Deus Vult Improvement Pack - Discussion

[aylo1]

choosing dynasty names

I'm trying to fix the royal family (Hetoumi) of Armenia-Cilicia in 1337 scenario & would like some advice.

CK currently has all members of that family using the 'Hetoumi' surname, but in my research, only the direct descendants of the royal line (ie Zabel I Rubenid & Hethum I) use Hetoumi as a lastname. All the brothers of Hethum I are known by their titles (eg. of Korikos, Barbaron, Lampron, Neghir etc)

What I'd like to do is give these brothers separate lastnames (ie. Frenchfied de Korikos for example) to make them more unique & maintain some semblence of historical succession (ie to Lusignans)

Any thoughts?

@Jordarkelf, I noticed your post on giving all living male dynasty 1 characters their own dynasties, can you please tell me what your 1st free id there will be?? Thx

 

[unmerged(2456)]

I've discussed it in the More Kingdoms thread. Basically the main issue is that with BYZA gone as the natural liege, once the Byzantine dukes or counts become independent they never repledge, so the Turk can conquer Byzantium far too easily. I've actually seen the title disappear a few times.

hopefully this will be fixed once Johan makes the final 2.1 patch.

 

[jordarkelf]

@aylo1 If these brothers are in eachother's line of succession (no bastard lines), they should be in the same dynasty. Otherwise a player can get a game over even when using salic law, something I want to avoid as much as possible.

Dynasty ID... need to check. I think I used a different range for them but I'm not 100% certain. Will post the free range here later today (in ~10 hours).

 

[Riddermark]

Things to fix in my opinion:

- Norman mercenaries (Unknown string wanted - http://i33.tinypic.com/n6ev89.jpg)
- The event that a courtier thinks he is better than other and demands a spymaster/marshall etc. position should fire for your children ONLY if they have finished their education.
- The loyalty of fosterlings returning to your court is preserved if they don't return by event, thus if they were at 0.0 with their Foster court, when they return forcefully they are at 0.0 with you too and events begin to fire.

Thats what i spotted so far

 

[jordarkelf]

1st one: I'll look into this.
2nd: Why? They can already serve the position even before finishing education, only age matters.
3rd: Impossible to code without disabling the ability for them to become disloyal in the first place. Once they've returned to their parent's court, there's no way to check if they ever were a fosterling.

 

[Riddermark]

2nd: because it's not logical, they dont even know what they are yet and they demand position? whether steward/spymaster or bishop/marshall they don't know until it's finished. And also they cant be appointed as chaplains before they finish it, so a little check that prevents your kin from demanding it unless they finished education should be fine. Seems logical to me - just fresh out of school and demanding to get involved, not before that.

 

[jordarkelf]

The events that do this check for skills and fire if they're higher than your current courtier, OR fire if they're in the same range but there is a family relationship.

Educations don't matter much as they mostly serve as skill adjusters. I often ignore them and appoint a character with a steward education as marshall, if his skills are better than whoever I might have available in the martial tract. The same goes for all court positions: if I marry someone with high intrigue, I give them my spymaster position even if they don't have a finished education yet. And unless their education raises another skill high enough, they will remain there.

Once your son, brother, daughter, etc. turns 16, he or she can fill a position in the court. It thus makes sense that they demand their right place. After all, if you go to war, your 16 year old son can already lead an army even if he is still "in school". Remember, you can always so no to them. Family members usually get loyalty bonuses so they will become loyal again soon.

I can't find this event for the diocese bishop/chaplain position. Are you certain you got this for someone without an education?

 

[Riddermark]

Ok but this does indeed take away from the role-playing of the game. Sure your son can lead an army but because he is in your court, not because he is appointed a marshall. I don't see any harm in waitin 1 year or less for their education to finish to (note) ALLOW them to demand a position.

And what I mean was that you can't appoint your ecclesiastical educated child as a chaplain unless he has finished his education.

 

[jordarkelf]

And you have actually seen that event fire for him?
Because that /is/ a bug that will need fixing. You can fill any position with any character (except of course no females should demand to be marshall), except chaplain. From my POV it is perfectly valid that this fires for the steward, spymaster, etc. but it may not fire for the chaplain.

 

[Veldmaarschalk]

I never have seen a son demand to be made diocese bishop

 

[Drachenfire]

(except of course no females should demand to be marshall).

*pout!*

Hehe,

 

[Riddermark]

No, what I meant to say that you can't appoint anyone including your kids as bishops unless they have completed their education. Not by event.

Also this just springs to my mind - Would it be possible to give prestige to the leaders of the armies when they win battles and sieges? This way some marshalls can amount a lot of prestige during their lifetime, then have some events to make them demand land because of their fame and achievements etc etc ?

 

[jordarkelf]

@Aylo1: you can continue to use the range 20095 and up. I've used a different range for my own dynasty additions.

@Riddermark: the engine does not provide any way to fire an even when a battle is won, but it is possible to give prestige to a character when he is in charge of a regiment, or during combat.

 

[Riddermark]

So can we think of a plausible way of providing prestige for war leaders ? Which will also add more realism to the game ?

 

[jordarkelf]

Maybe so, but not in the scope of the DVIP.
If I can think of something I'll post an event mod for it.

 

[performer]

I have a suggestion for Cornwall
The province's base income (id = 31) is very low, which is OK - Cornwall was poor in the medieval times. But as well it was one of the best known places for tin mining since ancient times. (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornwall#Economy) Therefore, it would be fair to add a mine for the province. (like in 1066 scenario).

province = {
id = 31
culture = celtic
religion = catholic
privileges = {
peasants = 1
burghers = 1
clergy = 1
nobles = 1
}
loyalty = {
peasants = 1
burghers = 1
clergy = 1
nobles = 1
}
improvements = {
hill_fort = yes
mine = yes
}
advances = {
hill_fort = yes
chained_leather = yes
handaxe = yes
longspear = yes
coalpit =yes
}
}

 

[jordarkelf]

You mentioned that in the Tintagel AAR
Given that some even credit the black in the Cornish flag to tin, it was obviously important. I'll include the mine.

 

[performer]

Cool ;-) Thank you.
The DV:IP is just awesome. It adds so much flavour to the game. Can't play without it any more

 

[Kurek]

I would like to suggest an improvement.

The coat of arms of Bristol is wrong. The coat of arms of Somerset is also wrong, infact the coat of arms of Somerset in the game is actually the arms for Bristol, and has been since the 14th century. The wiki page for Bristol shows the current full set of arms which has the castle and boat motif in the shield, also the council website shows a stylised coat of arms, the Bristol Record Society has this to say about the arms (regarding the current City Badge) "...City's ancient Coat of Arms which has its origins in the 13th century burgesses' seal. The earliest record of the adoption of the ship and castle theme as the official arms is in the three illuminated charters of 1373. "

I've not a clue what the current coat of arms in Bristol is supposed to be from, but I have seen it in real life on a number of occasions, there's a pub near me called the 'Gloucester Arms' which displays the three red chevrons on a gold field arms on it's sign and also I saw some old chap wearing a posh looking club coat for something with the arms on, and this was whilst I was in South Gloucestershire, so I guess these arms have something to do with that region, for it is defintely not Bristol's coat of arms!

As to Somerset, I have no clue what a proper historical set of arms should be for the shire, but it's current arms are stolen from Bristol in the game, so it would be very nice if you could fix that Just make the current arms of Somerset's into Bristol's which just requires a filename change and find something new for Somerset! It's current arms are a red dragon holding a big rod doodad, but I care not what them farmers have as long as it isn't Bristol's no longer!

And as for why I am so passionate about this subject; look at my location

 

[jordarkelf]

Hmm. That is a really weird mistake with the CoAs!

I'll give Bristol its own CoA, and see what needs to be done with Gloucester and Somerset.
If I understand correctly, currently Somerset has Bristol's arms, Bristol has what could be Gloucester's arms... and Gloucester has... erm. Like I said, I'll do some research but will definitely change old Brycgstow.