the solo route does indeed reveal some implications of what kyros is planning and why kyros sent Ashe and nerat to the tiers.

Going rebel is so out of left field even your companions are like WTF man!?

 

[limaxophobiac]

Yeah I don't know why the game suddenly decides I work for Ashe after choosing them to storm the citadel. Just because I in that instance in my legal function as a fatebinder under Tunon rule in their favour doesn't mean I'm always going to do so in the future.

infertile antics.

I'm pretty sure the word you're looking for is infantile.

 

[limaxophobiac]

Player is not general anymore and got zero power over military matters. Whole reason player got to front lines was edict to proclaim. In other words fate binder is tolerated because he is Tunons ears and eyes but he cant order archons around.

Neither should they be able order you around, you are under Tunons authority, not theirs.

 

[Shinros]

Neither should they be able order you around, you are under Tunons authority, not theirs.

Eh thank you for the correction.

Tunon orders you to stay close with the army you sided with to get dirt on them.

Still as I was saying the solo/anarchy path is not evil unless you want it to be.

 

[zorb25]

Er anarchy is not the "evil" path unless you want it to be while playing it I did not feel "evil" at all. My pc was quite lawful and loyal to kyros laws. Funny enough you are most likely working for the most loyal Archon out of all of them save tunon.

It starts out with mark saying right out the gate that you were right for punishing nerat and ashe's infantile antics with "Justice raw and bloody". Both armies were stupid if the PC was not there doing all the lifting the edict of execution would of ended you.

Even when you got to the spire the armies felt like fighting each other than fighting rebels I am not going tolerate or reward that nonsense. You are still part of the court all tunon does is pretty much give you a small warning while you work with mark in the shadows.

Why he is helping you I won't reveal due to spoilers.

You should see some of the stuff you do in the chorus run in the solo route you have more freedom to handle things "YOUR" way you can slay all before you or parley with certain factions. In my first route the bronze brotherhood and the forgebound really dig me and yet the sages did not because my PC felt their punishment was justified. Stalwart are stubborn no matter what you do.

Now I do think that the solo route does indeed reveal some implications of what kyros is planning and why kyros sent Ashe and nerat to the tiers.

Going rebel is so out of left field even your companions are like WTF man!?

Which is Why, I put "Evil path" in the quotes. It is not so much evil as an remain loyal to evil regime and build your own power, but it is the more "evil" of the paths.