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    Real Strategy Requires Cunning
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Emperor Ike

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Did you breed raptors??? ;)
Perhaps. But there is much worse happening on the laboratories of Rockford Island. Something that will shift the balance of the whole world. One thing is sure: The Revolution has begun!
 
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Sid Meier

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The Chinese-Byzantine-Russo War was a catastrophic disaster, hundreds of thousands of chinese troops are subsisting on gruel, boot leather and slop due to the logistics supply trains being horrendously mismanaged coupled with the terrible state of punjabi roads prevents adequate supplies from reaching the front, and the rampant highway robberies consume much of the remainder.

As such tends of thousands desert and hundreds of thousands are huddled together and freezing in the punjabi highlands, a march of thousands of miles with barely any russians to shoot leaves the army in poor shape and discontented with the generalship.

The sole battle of the campaign, Alimuly; involved a fierce battle of over 60,000 soldiers killing over 12,000 in a decisive military victory for the Qin army but such victories are poor compensation for the dismal logistical failures of the campaign.

Its the battle of the one eyed versus the one legged as both sides grapple with the logistical impossibilities of fighting 4000 miles from supply depots.

900,000 Russians versus 1,400,000 Chinese and Byzo-Mongolians, never before have so many fought in such terrible conditions over territory so god forsaken.

Over 800k of my manpower was attrited just moving into position
 

OrangeYoshi

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Its the battle of the one eyed versus the one legged as both sides grapple with the logistical impossibilities of fighting 4000 miles from supply depots.

Over 800k of my manpower was attrited just moving into position
Now do you see the reason in my arguments from a few days ago?
 

King of Men

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Well, if Jodokus had had the basic courtesy to follow Blayne's war plan and move his army into scorched Khanate lands, this tragedy could have been avoided. :D That said, the campaign has not been a disaster for Roman arms, as shown by the screenies below.







 

Lord Strange

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All hail the Roman Khanate!
 

BootOnFace

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So the Russo-Asian war is still ongoing? And the East Asians have the advantage?
 

Gollevainen

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The east-asians went to figth russia in hoping him to march headlong into their heartlands and dry out himself from MP and max his WE.... since russia did that not, our fellow Sun Tzu's decided to reverse their strategy and march headlong into siberia to dry out their (much inferior) MP and max their WE :rolleyes:

I heard WP and some monetary reparations are beeing negotiated.
 

Sid Meier

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We won every battle. The problem is that I underestimated the logistics issues.

I will not make the same mistake twice :)
 

Gollevainen

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Well according to Jodokus you won those battles presented here..and only those. He won KoMs armies several times and stackwhiped at least 4 armies...
 

King of Men

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Jodokus exaggerates: Only two legions were stackwiped; his losses were heavier, although admittedly he also has deeper reserves. (Only talking about Khanate armies here - I wasn't looking at Blayne's Punjabi front.) As for who won the battles, you will observe that I am occupying his borderlands, and not vice-versa.
 

Gollevainen

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Well by that account wouldnt you then be all there to making demands? I mean, duh you occupy his border provinces... so what...really ;) do they win you the war :D??
 

BlitzMartinDK

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Well by that account wouldnt you then be all there to making demands? I mean, duh you occupy his border provinces... so what...really ;) do they win you the war :D??
It's not about winning the war, it's about winning the Peace (the negotiations leading to it... :D ) -And no more comment's from me here.. this IS the AAR' thread...
 

King of Men

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Why this sudden attack of straw men for a war you're not even involved in? Let your brother write his own propaganda. The claim was that Jodokus had been winning the battles. This claim may be refuted by noting that, if it were so, I would not be able to occupy even a single Russian province, because I would have been thrown out every time I came across the border. Since in fact I am occupying about half the disputed area, it is clear that I have won more battles than I lost. Now you suddenly jump to asking whether I've thereby won the war, which is a completely separate issue having nothing to do with what we were talking about. Please stick to what I actually said.
 

von_Rundstedt

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We won every battle. The problem is that I underestimated the logistics issues.

I will not make the same mistake twice :)
Looking at the last war you fought against Novgorod, you already made the same mistake twice. There's no victory in Siberia unless you outnumber your enemy atleast 2:1, with sufficient manpower reserves. You lack both - with Bavaria's involvement, Novgorod has both.
 

Sid Meier

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It was a significantly different war then, then I assaulted along with KoM, this time I tried flanking.
 

Irsh Faq

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So what is the actual situation in the Russian front? From what I have gathered it seems that the Komgol-Qin alliance is at a significant disadvantage, but I can't say I have close knowledge of it.
 

Sid Meier

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Out of manpower but I'm confident that if jodokus tried to press his advantage the situation will reverse.

Speaking of, this saturday I should be here on time. Be sure to be there to see the live stream :)
 
Last edited:

Gollevainen

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It's not about winning the war, it's about winning the Peace (the negotiations leading to it... )
Yes, lets attack russia to force him to WP us!!

King of Men


Why this sudden attack of straw men for a war you're not even involved in? Let your brother write his own propaganda. The claim was that Jodokus had been winning the battles.
I attack strawmen when they are making propaganda that doesen't fit to my observations. Im not defending jodokus here, nor speaking in behalf of him, Im speaking behalf of my own account, of what Ive witnessed and what Ive heard from the other side of the story.
If you would read carefully, my first post didn't even mention word battles, it was about strategy... which Blayne tried to shoot down noting, how they won battles, yet Jodokus accounted me that he whiped four stacks of you... and as much I've played eu3, I yet haven't seen stackwhipes happen without battle's beeing lost:p

Since in fact I am occupying about half the disputed area, it is clear that I have won more battles than I lost
You occupy provinces in Eu3 wars if the enemy lets you occupy them. There are two ways that to happen, either by you enforcing your enemy to allow you to do it, or the enemy allows you to do it for his own reasons. It does not by anymeans automatically equall more won battles, nor specially in case of figting in poorly supplied land into having upper hand in the war ;)
 

King of Men

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Yes, lets attack russia to force him to WP us!!
Hey, by the historical standards of Mongol/Russian wars, this is a significant victory. Bells will be rung! :D

As I said in the game, if vR had been in charge of Russia his armies would be sieging New Byzantium right now.

I attack strawmen when they are making propaganda that doesen't fit to my observations.
You set up a straw man, namely that I had claimed to be winning the war.

which Blayne tried to shoot down noting, how they won battles, yet Jodokus accounted me that he wiped four stacks of you... and as much I've played eu3, I yet haven't seen stackwhipes happen without battle's beeing lost:p
The Russian claims are somewhat vaguely associated with the truth: The Khanate has lost two stacks and destroyed four. That aside, when Blayne says "won every battle" he does not mean that literally every popup had the words "You Won" on it, but rather that after all re-engagements are accounted for, it was always the Russians who retreated. A battle for, let's say, Altai, may consist of the Khanate attacking with one stack, retreating after a few days, then two stacks hit the weakened Russians a couple of days later and win, driving them to retreat; then Russian reinforcements arrive and are driven off. Net strategic result: The Khanate won a battle. But the game reports it as one loss and two wins.

So what is the actual situation in the Russian front? From what I have gathered it seems that the Komgol-Qin alliance is at a significant disadvantage, but I can't say I have close knowledge of it.
The Khanate has advanced some distance into Russian territory, destroying several Russian armies on the way although also taking some losses, as recounted above. The Russian armies defending the border are now quite badly outnumbered and I'm about to destroy them in detail (assuming that the war continues), after which I will advance west to the Urals. Meanwhile the Qin armies have marched through Punjab to threaten Russia's southern flank, which is why Jodokus has not been able to use his full strength on the eastern border - he has to defend the south. However there are some logistical difficulties, as Blayne said. Negotiations are underway for a compromise peace.
 

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The Komneniad: Coming Into His Own

December 11th, 1645
New Byzantium, Roman Khanate
Midmorning

The air was a dismal grey that promised pneumonia for anyone out in it for long; but the Forum Romanum blazed with the heat of three thousand close-packed bodies, keeping the winter at bay. Or perhaps, Achilles thought mordantly, it's the heated rhetoric. A minor tribal dispute over who should have grazing rights in a particular oasis would not usually have packed the Forum; but that was when the tribes all gave loyalty to Rome. When the Cossack Host of the Urals clashed with the Oroteg, that was something else again. For behind the Cossacks loomed the Czar; and the Czar did not give offense by accident. The skirmishes were a clear challenge to the authority of Rome. If the Komnenoi backed down, they would look weak... but the last five decades had demonstrated all too clearly the sheer weight of metal that the settled lands could bring to bear. The debate had raged for hours, lurching between fear and aggression; there was an ugly undertone to the crowd noise as adrenaline sought an outlet.

Achilles waited for the current speaker - Ioannes was like himself, one of the New Men, heir to an ancient House but new to his position of power - to finish fulminating against the machinations of the Czar with the formal invocation "I thank the Forum for allowing me to speak". Then he rose, catching the eye of the Consul Honorius who was presiding. Honorius had been expecting it, but - consummate politican that he was - managed to make it look not the least premeditated when he ignored three Senators senior to Achilles. "The Forum will now hear the advice of the Senator Achilles, son of Peleus," he announced, and Achilles walked up to the podium, keeping his face carefully under control. The Forum was a lot like the Tibetans, or the Russians, or the various tribesmen under Khanate rule - well, like any humans, really. It was never a good idea to let them see you sweat.

"I thank the Forum for its courtesy; my words have been long considered," he began formally. Then he was out of the shelter of ritual and custom, and had to carry through on his own words. "I agree with my honoured colleague. The Czar is testing the waters. He has no intention of stopping until he reaches the Pacific. If we do not fight him now, we will fight him later, on worse terms. Therefore, I request that the Forum issue the Ultimate Decree; and I nominate myself for the position of Dictator."

There was silence, more of confusion than of shock. At length Honorius spoke. "Achilles," he said gently. "Yours is an honoured House. But you have not gained the support of one-third of the Equestrian order; you may not call for the Ultimate Decree."

Achilles took a deep breath. This was the moment when he passed beyond the safe boundaries of law, debate, and order, and into the debatable uplands between coup and legalism. "Ah, but I have, honoured Consul. Look there."

Honorius followed his pointing finger to the edges of the Forum, where a hundred men were in the process of donning armour and raising an Eagle. His lips tightened, but he gave no other sign of distress. "Those are men of the twelfth Legion, Senator; the Victrix, not the Komnenoi. They bear arms in the service of Rome; but they are not Equestrians, with the right to give weight to words spoken in the Forum."

"That is old law, Consul. I remind you of the reason for the law: So that words should not be too far removed from the reality of power. But our fathers wrote in the days when there was only one Legion on the steppes; one Legion, and a hundred thousand skirmishing auxilia. To fight the Czar, and to cconquer Tibet, we have raised eighteen Legions. Eighteen Eagles, led by one! The word of the Equestrians does not carry the weight it once did, honoured Consul. I propose that we remedy that imbalance. Declare these men to be Equestrians, and announce that every man who has served his twenty years shall have the same privilege, whatever his birth. Unite the tribes behind the Eagles, by giving them a voice in its councils. And fulfil the destiny of Rome: For is not every man a citizen?"

Honorius's face was grey, but he spoke calmly. "Once Rome ruled from Hadrian's wall to the Euphrates. Then came a year in which an ambitious Legate crossed the Rubicon, in defiance of written law. Caesar had good reasons for his act; he, too, thought of the spirit and not the letter of the law. But when the letter was broken by the threat of force, the spirit died. Your suggestion is not without merit, Achilles. But the Forum cannot, cannot, allow itself to be threatened into any decree, no matter how good the reason. The law must stand supreme. If that legitimacy is once lost, the year will inevitably come when four Legions each declare their Legate emperor; and the Czar will fight the Chinese for the mouth of the Amur. Don't do this, Achilles. Once the Senate made a mistake, and Rome was dishonoured; and you wish to ensure that we avoid repeating that mistake. I agree with you. But please, I beg as one who has seen what misplaced cleverness can lead to, please do not do it this way. Act within the law; and if Rome falls, let it at least fall to barbarians outside our gates."

Achilles bowed his head, drawing his sword. Honorius had not become Consul of a fractious people by being indecisive; he drew breath to speak, and Achilles knew he had only seconds before the order to kill was given, and blood spilled in the Forum. "You are right, Honorius," he near-shouted; and knelt. Honorius froze in surprise.

"You are right," Achilles repeated, more quietly. There was utter silence in the Forum. "I intended no coup; I make no threat of force. But I call for a necessary measure." He flipped his sword, holding it out to Honorius hilt first. "I call again for the vote: Let the veterans of the Auxilia be declared Equestrians, able to support me in the Forum. And while the vote is taken, hold this sword to my throat; and if you still think I have gone too far, drive it home."

Honorius took the sword, and Achilles held his breath. It was quite possible that the old man would decide to kill him. He locked gazes with the Consul, fighting not to flinch. They stood thus for minutes, until Achilles thought he would scream from the tension of it. At length Honorius nodded, once, and took the blade off Achilles's throat.

"Very well," he said. "The Senator has made submission to the State, as all citizens must; he makes no threat. This being so, we may consider his proposal on the merits."

December 12th, 1645
New Byzantium, Roman Khanate
Noon

"Ave, Achilles! Ave, Achilles, Imperator!" The deep-throated chant shook the Forum, and Achilles smiled grimly as he took the podium again.

"My people," he began.
 
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