Diplomacy, the trivial mechanic for provoking civil wars

[Xuanzue]

The mechanic is so trivial that It really feels incomplete, and I expected it was going to be improved in the 1st or 2nd patch.

You can basically play Siam and provoke civil wars in England and USA just pressing 2 buttons. Haiti also can do the same to the Soviet Union. This is not plausible at all.

The 2 buttons are:

• Boost party popularity: Just press 1 button and make Germany communist. It is too effective because there is not a real price to pay for it.

1. You pretty quickly will have a surplus of political mana
2. AI can't defend against it with the correct advisories.
3. There are not Pops here so the model is so trivial that the difficulty in making Bolivia Communist is the same that making USA fascist.

• Stage a coup: Press 1 button and send arms from the WWI, and in some time there will be a civil war.

1. Neither the AI, or the player have a way to stop this coup. What about executing those who instigate the coup?, To ban the party? to send them to Siberia?
2. Peru is sending arms for the civil war in Japan, and the Japanese Army allows it.

I would like to know what are the plans paradox has in this field. Will have to wait for a DLC with spies to see this fixed?

In Strategic Command (the game) To convince Turkey or Spain to join the axis was really hard, and you were lucky if convinced only 1 of them.

In HOI4, you can make all the great powers minions of your faction just using this incomplete mechanic.

 

[leazriz]

I think the dev made it trivial on purpose, to allow players to experiment with unhistorical scenarios (what if England was facist ...). However I think players should make mods to experiment it, and it should be harder in the vanilla game.

The single player game has clearly a lot of broken features that a player can exploit too easily but the balancing is still goin on.

 

[Xuanzue]

there are not enough scopes to fix it with mods.

for example remove_guarantee is not a thing yet.

maybe if they add: has_coup_in_progress and some primitive sphere system things can be improved via mods.

 

[Baron Jukaga]

Minors and micro-minors shouldn't be able to influence the majors at all. It's silly enough that Tibet or Yemen can get 4-5 research slots with a few focus researches, being able to topple major governments is too much. A 'make minors minor again' mod that strips them of most PP, tech slots and the better generic foci would be welcome.

 

[Xuanzue]

Lend and lease also must be measured better. you gain the same diplomatic opinion sending 10 weapons that 100 airplanes.
Communist China can't receive lend and lease from USSR because is tied to convoys

I've seen some people suggesting dynamic civil wars, but the problem is that without pops, it ends modeled poorly because the few variables are national unity and party popularity.

 

[potski]

Minors and micro-minors shouldn't be able to influence the majors at all. It's silly enough that Tibet or Yemen can get 4-5 research slots with a few focus researches, being able to topple major governments is too much. A 'make minors minor again' mod that strips them of most PP, tech slots and the better generic foci would be welcome.

Don't they start with only two research slots? So they can normally only gain one more from NFs, three in total. Unless they manage to obtain more than 50 factories, then the NF for a fourth slot becomes available. Never five, and only four well behind the starting majors.

 

[Xuanzue]

So, what are the plans for 1.4?

Will diplomacy stay all whole year in the trivial state?

 

[Morboth]

So, what are the plans for 1.4?

Will diplomacy stay all whole year in the trivial state?

Even though I must say I do concur with you regarding the unfathomable mechanic that allows unrealistic scenarios as the one depicted above, it is a feature the AI - AFAIK - doesn't use, and it's entirely up to you whether to use it yourself, or not.

I, for one, despite being locked in a conflict of titanic proportions, won't resort to igniting civil wars in unlikely countries/majors. I.e., it's plausible for me as the USSR to ignite a civil war in Finland, but not one in the USA. I even found Canada's sponsoring of Synarchist Mexico ludicrous - however enjoyable.

House rules are the way to go.

 

[FrancescoT]

Necromancy is not allowed. A more than a month old thread should rest in peace.

Closed.