Diplomatic Relations are a contributing factor to late-game drudgery

[TheBloke]

Okay I see what you mean now.

That's easy enough to alter - make the size of your country multiple the cost of any relationship, in addition to the previous larger-nations-cost-more as a target change.. So if you're much larger, any given relationship will cost you a lot more than it would for a smaller nation.

So say you have A, size 10 base tax, and B, size 10 base tax, and C, size 50 base tax, and D, size 50 base tax.

A - B would cost (made up numbers) 25% relations for A
A - C would cost 50% relations (higher because C is large and valuable) for A
C - D would cost 100% relations (higher because D is large and valuable and because C itself is large) for C

Of course, then the whole idea set starts to get relatively complex and potentially inelegant. But at least it would be something.

Yeah that sounds perfect.

I agree it gets a bit more complex. Then again I look at some mechanics in this game, like production goods creating trade value which leads into production income (except when it's tariffs), with multiple overlapping building types that manipulate this income by modifying different points in one of a couple of different process flows, using varying modifiers which might be additive or multiplicative, and resulting in a simple question like "how much will this building increase my income by?" requiring an Excel spreadsheet.. and I think complex is probably not a problem

 

[Xara]

FYI, Nationalists will not spawn without cores.

Not entirely true, some can create new cores because of culture clash. Fez doesn't exist in any form in a 1444 start, yet Ceuta Berber revolts will create them. I believe there are other nations where that can occur, or ones that are keyed to do so. Saxony is another example, though I've only seen it once, and I forget the nation that popped up there.

Doesn't happen later on when culture group cores are eliminated, of course.

 

[TheBloke]

Maybe fixing the cores bug will help with a lot of that. A huge reason why blobbing is so prevalant is because all the cores dissapear, leaving many countries with only having one core on its territory thus making it highly unlikely for a country to balkanize or break apart. FYI, Nationalists will not spawn without cores.

The bug fix will put things back the way they were as of 1.2. Which of course is a much better than the current 1.3 bugged cores. But the late game will still have far fewer cores, with swathes of them disappearing starting 1594, and majority gone by the 1700s.

For me this is one of the least understandable mechanics. It makes little historical sense, and even less gameplay sense. Fortunately though it's also incredibly easy to change in a mod, which is exactly what I'm now doing. Put the mod in to fix the current bug, but will now continue playing with it permanently I think.

I do find this feature rather strange and ironic in the context of the rest of the game: given how so many mechanics of the game seem to be about anti-blobbing (often going too far, in the views of many of us,) it's weird that this feature exists that so heavily promotes blobbing. Or at least, heavily limits the ability to impact existing blobs after an arbitrary cut-off point. Maybe it was meant to be a counter-balance, in which case.. wow.. talk about a compromise being worst of all worlds!

 

[Novacat]

EU4's mechanics are not so much anti-blobbing as they are static gameplay. It takes centuries to build up a blob, but it also takes centuries to lose a blob. Gameplay in EU4 in general is abysmally slow.

This is almost the polar opposite of CK2 where you can conquer the world in a single generation (There is actually a CK2 AAR where someone conquers everything in 25 years) but at the same time you can lose it all in a single generation too.

 

[pkderek]

I don't agree with the proposed solution. I for one thought I was done with fractions after high school, I'm not sure many would want that also. I also don't think there's anything inherently wrong with the current system, it's just that there are other issues at work that make it inefficient.

Cores disappear way too easily. There's no way to unblob after a certain point.
**Culture change is way too prevalent. One time Bohemia inherited Burgundy and I thought *COOL*! Couple decades later and the entire Netherlands was Czech. Yeah... no. This also leads to core disappearing. I think this is the biggest problem. Culture change is pretty much the only diplomatic point sink in the game. There's just no other option to spend it, same with military tech. There's only so many harsh treatments you can do... On the other hand Administrative Points tend to be in short supply. Coring, reduce inflation, stability...**
Lagging in tech is way too beneficial. That also ties into vassal cheesing. If you can afford falling behind, the bonuses are too good to pass up and you can spend the difference in ideas/buildings/relations which give you a huge edge vs the AI.
Coalitions just aren't that good. You have to straight up use Conquest CB and eat way more than you should for a decent Coalition to form vs you. Even then it's more annoying than challenging, especially as you learn more about game mechanics and the AI.
There should be more diplomatic options. Currently there's only alliance or no alliance. I'm sure this will be fleshed out in a DLC but until then...

 

[billclintonmask]

Real easy: if base tax is >50 (example # only) it costs 2 relations. If base tax < 50 it costs 1 relation.

 

[rustic]

Personally, before going off the rails and changing everything about how relations work, I'd start by reducing/eliminating some of the ideas that add relations.

I've had this idea too (The number of alliances is TOO DAMN HIGH - might have come out as a bit of a rant, tho) and I agree that it would be a good starting point. Maybe that will mitigate the problem enough, if not, it can be continued from there.

 

[Dakilla TM]

The war of the Spanish succession?

That didn't involve a worldwide foray of powers. If that war happened in EU4, Spain would have allies like Mamlukes, Uzbek, Japan, and Savoy. See something weird on that list?