I'm disappointed with the quality control for the 2.2 Stellaris update. It's a buggy mess: balance issues, difficulty issues (generally too easy), trading bugs, terraforming bugs, and more. If I can uncover dozens of problems on my own in just a few days, I wonder how robust the quality assurance process was for the update. Paradox could be an amazing company if you'd put more emphasis on quality and less on speed.
Disappointed with Quality Control for 2.2
- Thread starter Braxtil
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Would you rather have an Open Beta released as a buggy mess, that is fixed in 1 month due to community testing massively speeding up the discovery of bugs, whilst still having the option to sticking with the previous version for as long as that takes.
or wait 1 (or more) months for the devs to work out all major flaws behind closed doors, being stuck with the previous version without any choice?
My only grief is that PDX does not explicitely label the DLC releases as Open Beta, which causes threads like this as people don't realize the point of the early release by themselves. Should consider making that one opt-in instead of the other way around.
or wait 1 (or more) months for the devs to work out all major flaws behind closed doors, being stuck with the previous version without any choice?
My only grief is that PDX does not explicitely label the DLC releases as Open Beta, which causes threads like this as people don't realize the point of the early release by themselves. Should consider making that one opt-in instead of the other way around.
I for one am glad I got the update, even with the bugs. You can always help by reporting bugs. That's more helpful than stating the obvious.
PDX could save themselves a lot of headache by moving to an open prerelease beta model. I recognize that PDX doesn't have the resources to test every aspect of the game before release in-house, but letting people self-select to play the testing branch (even if it's locked behind a pre-order) would eliminate 95% of butthurt flounce threads.
Yeah, it's entirely an issue of labeling and human psychology. We didn't get a "finished" build polished so naturally it must be a ripoff, even though the 2.1 version is still just as playable as it was two weeks ago.
Phrase it as an Open Beta and suddenly everyone will think it's Christmas and thank the devs endlessly for the freebee. Then they'll happily go bug hunting, rather than wasting time ranting angrily.
Use glavius AI mod. It fixes the AI's terribad logic without cheats, so the AI empires actually do stuff in the game.
And that's exactly the problem isn't it? It's not an open beta when it's not advertised as such. When people buy a finished product they expect sth that functions properly. Bugs aside, the performance issues in this version are unacceptable.
I'm amazed that 1 modder has managed to IDENTIFY & BEGIN FIXING the AI issues (in his spare time!) within days of the 2.2 release!
I understand the dev's have a lot of moving parts to balance and get right and the 2.2 overhaul was almost a complete rewrite of the game, but it just baffles me how getting the AI operable could be so massively overlooked. Especially as it's been an issue discussed for months and years previously by the community.
As great as 2.2 can (and will be) once the main issues are ironed out, currently the game offers little challenge and I personally feel no reason to play it until the AI is working correctly.
We play grand strategy games because, all in all, we are intelligent people who only get enjoyment out of a game if there is a significant challenge involved. Having a decent AI is ESSENTIAL and I give much gratitude to the modding community (especially Glavius) for shaping the game into what it really should be and the way I'm sure Wiz and the team envision it to be.
I understand the dev's have a lot of moving parts to balance and get right and the 2.2 overhaul was almost a complete rewrite of the game, but it just baffles me how getting the AI operable could be so massively overlooked. Especially as it's been an issue discussed for months and years previously by the community.
As great as 2.2 can (and will be) once the main issues are ironed out, currently the game offers little challenge and I personally feel no reason to play it until the AI is working correctly.
We play grand strategy games because, all in all, we are intelligent people who only get enjoyment out of a game if there is a significant challenge involved. Having a decent AI is ESSENTIAL and I give much gratitude to the modding community (especially Glavius) for shaping the game into what it really should be and the way I'm sure Wiz and the team envision it to be.
It was the same in EU4 land. Maybe still the same -- I stopped updating the game probably a year ago, so don't know for sure.
I'm following simple rule of thumb with all major releases from PDX: ignore them until they have at least one, but in recent times -- two bug fixing patches. This way most obvious and glaring problems are ironed out.
Could you point me to any info where the developers say that this was an early release of 2.2?
I am a loyal paradox customer / supporter, but I do have an issue with releasing a buggy, unbalanced patch, especially when it comes with a paid expansion. I recommended to a friend that he buys the game when the new expansion / patch is released because I knew that the economy system was going to change significantly. However, in hindsight, I should have told him to wait a few weeks for the issues to be ironed out. If the best course of action before buying a game / dlc is to wait for the issues to be ironed out, then there is something wrong with the way the release is handled.
As a veteran of paradox games I personally don't mind going through the teething issues of a new patch. But Paradox shouldn't expect their entire fan base to be that understanding, and they certainly shouldn't expect new comers to the game to be okay with performance issues, bugs, and exploits.
Why not have an official public beta for the patch without dlc? Many of us are more than happy to help with the process of getting the patch right for an early peak at new mechanics.
As a veteran of paradox games I personally don't mind going through the teething issues of a new patch. But Paradox shouldn't expect their entire fan base to be that understanding, and they certainly shouldn't expect new comers to the game to be okay with performance issues, bugs, and exploits.
Why not have an official public beta for the patch without dlc? Many of us are more than happy to help with the process of getting the patch right for an early peak at new mechanics.
Sorry, but as a veteran of paradox games I do mind. Bugs and exploits are one thing, but a game that turns into a slideshow within 100 years on a €3000 system is another.
With all the huge changes and knowing what happened in the past with smaller expansions, what do some people expect? As suggested here, if you want a stable release, play the previous version a bit more. If you want to be part of the solution, install the current beta and help report bugs or confirm them. Or play another game.
And as mentioned somewhere, PDX is going to do some more bugfixing and performance work in the coming weeks and months.
And as mentioned somewhere, PDX is going to do some more bugfixing and performance work in the coming weeks and months.
The thing that sticks in my craw is paying money to beta test something.
When i pay for something, i dont expect it to be only half working. My car works and does its job baring an individual parts failure for years. (yeah i know you get what you pay for)
If PDX released an open beta ahead of time, people could find the problems, get them sorted, modders could design their mods ahead of time to be ready at release and THEN PDX could sell the finished product.
As it is, i am paying them to spend my my time (which i dont have much of) during the few days i have off, to repeatedly restart the game, find and report bugs for them to be fixed, long after i have the time to supposedly enjoy the product i have already paid for.
Why hasnt this community testing been done already in an open beta before release?
Why cant i enjoy the product ive paid for in a complete and fun way?
Why do they release something so fking problematic and buggy right before their programmers leave for other projects and go away? on holidays?
I mean, who thinks of these timetables? who then says, 'hey yeah, thats a great idea' and who then after that, thinks its fine to take peoples money and release a completely broken and bugged experience?
If i did that at my work, id have been fired, and hauled before a Judge and prosecuted for fraud + knowingly endangering life amoungst other things.
There is something fundamentally wrong with the overall thinking of not only the team leads, but the overall management of this company, dev team and the product they are selling.
When i pay for something, i dont expect it to be only half working. My car works and does its job baring an individual parts failure for years. (yeah i know you get what you pay for)
If PDX released an open beta ahead of time, people could find the problems, get them sorted, modders could design their mods ahead of time to be ready at release and THEN PDX could sell the finished product.
As it is, i am paying them to spend my my time (which i dont have much of) during the few days i have off, to repeatedly restart the game, find and report bugs for them to be fixed, long after i have the time to supposedly enjoy the product i have already paid for.
Why hasnt this community testing been done already in an open beta before release?
Why cant i enjoy the product ive paid for in a complete and fun way?
Why do they release something so fking problematic and buggy right before their programmers leave for other projects and go away? on holidays?
I mean, who thinks of these timetables? who then says, 'hey yeah, thats a great idea' and who then after that, thinks its fine to take peoples money and release a completely broken and bugged experience?
If i did that at my work, id have been fired, and hauled before a Judge and prosecuted for fraud + knowingly endangering life amoungst other things.
There is something fundamentally wrong with the overall thinking of not only the team leads, but the overall management of this company, dev team and the product they are selling.
Dude, I said that I *personally* don't mind, but that paradox shouldn't expect their entire fan base to be that understanding, let alone new comers to the game. Why not read a message properly before you jump to disagree?
Something seems a little off when people expect Paradox to release buggy games.
Shouldn't the solution be for Paradox to figure out what's up with their internal development cycle that apparently leaves them little time to do bug-tests and adjust accordingly?
PDX gets away with a lot of poor practices that most companies wouldn't.
That collective goodwill allowed them to redo Stellaris into 2.0 and 2.2, but they should start changing the way things are. Not playing for two weeks of a new release, because it is a buggy mess of bum-rushed production is not fun. So is being a semi-tester without any other option except not playing.
Yes you are right about that. But as it is now and has been, people should already know what is coming and not be surprised about it. I fully understand people expecting something else. I don't mind getting my hands early on it instead of having to wait 2 more months and then some.
You personally don't mind. I personally mind. Why do you take it as a disagreement and not a reinforcement? If anything I'm proving your point.
I know right. An angry customer in my field means working day in/day out until the issue is fixed.
Some people expect a properly functional product. Some people expect, when buying a game to spend more time having fun than dealing with its issues. Perhaps if this is an open beta, don't sell it as a finished product?
Because you said "Sorry, but as a veteran of paradox games I do mind," which sounds like you were trying to draw a contrast, even though I explicitly said lots of fans would mind. In any case, let's move on.