[Dev Team] 2.6.3 Patch Released  [checksum ae56]

[Dev Team] 2.6.3 Patch Released [checksum ae56]

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Varatus

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Guys, I'm sorry to be the first to jump in and start complaining, but are Ethics ACTUALLY FIXED?

Reason I'm capsing is, it's the third announcement you guys have made stating they'd been fixed, and they still failed to shift towards the expected quotas.

More importantly, suppressing factions doesn't do a thing: my suppressed Spiritualist faction gets bigger than most other "minor" factions (aka the minor Ethic faction, and other minor factions like Xenophiles or Xenophobes that pop up due to bordering events, diplomacy, etc).

Edit: to clarify, I haven't tested it after this announcement yet, so I'll give it a shot later today through the Peaceful Unification origin, then Void-Dwellers for 100 years, and come back with the results. D:
and? did it?
 

Mescaline

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and? did it?
Sorry, I gave up on the idea of testing for the time being. Others reported that for the most part, Ethics weren't working for them either. A couple of players (namely klc123 or something like that) noted that there were minor, barely noticeable changes but nothing beyond that.

So I guess I'm just on standby with Stelly until I see "ethics fixed" in the patchnotes again. >.>
 

bbswfan

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I'm not accustomed to using hangars yet - I'm a relic from the days of corvette swarm spam, haven't really learned to use larger ships except as artillery platforms. Any tips or links so I can learn?
Quick side note before I get into my Stellaris obsession, if you like corvette missile swarms, I actually like missile cruiser layouts. 1 of 2 cruiser configurations that I even think about using.

So the devs made a few changes to Strike Craft that make them much more useful than they used to be, two things in particular.

They changed the range at which they launch from their carriers by a significant amount, meaning they have more time to deliver their damage. Strike craft now launch even before artillery is in range, they still don't hold a candle to the effectiveness of artillery, but launching sooner allows them to get out in front of their carriers much faster, allowing them to intercept the enemy more effectively. Sometimes strike craft are now the alpha strike on the enemy even before Perdition Beams depending on how far apart the fleets are when combat starts. On top of that, strike craft are now significantly faster than they used to be, have significantly higher evasion than they used to, and have more health. Destroyed strike craft also respawn faster from their carriers, which is nice, but doesn't mean all that much except for upgraded starbases with hangar modules because fights don't usually last long enough for the respawned strike craft to make a meaningful difference in a fight before their carrier is destroyed, and all of them with it.

The second equally important big change was an overhaul of strike craft target priority. Before strike craft would shoot at some missiles, then prioritize battleships where their laughable damage would do little more than tickle them while getting torn apart by point defense, and while the rest of the enemy fleet eviscerated their carriers. Now strike craft work as mobile, accurate, point defense for their carriers first, prioritizing missiles and other strike craft, THEN instead of tickling battleships, they prioritize corvettes! This is a huge change. Their accuracy and tracking serves as a counter to corvettes, their damage in numbers is significant enough to defeat corvettes instead of doing nothing to battleships, and while prioritizing the smaller ships first, they handle the evasion tanks that their carriers have the hardest time targeting, eliminate missile platforms that are dangerous to their carriers, and help eliminate the main point defense platforms that do the most damage to them. Win win win.

Sound a little OP? Don't worry, a few glances at your after battle damage summary will dispel that rather quickly :) Strike craft are still laughably ineffective at delivering damage on ships, except for corvettes which they do ok against if combat is long enough, but they are a MUCH more effective point defense than they used to be, so much so that I don't see as much a need to carry PD destroyers or PD corvettes. They are noticeably better at actually countering missiles and strike craft in the after battle report, and that damage doesn't show up in the damage break down.

Artillery is still the king of the space battlefield, especially once you get into repeatable techs, and if you get lucky and get the Null Void Beam tech, that's pretty much the "I win" button with Neutron Launchers and Tachyon Lances. The alpha strike, plus fast reloads make building anything other than artillery based fleets silly, especially now that a Juggernaut has an aura that increases ship targeting range 40%!? Before a huge missile based corvette swarm would be a significant threat to an artillery fleet, but now that battleships can carry their own decent PD with strike craft, that actually target their largest threats first, the swarm is still effective, but far less so than it used to be.

There's a fair argument to be made that battleships are becoming too dominant over other fleet comps, but I don't mind. The fights look very cool, especially when both sides strike craft meet in the middle and dogfight before the big guys start throwing haymakers at each other, and I'm not up on the current meta either honestly. I imagine that missile corvette swarms are still great. I just know that as someone who has been obsessed with trying to build strike craft based fleets in Stellaris since launch (Star Wars fan, guilty), they are now more effective than they have been since the release of artillery, and I now only feel bad about replacing three L slots with 2 hangar slots on some of my battleships instead of outright revulsion, especially since there is now a Carrier Stance for combat computers that increases carrier stand off to 150, so carriers stay safer longer and can still provide some actual damage support with an XL weapon.

Sorry for the text wall!
 

Tyro

Second Lieutenant
Quick side note before I get into my Stellaris obsession, if you like corvette missile swarms, I actually like missile cruiser layouts. 1 of 2 cruiser configurations that I even think about using.

So the devs made a few changes to Strike Craft that make them much more useful than they used to be, two things in particular.

They changed the range at which they launch from their carriers by a significant amount, meaning they have more time to deliver their damage. Strike craft now launch even before artillery is in range, they still don't hold a candle to the effectiveness of artillery, but launching sooner allows them to get out in front of their carriers much faster, allowing them to intercept the enemy more effectively. Sometimes strike craft are now the alpha strike on the enemy even before Perdition Beams depending on how far apart the fleets are when combat starts. On top of that, strike craft are now significantly faster than they used to be, have significantly higher evasion than they used to, and have more health. Destroyed strike craft also respawn faster from their carriers, which is nice, but doesn't mean all that much except for upgraded starbases with hangar modules because fights don't usually last long enough for the respawned strike craft to make a meaningful difference in a fight before their carrier is destroyed, and all of them with it.

The second equally important big change was an overhaul of strike craft target priority. Before strike craft would shoot at some missiles, then prioritize battleships where their laughable damage would do little more than tickle them while getting torn apart by point defense, and while the rest of the enemy fleet eviscerated their carriers. Now strike craft work as mobile, accurate, point defense for their carriers first, prioritizing missiles and other strike craft, THEN instead of tickling battleships, they prioritize corvettes! This is a huge change. Their accuracy and tracking serves as a counter to corvettes, their damage in numbers is significant enough to defeat corvettes instead of doing nothing to battleships, and while prioritizing the smaller ships first, they handle the evasion tanks that their carriers have the hardest time targeting, eliminate missile platforms that are dangerous to their carriers, and help eliminate the main point defense platforms that do the most damage to them. Win win win.

Sound a little OP? Don't worry, a few glances at your after battle damage summary will dispel that rather quickly :) Strike craft are still laughably ineffective at delivering damage on ships, except for corvettes which they do ok against if combat is long enough, but they are a MUCH more effective point defense than they used to be, so much so that I don't see as much a need to carry PD destroyers or PD corvettes. They are noticeably better at actually countering missiles and strike craft in the after battle report, and that damage doesn't show up in the damage break down.

Artillery is still the king of the space battlefield, especially once you get into repeatable techs, and if you get lucky and get the Null Void Beam tech, that's pretty much the "I win" button with Neutron Launchers and Tachyon Lances. The alpha strike, plus fast reloads make building anything other than artillery based fleets silly, especially now that a Juggernaut has an aura that increases ship targeting range 40%!? Before a huge missile based corvette swarm would be a significant threat to an artillery fleet, but now that battleships can carry their own decent PD with strike craft, that actually target their largest threats first, the swarm is still effective, but far less so than it used to be.

There's a fair argument to be made that battleships are becoming too dominant over other fleet comps, but I don't mind. The fights look very cool, especially when both sides strike craft meet in the middle and dogfight before the big guys start throwing haymakers at each other, and I'm not up on the current meta either honestly. I imagine that missile corvette swarms are still great. I just know that as someone who has been obsessed with trying to build strike craft based fleets in Stellaris since launch (Star Wars fan, guilty), they are now more effective than they have been since the release of artillery, and I now only feel bad about replacing three L slots with 2 hangar slots on some of my battleships instead of outright revulsion, especially since there is now a Carrier Stance for combat computers that increases carrier stand off to 150, so carriers stay safer longer and can still provide some actual damage support with an XL weapon.

Sorry for the text wall!
Don't apologize - if anything I want more. How do you determine the mix of hangars and gun bays in chokepoint starbases? When do you start introducing carriers to your fleet, and in what ratios?

I avoid using missiles as a rule - I don't like anything with an easy / common hard counter.
 

bbswfan

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Don't apologize - if anything I want more. How do you determine the mix of hangars and gun bays in chokepoint starbases? When do you start introducing carriers to your fleet, and in what ratios?

I avoid using missiles as a rule - I don't like anything with an easy / common hard counter.
For starbases, it depends on my fleet composition as to what modules I put on my border starbases, or if the starbase is only there to combat piracy in the middle of my empire to protect my trade value. Hangars are obviously best for protecting trade, and since most combat will hopefully not be fought on or in your borders, I find all hangars to be a decent choice for starbase modules. Additionally, since starbases have very high hit points, destroyed strike craft will have a much higher chance of respawning from the starbase. Defense platforms can make up for the lower damage of strike craft hangar modules that have kinetic launchers and proton launchers, and your point defense needs will be largely covered by the hangar modules. However, if I'm going straight damage starbase, I usually build all gun battery modules on my starbase, which will melt most anything that gets close, especially mid/early game, and can be supplemented by a few hangar defense platforms for PD, but you run a higher risk of losing them because defense platforms have much lower hit points than your starbase.

The hard counter isn't as hard now, missiles were significantly buffed in earlier updates to the game. There is a good argument up through mid game, all missile/torpedo fleets are the strongest for the same reason artillery fleets are the strongest late game, they have the longest range of any weapon system until kinetic battery and/or proton launchers are researched, giving them the first strike in combat. Hit the "expand" button under each weapon section to see the weapon stats. Also, swarmer missiles are pointless, you get access to strike craft first which are mobile swarmer missiles that double as point defense and have higher stats, and a "G" weapon slot is better used on either a missile or torpedo.

Unless a fleet is specifically designed to go as heavy on PD as possible, missiles will overwhelm the point defense of most early fleets, and absolutely wreck most starbase configurations except for those that carry all hangar bays. This is especially true if you are playing a species that is either a fanatic purifier or fanatic militarist ethic because of the increased fire rate. Complete the Supremacist Tradition tree early, and you can additionally unlock the No Retreat War Doctrine, making your corvettes fully automatic missile launchers. You are correct in saying that missiles are less effective when playing species with different ethics, or do not have access to No Retreat. However, even a Pacifist nation can have a decent missile fleet with the Hit and Run or Defense in Depth War Doctrine in addition to completing the Harmony Tradition tree. As to your question, the earliest I would introduce carriers into my fleet would be on my cruisers if I was running a heavy missile composition because I would be ignoring Destroyers because they don't have a missile slot, and I would be using the missile layout for my corvettes instead of point defense because missiles only work if you go all in on missiles.

Enough about the benefits of missiles though. As said right off the bat, they are most effective through mid game, then the long range weapons that deliver their damage instantly rule the great sky sea. For most of my playthroughs, when I am not playing as a genocidal or war crazed species, I wait to introduce carriers to my fleet until I have battleships. With the new Carrier combat computer, your battleships will maintain a standoff of 150, while you can also equip an XL weapon on your battleship's bow, I equip the 2 H battleship mid section, and finish it off with the L weapon stern slot. Ratio wise, 2 carrier battleships to 3 artillery battleships. Most things are disintegrated before point defense even has a chance to be effective, making the hangars largely redundant, but fighters still look cool, and at least fly towards the enemy fleet now when combat starts :)

I would provide more links, but I have to work tomorrow, and it's very late now. With the links provided above, find the weapons with the most range and the combat computers that compliment the weapons load out, some kinetic artillery here, some neutron launchers there, already talked about null void beams, Tachyon Lances and you just start rolling over Fallen Empires and End Game Crises once you get into repeatable techs.
 
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tristan9599

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I have had this game for 4 years and have 1,100 hours stellaris and I have never been able to reach endgame without bugs ruining my experience. How is this still a problem? In this version, 2.6.3 its rebel empires spawning with no names or civics, and not being able to upgrade or retrofit federation fleets. There must be a serious lack of proper testing done before patches by the developers on this game.
 
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anaphysik

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Egalitarian empires will no longer draw leader enhancement technologies they cannot use.
Wait, isn't this stealthily really bad? A very strange thing about the Egalitarian faction is that they get +5 to faction approval for not using leader enhancements ...but ONLY if you already have the Selected Lineages technology researched. So it can be worth it to research the tech just to be able to disable it o_O.

(Of course, this was always very silly. This should probably be changed to either a) simply giving the faction bonus regardless of whether Selected Lineages has been researched, or b) enabling a flavor-only Policy for leader lineages right from the start, which has no initial mechanical effect except for influencing the Egalitarian and Authoritarian factions' approval.)
 
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I am not sure, where to say thanks for the x25 crisis option, but let it be said here: thank you for the x25 crisis option.
 
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