Dev Diary - When ?

[Kliwarrior]

As a long-time Paradox forumer, I'm used to regularly reading DevDiaries, about both upcoming products and expansions of the existing ones.

I have to admit that both the number, frequency and also the quality of BL2's DevDiaries is quite disappointing.

- less than a DD per month: 13, currently, since April 2019 (18 months elapsed)
- when? No one knows, when it happens, it seems. "Dev Diaries will come like a thief in the night, for ye know neither the day nor the hour"
-even the quality and the contents leave me a bit perplexed (sorry guys, some of them really say nothing about the game )

Wouldn't it be appropriate that - I don't say every week like EU4 / CK3 / Stelly / Hoi4 etc.. but at least every 15, 21 days some developer bothered to write a post, showing something, describing an interface or a game mechanics, something to make it clear that something is moving and not all hazy and foggy?

Yes, we have some videos, but they seem more "advertising" and promotional material, rather than aimed at maintaining contact with fans.

Am I asking too much?

Thanks in advance.

 

[RagnarokCzD]

https://www.reddit.com/r/vtmb/comments/j1irkf

So apparently there'll be no October dd. Tad concerning tbh.

Also ... you should search forum for a bit, before you start new discusion ... i believe its not "too much" either.

 

[Eber]

Ragnarok answered it well. The only thing I will add is that the lack of DD is due to the new creative and strategic direction the company may be going with the game, in my opinion. Until they have something solid, it makes sense they will hold off on DD for now. It's unfortunate but I expect to get some new DDs maybe in November or at least by December. A lot of changes are happening internally (as you probably can tell from what's been on the forum recently) so they need to smooth things out before getting back on schedule with regular updates to the public. They want to paint a consistent picture so that takes time if things are changing.

 

[Kliwarrior]

Also ... you should search forum for a bit, before you start new discusion ... i believe its not "too much" either.

I know there will no DDs in the future and this is exactly the reason I'm complaining about.

I don't thing that people who are coding EU4 or CK3 have a so easy task that can waste their time writing EVERY WEEK about how the development of the game is going , or about the novelty they are going to implement.

Developers of EU4/CK3/HOI4 etc are doing a great (and for sure non easy) job and have the care to talk to the community.

For BL2 , apparently , this is not true.

 

[Feeona]

Dev Diaries are a little different with Bloodlines 2. We're not a grand strategy where we can talk about every single aspect of the game before it's released. We're an RPG and there are many things we can't talk about because we don't want to spoil folks first time play of the game (or re-plays to see all the different dialogue options!). Whether that means not mentioning characters, game mechanics or even some of Seattle itself all comes down to "Would seeing this ruin someone's first time experience with the game".

What we can say is that we've stepped back from the DD to give Developers more time to work on the game and, take the time that when we release the next one it'll have a bit more meat on it.

We hope that fans understand and that we've been listening to all your suggestions of what you'd like to see!

 

[somewherebeyond]

few reasons why they won't release dd soon, first is release of ac:valhalla and cp2077 which makes this game non-relevant for next 5-6 months. Second, based on latest videos like damsel reveal you can see framerate issues, lipsync issues, models are bad...so for game which should be released any time soon that's a big problem. I think there are huge changes happening inside hsl now. Ofc, nobody will admit that.

 

[Ridixo]

Am I asking too much?

Yes

 

[RagnarokCzD]

the new creative and strategic direction the company may be going with the game, in my opinion. Until they have something solid, it makes sense they will hold off on DD for now.
...
A lot of changes are happening internally (as you probably can tell from what's been on the forum recently) so they need to smooth things out before getting back on schedule with regular updates to the public. They want to paint a consistent picture so that takes time if things are changing.

Now im worried once again. :-/
Just when i was almost calm. :-/

 

[Eber]

Now im worried once again. :-/
Just when i was almost calm. :-/

It was just my opinion. Changing Creative Directors can always potentially mean a different direction, but I feel as though it'll be more minor changes than anything. Feeona is a great source for behind the scenes. So I wouldn't be worried too much.

 

[somewherebeyond]

i'll just say they will make changes to make this game sell more. Also i think they will work hard to raise bar up to at least higher than average. they want to build ip success on bl2. But on the other hand it might be completely other game. maybe we will even get 3rd person mode.

also, because they already sold dlc they might even wait longer to make dust settle. Honestly i don't really care much who's developing the game. I am here for product. PDX invested a lot and paying bill now to make it better. Let's wait and see. What i've seen from videos it was mediocre at best, maybe next video will be whole another level.

 

[RagnarokCzD]

maybe next video will be whole another level.

It better be ...
If they wish to avoid blood hunt. :-/

 

[Sh4ark]

The only thing I will add is that the lack of DD is due to the new creative and strategic direction the company may be going with the game, in my opinion.

See, this kind of speculation is... bad for bussiness, if you will. Idk in what "creative and strategic direction" do the Paradox suits want to take this game into, since it was in fine one before. What it needs is to get done, not changed into god knows what.

 

[Eber]

See, this kind of speculation is... bad for bussiness, if you will. Idk in what "creative and strategic direction" do the Paradox suits want to take this game into, since it was in fine one before. What it needs is to get done, not changed into god knows what.

Fair point and I agree. But I think it would be foolish to not think that the direction may still change somewhat with new leadership. But as they have said in their limited correspondence, their new Creative Director looks to be more of a "finisher" so I do think the bulk of the work will probably be to actually complete the game, in a good and stable release, with no more delays. Hopefully, we will get better clarification in the coming months if any notable changes are made within the game.

 

[Luchs1]

We're an RPG and there are many things we can't talk about because we don't want to spoil folks first time play of the game (or re-plays to see all the different dialogue options!). Whether that means not mentioning characters, game mechanics or even some of Seattle itself all comes down to "Would seeing this ruin someone's first time experience with the game".

With all due respect but do have to respectfully disagree. There are plenty of story based RPG games (shall not name them) coming out later this year and next, which revealed "minutes long" trailers and diaries describing game mechanics, combat systems, environment etc. without spoiling anything regarding the game itself. Take for example that Slug trailer from last year, why not show it now but improved??

 

[RagnarokCzD]

I also wonder how exactly can some topics (character creation, xp distribution, xp obtainment, weapon durability, weapon obtainment, reason for "day sleeping", etc. ... it was listed multiple times in warious threats here) "ruin anyone first time experience".

I mean sure, if i will expect xp distribution to be same like in Bloodlines, where i can store XP and carry them with me forever, and use them whenever, and wherever i need ... but then i find out that this game is more simmilar to Vampyr, where you need to get back to your heaven, and sleep to next day to distribue XP, but then state of city will change, and main plot will move ....
It can move my frustration from now, to fist place ingame where i find out ...
Simmilar to all other topics ...

But if i want to buy blindly, i would not follow all social media tied to Bloodlines, trying to get some information ... i would buy random cd key instead. :-/

//edit:
And dont get me wrong, i completely understand that you dont want to spoil anything story related ...
On the other hand, to be completely honest, and you may disagree with me ... for me, revealing Damsel is about hunderts time bigger spoiler, than showing us few options of how can protagonist look like, and what can s/he wear. :-/

 

[xTodenx]

As a long-time Paradox forumer, I'm used to regularly reading DevDiaries, about both upcoming products and expansions of the existing ones.

I have to admit that both the number, frequency and also the quality of BL2's DevDiaries is quite disappointing.

- less than a DD per month: 13, currently, since April 2019 (18 months elapsed)
- when? No one knows, when it happens, it seems. "Dev Diaries will come like a thief in the night, for ye know neither the day nor the hour"
-even the quality and the contents leave me a bit perplexed (sorry guys, some of them really say nothing about the game )

Wouldn't it be appropriate that - I don't say every week like EU4 / CK3 / Stelly / Hoi4 etc.. but at least every 15, 21 days some developer bothered to write a post, showing something, describing an interface or a game mechanics, something to make it clear that something is moving and not all hazy and foggy?

Yes, we have some videos, but they seem more "advertising" and promotional material, rather than aimed at maintaining contact with fans.

Am I asking too much?

Thanks in advance.

They fired the main dev that was behind the first game, and a few others.
Then they said nothing, then they tried to say he left in agreement with them.
Till he posted that he was canned for no reasons given.
No one knows the truth in these forums about the above.

No one knows what state the game is in.
So anyome saying minor changes is blowing smoke up your butt.

The lady taking over the story part is a critic/journalists, not a story writer.
The game was suppose to be released twice now.
And so far there is nothing to show for it.

In summary, no one in these forums knows whar is going on with the game.
At best you can guess sometime in 2021 we might see something.

Sept 9 to Sept 24 - 13 Dev Diaries for other games......Just not this one.

 

[somewherebeyond]

I also wonder how exactly can some topics (character creation, xp distribution, xp obtainment, weapon durability, weapon obtainment, reason for "day sleeping", etc. ... it was listed multiple times in warious threats here) "ruin anyone first time experience".

I mean sure, if i will expect xp distribution to be same like in Bloodlines, where i can store XP and carry them with me forever, and use them whenever, and wherever i need ... but then i find out that this game is more simmilar to Vampyr, where you need to get back to your heaven, and sleep to next day to distribue XP, but then state of city will change, and main plot will move ....
It can move my frustration from now, to fist place ingame where i find out ...
Simmilar to all other topics ...

But if i want to buy blindly, i would not follow all social media tied to Bloodlines, trying to get some information ... i would buy random cd key instead. :-/

//edit:
And dont get me wrong, i completely understand that you dont want to spoil anything story related ...
On the other hand, to be completely honest, and you may disagree with me ... for me, revealing Damsel is about hunderts time bigger spoiler, than showing us few options of how can protagonist look like, and what can s/he wear. :-/

Like seriously, what are you wondering about ? This is regular answer from PR team which they can give you Ofc, they won't speak about internal problems, things turned upside down, etc, etc, because they are not allowed to.

They will show something if they are happy with result. Not any moment sooner. Also showing something now, doesnt make sense. Plenty of good games coming out every 3-4 weeks from now. Nobody cares about bl2 anymore considering we won't see it live for next half year or year .

Also, making dev diaries requires dev time? It is also not true. Most of game producers have access to the game build and are capable of making screenshots, also most game producers know the game at least as good as devs if not better. So, they just don't want making them right now. Just play another games which in the end most definitely be better games than BL2. There are plenty coming and are available on pc atm: hzd, cp2077, watch dogs, ac: valhalla, control.

 

[RagnarokCzD]

Till he posted that he was canned for no reasons given.

That is not exactly true ...
He posted that he didnt recedive any pre-warnings, and it came sudently to him ... not that reason was not told to him. On the contrary, Fiona (if im not misstaken) stated here on forum, that Brian was ofc told reasons to end his contract. None of them tell us tho.

Like seriously, what are you wondering about ?

Well ... exactly that what i was writing about for example?

They will show something if they are happy with result. Not any moment sooner.

I have to partialy disagree here ...
Yes, they will not show anything that is not ready ... no one (AFAIK) expect differently ...
But also no, since they can TALK about it even now ... proof is in the clan reveal videos, from last year, where did they talk about some topics ... well, kinda all of them, but just like "we are thinking about it" ... now its about time to move to "we did decide this" ... and when it will be ready we can get "we want to show you something".

Also showing something now, doesnt make sense. Plenty of good games coming out every 3-4 weeks from now. Nobody cares about bl2 anymore considering we won't see it live for next half year or year .

I dunno, i honestly never understaned this way of thinking ...
From the first day Bloodlines 2 was anounced, and mine hype was somewhere between stars at the moment ... i never stoped to search informations about WoW:Shadowlands, Star Wars: KotOR3 (or remaster, or w/e they are planning ... if they even plan something), the Elder Scrolls 6, or Dragon Age 4, another Fallout, etc. ... and that is only games, not talking about coming movies, series, or comics.
Do you people really focus on only one game you choose, and forgot about everything else in the world while you do that? :-/ That seems incredibly sad man. :-/

Also, making dev diaries requires dev time? It is also not true.

Either that, or its common excuse ... does it matter in the end?

Just play another games which in the end most definitely be better games than BL2. There are plenty coming and are available on pc atm: hzd, cp2077, watch dogs, ac: valhalla, control.

Well ... i cant help the feeling that if you dont like this, or any else, discusion, you should be the one who shall follow your own adwice ....
And ... yes, there is allways many other fish in the sea ... but i dont want fish, i want octopus ... THIS octopus.

 

[Kliwarrior]

And dont get me wrong, i completely understand that you dont want to spoil anything story related ...
On the other hand, to be completely honest, and you may disagree with me ... for me, revealing Damsel is about hunderts time bigger spoiler, than showing us few options of how can protagonist look like, and what can s/he wear. :-/

THIS!

 

[Kliwarrior]

Dev Diaries are a little different with Bloodlines 2. We're not a grand strategy where we can talk about every single aspect of the game before it's released. We're an RPG and there are many things we can't talk about because we don't want to spoil folks first time play of the game (or re-plays to see all the different dialogue options!). Whether that means not mentioning characters, game mechanics or even some of Seattle itself all comes down to "Would seeing this ruin someone's first time experience with the game".

The core of a RPG is the story itself and for sure nobody want (or ask) to have any clue /spoiler about this.
But the statement "we don't say anything not to ruin your experience" is a very fragile argument.
Talking about ( just examples ) how the combat will work, how the progression of the character will be handled , or explaining why you don't implement some mechanics (e.g. dot allocation as in the pen&paper rpg ) would be very appreciated.
As other pointed out, many other RPG games have done of great (and note that i don'y say better ) job in describing would would be inside without revealing any spoilers.

the lack of DD is due to the new creative and strategic direction

This is quite worrisome.... Strategic decisions are (or should be) ... "strategic" and should be defined even before the start of the coding.
Really , if a NEW strategic vision could be implemented, this would mean something like "we are starting from scratch" and "somewhere in 2021" would mean "4Q 2021".

Anyway, probably the only true answer is that HSL is different from PDS ( i mean Paradox Development Studio, the coding subsidiary of PDX ) and they don't have the DD's mentality of their colleagues, and the habit to stay in touch with their fanbase besides the standard marketing/promotional channels.