Destiny of Nations 2 Discussions

[N Katsyev]

Originally posted by Smirfy
Ever seen the Hudson River

Why do people have to get all serious and vicious all the time? Here I am, from New England, singing the praises of Boston rather facetiously and I get caustic comments in turn. I don't pretend to know enough about the early colonial development of the US, mostly because I don't care, to actually make a sound judgement here. But I do know that my first NA colony with England will be Massachusets.

 

[Smirfy]

Originally posted by Prince Eugene
That would be silly.. It would mean that France could march right into London without the English navy stopping them. Wouldn't it also mean that you couldn't move ships through the Straits of Dover?

I was being sarcastic Prince, considering the blatantly obvious advantages of the maritime nations are ignored or considered "unbalancing" why not join England to the continent

 

[metroncho]

I wonder if they same people supporting the removing of the Manhattan Cot has noticed where all that trade is going now ....
So realize that even it is benefitial from Spain, i´m against it.

Another point: we aren´t playing any Paradox official scenario, but Peter Ebbesen´s one, so i don´t know why this change could be considered mandatory.

 

[JohnMK]

It doesn't go to Andalusia until you type in the code 'columbus.'

If you don't cheat and have view of those provinces, all the trade will go to Asian CoT's.

 

[metroncho]

Originally posted by JohnMK
It doesn't go to Andalusia until you type in the code 'columbus.'

If you don't cheat and have view of those provinces, all the trade will go to Asian CoT's.

To my knowledge, it´s all going now to Zacatecas

I tested in the last beta.

 

[JohnMK]

I should add if you start up as France without Manhattan CoT in 1492, and immediately type in columbus, the trade value goes to Paris. I'm sure you can see how this works by now . . .

 

[metroncho]

Originally posted by JohnMK
I should add if you start up as France without Manhattan CoT in 1492, and immediately type in columbus, the trade value goes to Paris. I'm sure you can see how this works by now . . .

Perhaps, but the default one seems to be Mexico.

 

[Smirfy]

Originally posted by JohnMK
It doesn't go to Andalusia until you type in the code 'columbus.'

If you don't cheat and have view of those provinces, all the trade will go to Asian CoT's.

Great thats historical the entire North American fur trade sailing down the Hudson out to Asian COT's

 

[N Katsyev]

I don't mind there not being a Manhatten, and I really don't care that it goes to Asia. The perfect solution would be to remove the trade value of all the NA provinces until a European sets up a CoT there anyway. Anyway, unless I see it have a ridiculous effect on the game, I like the change.

 

[Smirfy]

Originally posted by N Katsyev
I don't mind there not being a Manhatten, and I really don't care that it goes to Asia. The perfect solution would be to remove the trade value of all the NA provinces until a European sets up a CoT there anyway. Anyway, unless I see it have a ridiculous effect on the game, I like the change.

.....and what of Ivoria is it legitimate or should Il de France be more valuable than Flanders (that ones hilarious) or the ridiculous Aztec and Inca clearing houses. The whole system of COT's is up the left. So we punish England for getting John Cabot but we don't punish Spain for Colombus or Portugal for their explorers.

 

[JohnMK]

Not really. If the system works right, England's first one or two colonies, which'll come decades before France's, should sprout up a random CoT.

 

[Smirfy]

Originally posted by JohnMK
Not really. If the system works right, England's first one or two colonies, which'll come decades before France's, should sprout up a random CoT.

Then why not remove the central and South American COT's

 

[metroncho]

Originally posted by Smirfy
Then why not remove the central and South American COT's

Well, the Mesoamerican and Andean Indians were very advanced. Tenochtitlan-Tletelolco was a thriving center of trade when Spanish arrived.

I think the most questionable CoT of the game is Ivoria.
And acknowledging North America should have their own CoT, i think Manhattan location is not that bad.

 

[JohnMK]

In an ideal world I think we should, right? Someone needs to playtest it. Will random CoT's pop up immediately soon after Jan 1st 1492, or will they wait for the first European colony? There are many ripple effects that need to be considered too.

 

[metroncho]

By the way, could anybody give an opinion about my treasury bonds proposal in the DoN2 AAR?
Suggestions, critics, feedback, insults ... money

 

[TheArchduke]

Seems like our position about the Manhattan CoT is unclear so it stays in. I also think if Manhattan is gone, Malacca, Cuzco and Ivoria should go also..

Great one with the bonds, leax i will surely comment it later today!

 

[RedPhoenix]

Originally posted by TheArchduke
Seems like our position about the Manhattan CoT is unclear so it stays in. I also think if Manhattan is gone, Malacca, Cuzco and Ivoria should go also..

Great one with the bonds, leax i will surely comment it later today!

There was a lot more trade in Africa and asia than there was in north america, the natives didn't live off trade there

Well it is officially out of the game anyway, is reason why I wanted it out, not because we should discuss what to do with which cot like it went now

Not the biggest deal to me, I'm sure the game will survive with manhattan cot in too, but I do think it would be more realistic if it was out as trade in north america didn't really reach much untill europeans came.

 

[Smirfy]

Originally posted by RedPhoenix
Not the biggest deal to me, I'm sure the game will survive with manhattan cot in too, but I do think it would be more realistic if it was out as trade in north america didn't really reach much untill europeans came.

This applies to several Cot's and not just in North America.

I am not against the removal of Manhatten I am against the removal of Manhatten unilaterally on the grounds that it is ahistorical when there are several other Cot's and values of COT's that are just as ludicrous.

 

[metroncho]

Originally posted by RedPhoenix
There was a lot more trade in Africa and asia than there was in north america, the natives didn't live off trade there

Well it is officially out of the game anyway, is reason why I wanted it out, not because we should discuss what to do with which cot like it went now

Not the biggest deal to me, I'm sure the game will survive with manhattan cot in too, but I do think it would be more realistic if it was out as trade in north america didn't really reach much untill europeans came.

Don´t know, Red. The Mississipean cultures seemed to be quite advanced and with ties even with far Mexico.
And according to the game mechanics if there is a civilized society, there is a CoT. So the question is where to place a CoT for North America, in Mexico or Paris or in NA itself?

Really,I find more annoying the Ivoria CoT than the Manhattan one. Even if there was a developed trade there, i´m unsure Ivoria would be the place for it. Perhaps Timbuktu or the first European colony to appear.

 

[RedPhoenix]

Originally posted by Smirfy
This applies to several Cot's and not just in North America.

I am not against the removal of Manhatten I am against the removal of Manhatten unilaterally on the grounds that it is ahistorical when there are several other Cot's and values of COT's that are just as ludicrous.

There were a lot more advanced nations in africa than in north america, in terms of trade atleast, and malay was a trader nation wasn't it? Also there was much trade in india I don't see how these relate directly to manhatta, as there was a lot less trade than in any of these. If any the trade in north america should be around the great rivers or in the north around the iroquis confederacy. There were some a bit larger "trader" nations more south and west in NA Too. Trade in north america is hardly comparable to any of the other areas with a COT in the game though.


Also point is Manhattan is officially out of the game, do we wan't to mod our game to be otherwise? If we include manhattan I vote we rise the trade value of persia too As this opens a lot more disucussion into modding the game further again.