"Different culture" penalty is back - do you like that?

[Krajzen]

Personally I have never really liked universal and stable opinion penalty for every culture in ck2. Medieval world was really damn mixed, even if we implement some xenophobia shouldn't it be different depending on the kind of culture? I'd say medieval Polish king should have nearly zero cultural penalty with some of his closest neighbor, some penalty for further European Christians and higher with very exotic Christians and everybody else.

Whatever happens, I just hope different culture isn't as big pain as in ck2, where mechanics discouraged having landed characters, guardians and whoever of a different culture.

What do you think?

 

[Zhetone]

especially among nobility, if a Polish King marries a princess from Bohemia why is there a culture penalty? No one would even care in this time period

 

[Denkt]

It is probably needed in order to keep large empires at bay. But we don't know how big it is or even if it Always apply so it is a bit hard to tell how impactful it will be.

 

[Kaiserjagen]

No one would even care in this time period

I think this is a pretty common myth and ahistorical claim. The period may have lacked modern conceptions of ethnic groups and nation states but xenophobia was absolutely commonplace if not a downright expected norm pretty much everywhere.

 

[borgobello7]

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/cosmopolitan-and-insular-traits.1299518/

I posted something related to culture a couple months ago

 

[viola]

I think the opinion malus for different culture was pretty minor (-10, maybe less for same culture group), it's a reasonably small malus to have between characters that speak different languages and sometimes have pretty different customs and that's easily trumped by other, far more important factors (religion, personality, personal relations).

 

[treb]

I think the opinion malus for different culture was pretty minor (-10, maybe less for same culture group), it's a reasonably small malus to have between characters that speak different languages and sometimes have pretty different customs and that's easily trumped by other, far more important factors (religion, personality, personal relations).

its the lopsided way it functions though, In ck2 the English get less of a penalty occupying the Netherlands than they do occupying Wales... Id like to see a mechanic where over time you can lessen or aggravate the malus depending on how you treat the other cultures of your kingdoms.

 

[durbal]

its the lopsided way it functions though, In ck2 the English get less of a penalty occupying the Netherlands than they do occupying Wales... Id like to see a mechanic where over time you can lessen or aggravate the malus depending on how you treat the other cultures of your kingdoms.

Is that really all that strange though?

 

[Dayvit78]

We have new mechanics in CK3 with "control" and "popular opinion." If you treat the locals well, or if you are aligned in culture/language, maybe that will impact popular opinion. Maybe there will be some impact of culture and religion on the ability to generate control or popular opinion. Some cultures are more rebellious? It's just speculation but this new dynamic gives more choices.

 

[Atalvyr]

Looks like characters can now build "Fascination" with certain cultures. If this means that your Bohemian princess could learn enough Polish to be able to fit in and eliminate the cultural opinion penalty, this is a pretty good solution.

Hopefully it also applies to the local population, so you could eventually learn enough about the local language and customs for the people to accept your rule, instead of having to make all of them adopt your own customs (though that is still an option too).

 

[Denkt]

Given it is called scientific sound more like it have something to do with the technology system and there is Culture technology in CK2.

 

[Serenity84]

That's why culture groups exists. Less penalties or sometimes mabye none in some cases within the same group. But higher without.

 

[Ezumiyr]

Given it is called scientific sound more like it have something to do with the technology system and there is Culture technology in CK2.

Could also be a mean of absorbing culture-specific mechanics for your character.

 

[Delta5ff]

its the lopsided way it functions though, In ck2 the English get less of a penalty occupying the Netherlands than they do occupying Wales... Id like to see a mechanic where over time you can lessen or aggravate the malus depending on how you treat the other cultures of your kingdoms.

my answer to that is that the welsh still hate the English so that kind of fits really well

 

[Badesumofu]

my answer to that is that the welsh still hate the English so that kind of fits really well

How true is that, though? I mean it not as if there is much of a Welsh independence movement. Genuinely asking because I don't really have much idea beyond my ability to read opinion polls and I was surprised by your comment.

 

[Delta5ff]

How true is that, though? I mean it not as if there is much of a Welsh independence movement. Genuinely asking because I don't really have much idea beyond my ability to read opinion polls and I was surprised by your comment.

It's not something I have ever personally looked into, but from my understanding there is still bad blood on the welsh side, I heard many stories of English people visiting small welsh towns and such and as soon as they realise that they are English they will start speaking exclusively in welsh pretending they don't speak English. I'm English and have heard from many that the welsh are still not fond of us but nothing that I would consider factual and researched enough to state as absolute fact.

So to me the opinion malus seems perfectly appropriate. same for the Irish and Scottish. Historical we English have spent rather a lot of time trying to forcefully bring the Britannic Isles under the same ruler creating a lot of bias through personal conflict that nations further apart that have never interacted would not have.

 

[elvain]

How true is that, though? I mean it not as if there is much of a Welsh independence movement. Genuinely asking because I don't really have much idea beyond my ability to read opinion polls and I was surprised by your comment.

You don't really need an independence movement or this kind of stuff to genuinely hate somebody.
Or to be more precise, to feel a difference and express negative stance against them

 

[treb]

my answer to that is that the welsh still hate the English so that kind of fits really well

the Welsh don't hate, hate the English, there is this sort of national batter inside the UK, the Welsh all shag sheep, the Scottish are perpetually angry drunks, the Irish are stupid and the English are all cruel and uncaring. But outside the banter, jokes and stereotyping there really isn't that much friction, I've never encountered any real hatred myself and I've been to all the constituent countries of the UK.

 

[Badesumofu]

You don't really need an independence movement or this kind of stuff to genuinely hate somebody.
Or to be more precise, to feel a difference and express negative stance against them

It's not required, but it's a reasonable indicator I would have thought. If you're Welsh and you hate the English then it seems likely that you wouldn't want your nation to be part of a union with them. Perhaps the hatred is there but they consider that being part of the UK is to their benefit and thus want to remain anyway, I don't know, that's why I asked.

 

[Limbojack]

I don't really mind that penalty, as it's not too unlikely. I mean, the Anglo-Saxons weren't thrilled about being ruled by French-speaking Normans, so this just adds a bit of extra challenge. But, it should be far lower than the wrong religion penalty, which was a much bigger deal.