Did Austria ever attempt to annex Bavaria?

[RedRalphWiggum]

I understand that being Emperor limited Austria in many ways as to where it could expend, but it did in fact expand within the HRE several times. However, I don't think it ever tried to take all or parts of Bavaria. Intuitively, good agricultural land full of Catholic Germans of a similar culture would seem like an obvious goal for Vienna; why didn't they ever attempt it?

 

[lila-laune-bär]

They did.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Bavarian_Succession

 

[RedRalphWiggum]

They did.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Bavarian_Succession

My jaysus! How could I have never heard of this? thank you, my chum

 

[Nick Giordano]

They did.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Bavarian_Succession

The Prussians always ruin everything.

 

[Finnish Dragon]

The Prussians always ruin everything.

That must be true from the Austrian point of view. First "Old Fritz" stole Silesia and then he prevented Austrian gaining the Duchy of Bavaria.

 

[krieger11b]

That must be true from the Austrian point of view. First "Old Fritz" stole Silesia and then he prevented Austrian gaining the Duchy of Bavaria.

Then Emperor Wilhelm II (a Prussian Hohenzollern) made the spectacular mistake of giving an unconditional support of Austria-Hungary with Serbia which lead to A-H going completely stupid (granted their fault) with their ultimatem with Serbia that was meant to be rejected so they delcared war setting off the shitstorm known as WW1, thanks Prussia!

 

[Arilou]

The Prussians always ruin everything.

The world would have been so much better without Prussia!

 

[krieger11b]

The world would have been so much better without Prussia!

Maybe, imagine without them Austria would have been an even more massive white blob. Who knows what would have happened then? Likely they still get stomped over by Napoleon, then who knows what the Treaty Of Paris would have looked like then?

 

[DarthJF]

The world would have been so much better without Prussia!

Prussia would have been so much better without the world!

 

[Cèsar de Quart]

The world would have been so much better without Prussia!

They should have remained the Teutonic Knights. Many more levels of cool. When you think that Frederick the Great's army is, by heritage, the Protestant Teutonic Order...

By the way, had the Teutonic Knights remained, well, Knights, we may have now the same feeling I have whenever I see an ambulance with the cross of Malta. You know:

 

[Pellaken]

Repeatedly, AFAIK, this was one of the main objectives for a very long time, which is why I find the thread title so strange; akin to "did Germany and France ever go to war?"

 

[Arilou]

They should have remained the Teutonic Knights. Many more levels of cool. When you think that Frederick the Great's army is, by heritage, the Protestant Teutonic Order...

Err, no?

The Prussian Kingdom comes from the Electorate of Brandenburg, not the Teutonic Order. (although they annexed a lot of the order's lans)

 

[Cèsar de Quart]

Err, no?

The Prussian Kingdom comes from the Electorate of Brandenburg, not the Teutonic Order. (although they annexed a lot of the order's lans)

After the Knights' defeat and vassalage by the Poles, the last Grandmaster, Albert of Brandenburg, converted to Lutheranism around 1515 and got his uncle the King of Poland to recognise him as hereditary Duke of Prussia. He secularised the Order's lands and this marks the beginning of modern Prussia.

Yes, the union with Brandenburg was a turning point, but you can't argue against Prussia being born from the Teutonic Order.

 

[Nascaram]

After the Knights' defeat and vassalage by the Poles, the last Grandmaster, Albert of Brandenburg, converted to Lutheranism around 1515 and got his uncle the King of Poland to recognise him as hereditary Duke of Prussia. He secularised the Order's lands and this marks the beginning of modern Prussia.

Yes, the union with Brandenburg was a turning point, but you can't argue against Prussia being born from the Teutonic Order.

Just an FYI, but the Teutonic Order still exists.

 

[Cavalry]

Then Emperor Wilhelm II (a Prussian Hohenzollern) made the spectacular mistake of giving an unconditional support of Austria-Hungary with Serbia which lead to A-H going completely stupid (granted their fault) with their ultimatem with Serbia that was meant to be rejected so they delcared war setting off the shitstorm known as WW1, thanks Prussia!

It was discussed here. A-H is a dog of Prussia, not the reverse. Prussia stopped A-H once, but the second time he release A-H to jump on Serbia, because he wanted war with France.
It was A-H that unbelievabled jumping on Serbia and ignoring Russia, France, British, Italia!

 

[Andrelvis]

After the Knights' defeat and vassalage by the Poles, the last Grandmaster, Albert of Brandenburg, converted to Lutheranism around 1515 and got his uncle the King of Poland to recognise him as hereditary Duke of Prussia. He secularised the Order's lands and this marks the beginning of modern Prussia.

Yes, the union with Brandenburg was a turning point, but you can't argue against Prussia being born from the Teutonic Order.

Arilou's point holds a lot of truth, though. Prussia was a peripheral part of the Kingdom of Prussia, which was important largely for being outside the HRE and thus enabling the Prince-Elector to become a king, rather than due to the actual importance of the territory in the polity. Despite the name, the predecessor of the polity known as "Kingdom of Prussia" was Brandenburg, not the Duchy of Prussia.

 

[Cèsar de Quart]

Just an FYI, but the Teutonic Order still exists.

I know, but I've never seen their ambulances go around any given day, or stumbled upon their ads in the metro, or their sees in the nice quarters of the biggest European cities, which is what makes a historical fossile like the Order of Malta such an interesting sight.

Arilou's point holds a lot of truth, though. Prussia was a peripheral part of the Kingdom of Prussia, which was important largely for being outside the HRE and thus enabling the Prince-Elector to become a king, rather than due to the actual importance of the territory in the polity. Despite the name, the predecessor of the polity known as "Kingdom of Prussia" was Brandenburg, not the Duchy of Prussia.

It's true, I thought Arilou was negating the connection Teutonic Order - Duchy of Prussia, which is what surprised me. While Brandenburg did become the center of the future Prussian kingdom and also of the former Brandenburg-Prussia union, it's the secularisation of Prussia under Grandmaster Albert, a Hohenzollern himself, that made the union, and the kingdom, possible. There's no Kingdom of Prussia without the Knights, but there could have been a kingdom of Prussia without Brandenburg. At least, I see it that way. But it's not my area of expertise, so I accept your judgement.

 

[La Toscana]

Poor Austrians a thread about them and Bavaria inevitably ends up about Prussia.

 

[Culise]

Poor Austrians a thread about them and Bavaria inevitably ends up about Prussia.

It's those perfidious Prussians' fault, always stealing everything that has to do with anything in the Germanies. ^_^

 

[Avernite]

It's those perfidious Prussians' fault, always stealing everything that has to do with anything in the Germanies. ^_^

It's not like the Habsburgs didn't do that kind of thing.

HRE? Wittelsbach first, Habsburg later.
Netherlands? Wittelsbach first, Habsburg later.

And let's not even begin to list what they stole from the Luxemburgers.