DAIM Metathread - Information and Discussion

[e-stab]

The order in which you install the Bigpack and SMEP makes no difference as they contain totally different files, both will work equally well.
Overwriting the older Bigpack with the new one is also no problem, but you should start a new game then (or finish old ones before installing). Changing the AI during ongoing games usually has little effect because the changes lack the necessary game time to show their effects.

 

[unmerged(21283)]

The order in which you install the Bigpack and SMEP makes no difference as they contain totally different files, both will work equally well.
Overwriting the older Bigpack with the new one is also no problem, but you should start a new game then (or finish old ones before installing). Changing the AI during ongoing games usually has little effect because the changes lack the necessary game time to show their effects.

Thanks.

 

[unmerged(41406)]

Not the result I was hoping for

Well, I am new to DAIM. So I decided to run a couple of hands off with myself as Switzerland. The results were not the best. The new Jap AI crushed China by 1939. However, I liked the fact that the number of INF divisions the Japanese get has been reduced.

The United States is still ridicules. 150 INF divisions by 1940??? After that I said enough is enough, this is not the mod for me. I understand you had the AI produce nothing but factories for the US till 1938. That needs to be changed till at least 1939, with them going to ramp production of normal units starting only in 1940, AFTER the break out of a European war. I will run another run through to be sure that these two were not an anomoly, but I am thinking that this is not the case.

 

[Spocky]

Hello and welcome to DAIM

I don't understand the problem you have with DAIM . What wrong letting the USA build Vainilla INV ? Would you prefer building tons of old ships ?

Spocky

 

[Graymane]

Well, I am new to DAIM. So I decided to run a couple of hands off with myself as Switzerland. The results were not the best. The new Jap AI crushed China by 1939. However, I liked the fact that the number of INF divisions the Japanese get has been reduced.

The United States is still ridicules. 150 INF divisions by 1940??? After that I said enough is enough, this is not the mod for me. I understand you had the AI produce nothing but factories for the US till 1938. That needs to be changed till at least 1939, with them going to ramp production of normal units starting only in 1940, AFTER the break out of a European war. I will run another run through to be sure that these two were not an anomoly, but I am thinking that this is not the case.

You should read the first paragraph of the first post in this thread where it lays out the goals of DAIM. DAIM is not meant to be a historical mod, it is meant to provide a more challenging AI that would play more like a person would play it as far as research and build priorities. You don't need to run another test case, it is MEANT to build that many (in fact all the DAIM countries to that to more or less extent). You can open the AI files for each country (the 36 versions for example) and see that most have an infantry = 100 for build priorities.

 

[unmerged(41406)]

You should read the first paragraph of the first post in this thread where it lays out the goals of DAIM. DAIM is not meant to be a historical mod, it is meant to provide a more challenging AI that would play more like a person would play it as far as research and build priorities. You don't need to run another test case, it is MEANT to build that many (in fact all the DAIM countries to that to more or less extent). You can open the AI files for each country (the 36 versions for example) and see that most have an infantry = 100 for build priorities.

Yes, but by your logic DAIM is nothing more than some sort of attempt to fudge the AI into creating nothing but tons of INF units with the hope of this somehow making it tougher in single player. Your abbrogation of the use of planes, armor, ships and aircraft lessens the AI rather than makes it stronger. Plus your comment in saying the AI would play like a person. I simply cannot fathom any US player wanting to create nothing but INF divisions in 1938. Plus the Soviets creating 300 plus INF, not only would this put an exhaustive strain on TC it simply lacks any cohesive plan other than build, build, build as much INF as it can.l

 

[unmerged(41044)]

Yes, but by your logic DAIM is nothing more than some sort of attempt to fudge the AI into creating nothing but tons of INF units with the hope of this somehow making it tougher in single player. Your abbrogation of the use of planes, armor, ships and aircraft lessens the AI rather than makes it stronger. Plus your comment in saying the AI would play like a person. I simply cannot fathom any US player wanting to create nothing but INF divisions in 1938. Plus the Soviets creating 300 plus INF, not only would this put an exhaustive strain on TC it simply lacks any cohesive plan other than build, build, build as much INF as it can.l

Seriously: read and play some more before posting things like this. By no stretch of the imagination does DAIM make the AI weaker. What a bizarre and ridiculous claim.

As to complaining about the amount of infantry the AI makes - both the US and USSR can easily support the large numbers of inf you cite. Suggesting that they're somehow going to overload their TC is laughable in the first place, and not something DAIM determines in the second place. DAIM alters the *priorities* of the AI - whether the AI builds 'too much' of something is an engine decision that it can't effect.

This is a *mod*. It's aims are clear - to provide a better challenge from the AI. If you don't like it don't use it.

 

[Graymane]

Yes, but by your logic DAIM is nothing more than some sort of attempt to fudge the AI into creating nothing but tons of INF units with the hope of this somehow making it tougher in single player.

If you want to see what the AI is going to build throughout the years, I'd suggest reading through the mod files and see what they do. The switch files tell you what will be used and built throughout the years. In the 36 scenario until the AI switches, it will FOCUS on INF as it is BY FAR the most sensible thing to do and is what most players, in fact, do. Not every country does this to the same extent.

Your abbrogation of the use of planes, armor, ships and aircraft lessens the AI rather than makes it stronger.

The AI will build all of those things at the APPROPRIATE time. That time is not anytime prior to 1938. It is hard to think of strategy that is more stupid that building ships before at least the 38 techs. The use of planes is even more readily dispensed with as the AI doesn't use planes correctly at anytime or in any sense. The AI will of course build armor, lol, esp when there is some worth building without upgrading half a dozen times.

Plus your comment in saying the AI would play like a person. I simply cannot fathom any US player wanting to create nothing but INF divisions in 1938. Plus the Soviets creating 300 plus INF, not only would this put an exhaustive strain on TC it simply lacks any cohesive plan other than build, build, build as much INF as it can.l

Err..lol, most players playing whatever country tend to build far more units than were traditionally made. That is so patently obvious it does't even merit much comment. You can use a stupid strategy like building naval in the US prior to 38 and still win because the US is easy to win with. When I say "more how a person" would play, what I mean is that the AI won't make boneheaded build decisions like building navy prior to 38 as the US or pumping out ships as germany. It will actually build units that are useful to build (i.e., infantry, the single most powerful unit (bang for the buck) in HOI 2 under most conditions rather than militia and garrison). If it has to pick something early on to build, it will build infantry that are cheap and easy to upgrade.

 

[unmerged(41406)]

The AI will build all of those things at the APPROPRIATE time. That time is not anytime prior to 1938. It is hard to think of strategy that is more stupid that building ships before at least the 38 techs. The use of planes is even more readily dispensed with as the AI doesn't use planes correctly at anytime or in any sense. The AI will of course build armor, lol, esp when there is some worth building without upgrading half a dozen times.

First, I never suggested that the US build a navy, my suggestion was that prior to 1939 the US should build factories and other defenses, such as AA for Guam and Wake, Coastal defenses for the same. I do agree with you that building ships prior to a certain year is useless.

The use of planes is even more readily dispensed with as the AI doesn't use planes correctly at anytime or in any sense. The AI will of course build armor, lol, esp when there is some worth building without upgrading half a dozen times.

I do agree the AI is extremely poor in its choice of aircraft, there is no denying this. However, your reply that countries should wait to build armor units, IE Germany until they have reached a certain tech level I do not. LOL. During my run throughs Germany did not build one panzer division until 1940 and was stuck on the 3 they originally get. Waiting until they get medium armor, is unhistorical. Yes, I DO know this is about trying to improve/fudge the AI and is not about historocity yet you must realize that there are many players out there who are rather unforgiving when it comes to this sort of thing, and if your mod is to survive (and I do think it is a worthy one, albiet in need of some work) you must make an attempt to meet in the middle with us historical gronards.

Seriously: read and play some more before posting things like this. By no stretch of the imagination does DAIM make the AI weaker. What a bizarre and ridiculous claim.

FYI, I never used the word weaker. I said fudged, you use the increase of INF units to hide the inadequcies of AI, hence fudged. I never said weakend, it is tougher than the vanilla AI, but only because of the massive infusion of INF units, nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Graymane]

The focus of DAIM has been on the AI files (other mods use other approaches or a combination of approaches). Mostly, what you can do with that is the following:

1. Change build priorities
2. Change how the front and garrison AIs behave
3. Change some research focus

There is NO WAY to make the AI use its troops "better" in the sense of actually using an airforce correctly or correctly constructing and using a surface fleet. Within the limits of the game mechanics (including "gamey" stuff), the aim of the DAIM mod is to get the best challenge out of the AI as possible. If I'm playing as germany, I don't want to see a USA I can walk over and conquer cause it only built 3 divisions (but has loads of 'fluff' like static defenses, garrisons and an obsolete fleet). I want an ahistorical USA that builds 150 INF divisions and makes it more difficult to conquer. If I'm playing the USA, I want an ahistorical Japan that presents something approaching a challenge so I don't have to just send 6 transports to the coast and conquer it within a few months.

If you are really concerned with historical OOBs and such and want the AI to build "logically/historically" correct things then try one of the mods that prides itself on being "historical". There are a number of them already out there. Stony Road, Starfire, and TRP are the 3 that I know have been released as of right this moment. The others seem to be waiting for 1.2.

I myself currently use DAIM Axis + Starfire as I generally play allied powers.

 

[Graymane]

I do agree the AI is extremely poor in its choice of aircraft, there is no denying this. However, your reply that countries should wait to build armor units, IE Germany until they have reached a certain tech level I do not. LOL. During my run throughs Germany did not build one panzer division until 1940 and was stuck on the 3 they originally get. Waiting until they get medium armor, is unhistorical.

I would say it depends on the country. The USA has no reason to build + upgrade armor, it can afford to wait and research while building the rest of its army. Germany is a different case and is one of those exceptions when I mentioned "not every country does this to the same extent". In fact, Germany SHOULD be building armor from 1936 onwards and you should post something in the Germany thread about it NOT building armor. In my games, Germany seems to build plenty of armor. It should also be building interceptors, mnt troops, HQ, land forts, AA, and navy (although I generally mod out the navy builds in my version).

EDIT: Looking at the latest version of the Germany 36 AI file, Germany should be building more armor than vanilla.

 

[Dracleath]

Just did a hands off game with the new release. Everything seems within the limits of reason. Major events:

Germany annexed France rather quickly after declaring on belgium and the netherlands in 1940. Also annexed denmark but never really managed to invade norway.

Balkan wars proceeded beautifully.

Japan didn't declare on china until mid-38. I think this might have just been weirdness in this game though, I've seen them declare earlier before.

China kicked out Japan after a fairly long battle, I think the last japanese forces were defeated in 1942 or so. NatChi ended up with everything from korea to indochina.

Barbarosa plunged into the SU, stalled, and the russians bit back. The front held out for a long time, but the russians marched on germany and annexed them in 1943.

The allies managed an invasion of belgium, and took most of belgium before the russians conquered the rest of the german territory.

Japan invaded and conquered the phillipines, but didn't bother with any other allied territory.

At the end of my game in 44' (ended due to me getting bored as it was a foregone conclusion that the allies won), the US had completely invaded the Japanese home islands. It had not, however taken back the phillipines, which were the last bastion of the japanese.

 

[Pocus]

I would like to start a fresh game with DAIM, but in 1939. Is it possible?

 

[Spocky]

There are no probs with 1936 and 1939. Unsupported are 1941 and 1944

Spocky

 

[Pocus]

thx Spocky. And is the game a challenge with Germany on H/F for a not too incompetent player? Standard HoI is still a breeze...

got a problem, your download link is non functionnal since 3 hours, any other links to grab your bigpack?

 

[Spocky]

DAIM should be more challenging than vanilla HoI on hard (or very hard?).
I played with DAIM and build to much ships and it was tougher than expected.
The links are fine as far as we know .

Spocky

 

[Pocus]

still a timeout error

 

[Spocky]

Do you use a proxyserver ?
You can temporarily use this link
Special link for Pocus
This link will work for the next 12 hours

Spocky

 

[Pocus]

missed your special link (was away) but today it works with the regular. I will keep you informed as soon as I start the game. thanks.

 

[Spocky]

My server has no static IP so maybe you have been routed to an obsolete IP yesterday. But great that it worked today

Spocky