Developer Diary 8 – The Artisan

[Jolt]

Just a question for King.

You say in this thread that artisans count as poor POPs. The screenshot of the spending screen you gave in dev diary 7 shows something which I conclude is the artisan among the middle class (rightmost guy).

Did things change since that screenshot was taken? Or is it possible that a POP type changes its social stratum during the game? Or am I simply misreading the picture?

Nice catch. I'm still pretty amazed at the polishing of the menu. The 2D artist really deserves the greatest of congratulations.

This is a really welcome inovation, but I do have a question:

What's stopping all the artisans of the planet from producing the same thing at the same time? After all, if they're going for profit, then all of them should build whatever is the most expensive product at the world market, and that month sees a booming suply of it, so next month they all change to whatever is the new most expensive good at the work market, etc etc.

Do not forget artisans are also limited by their country's technological advance. So Chinese Artisans certainly won't be producing the same thing as Ottoman Artisans, who won't be producing the same thing as German Artisans.

 

[Gambrinus]

The Artisan POP looks very promising. I also have to chime in with those that praise the new map. And I notice that state borders now are clearly visible. No more wild guessing which provinces to claim in peace deals

 

[Emp_Palpatine]

Shouldn't Istanbul named Constantinople?

was officially renamed to its modern Turkish name Istanbul in 1930[2][3] with the Turkish Postal Service Law, as part of Atatürk's national reform

Check this also.

 

[KonradRichtmark]

Shouldn't Istanbul named Constantinople?

It should. Ditto for Izmir/Smyrna.

 

[Barón Rojo]

I see the artisans as liberals, as they are interested in extending the vote rights to them, and taking part in the liberals revolutions at the beginning of the game. I don't see any good reason for a artisan to be conservative in a country without universal suffrage.

 

[Txini]

Shouldn't Istanbul named Constantinople?



Check this also.

In fact should be Konstantiniyye, but Istambul is not wrong either

 

[daemonofdecay]

Shouldn't Istanbul named Constantinople?

Yeah it probably should, but then the question is a little complicated. . .

From the same article:

İstanbul was the common name for the city in normal speech in Turkish even since before the conquest of 1453, but in official use by the Ottoman authorities, other names such as Kostantiniyye were preferred in certain contexts. Thus, Kostantiniyye was used on coinage up to the late 17th and then again in the 19th century.

and

At the same time, however, İstanbul too was part of the official language, for instance in the titles of the highest Ottoman military commander (İstanbul ağası) and the highest civil magistrate (İstanbul efendisi) of the city. İstanbul and several other variant forms of the same name were also widely used in Ottoman literature and poetry.

So I guess it depends on how provinces will be named. Will it be Moscow or Moskva?

Personally I think it should be Kostantiniyye. That seems to me to be the most commonly used spelling amongst the official Ottoman documents and such.

But then, there could be naming disputes over a number of provinces in Paradox games, so its good enough as Istanbul for me.

 

[telesien]

Sorry if I will repeat something, but I don't have time to read the whole thread and later will be too late to ask something.

Wouldn't it be more realistic to make artisans the middle class? After all traditionally guild members like artisans were fundation of middle class and emerging power of cities. Also their promotion/demotion to capitalists/craftsman would make more sense.

Artisans should add something to research (as was already said) and the negative effect of industrialisation should be negated by increasing number of clercs.

And the quiestion: If I understand it correctly, the whole chunk of xxxx artisans would each month decide what to produce and then make just one single good? Wouldn't it be better to make them work on bigger number of goods in cetain proportion? It won't make big difference for big countries, but this way small countries are forced to buy on world market more.

 

[unmerged(45977)]

Let say I play china can I stop the flooding of foreign goods by having high tolls?

As POPS buy from the world market this sounds counter productive. Your artisans will be having a harder time buying their raw materials. An export subsidy seems better as their goods will be cheaper/they will make more profit.

 

[King]

Let say I play china can I stop the flooding of foreign goods by having high tolls?

That might work, although it might leave the rest of your population a bit upset because they can't get enough goods.

 

[King]

I thought they were middle class pops and that he said that poor pops may be able to become artisans if they acquire enough money in the early game.

yes actually they are, my earlier post was wrong.

 

[King]

I see the artisans as liberals, as they are interested in extending the vote rights to them, and taking part in the liberals revolutions at the beginning of the game. I don't see any good reason for a artisan to be conservative in a country without universal suffrage.

Who said they couldn't be liberal?

 

[th3freakie]

That might work, although it might leave the rest of your population a bit upset because they can't get enough goods.

How will the AI deal with tolls by the way? Will there be a generic behaviour, will it depend on party policy, will it respond to other nation's tolls?

 

[King]

How will the AI deal with tolls by the way? Will there be a generic behaviour, will it depend on party policy, will it respond to other nation's tolls?

The AI isn't done yet so I can't say.

 

[Gaute65]

I would like to have the interface on the left side of the screen, just like in Vicky1.

I have a widescreen monitor, and I think it's looks much better and it's easy to use. I'm using Opera and have the tabs on the left side.

And please make it possible to hide the minimap.

 

[Zuckergußgebäck]

All excellent! Although I do disagree that artisans shouldn't be affected by tech. France is the prime example where production rates were at least on par with Britain during the industrial revolution, despite France keeping an artisanal mode of production. This was mainly due to labor reorganization and effectivization rather than industrialization.

It might therefore make some sense to increase artisanal efficiency through tech so that you might keep up with the industralized countries in the short run through clever use of artisans, but that you will eventually end up in a dead end and fall behind.

 

[Tommy4ever]

Artisans sound like a fantastic idea! They will add some realism and also help with the immersion factor which is so important. We might also get a chance to have some Fascist states going around as well (they were very rare in Vicki1)

 

[unmerged(77251)]

Sounds very promising. I hope those new guys will do their job properly, and not just turn to the glass/liquor buisness as we witnessed capitalists in Vicky 1 ...

 

[BlueWarrior]

Very nice - a very good idea.

 

[Justinian7]

The map is looking good, well done to your 2D artist. I hope the white pixels around the coastline (e.g. Khalkis) will be cleaned up before the game is released though.