Instead in my oppinion the invasion saved Europa from being overun by the Soviets. French Comunist Partisans was very disapointed and in Paris when deGaule hade his parade they tried to snipe him with several snipers. .
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This is probably a valid assumption, given that the Russians were already driving the Nazis back by June 1944. I doubt very much, however, that DeGaulle was almost shot by snipers in Paris.
Steele
Steele
Well its not profed.
Could have been Germans too. But the FreeFrench and the Communist Partisans didn´t see eye to an eye in most matters.
Could have been Germans too. But the FreeFrench and the Communist Partisans didn´t see eye to an eye in most matters.
Without a western front (after D-day) the germans may have driven the russians back.
I suspect that partisan resistance to the Soviets would have been heavy the further west they went. I think the Soviets were still fighting partisans in the Ukraine while advancing into Germany. They would have had big problems if their supply lines streched to France IMO
With what. Bagration destroyed Armee Gruppe Center and Isolated the North armee gruppe. Without the D-Day the conference (where they divided up Europa) would be void and the Russians would have ignored the treaty. There where ofcource countries they didn´t keep like norway after they liberated Norway.
Anyway near the supply problems the Germans holding out in France, Benelux and Norway would have had after Germany was Sovjet occupied?
I agree with wolfbtl. If D-Day never happened, Europe would be ruled by the soviets. The Germans would hav HUGE difficulties conquering Russia, because the soviets have so much land to move on. They could just have withdrawn long into Siberia until the german supply lines collapsed. Partisans would make the situation worse for the germans and so...
Though I agree the Soviets would have beaten Germany without D-day, I fail to see how they could control western europe.
In Italy the americans were making slow progress, but when there is no d-day the troops could be diverted that way. Not to mention that Stalin needed the 2nd front, so he could go directly to Berlin.
Another related point is that most deaths in the concentration camps were in '44, and the result of no d-day would be an unimaginable increase in victims.
Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
How so? I fail to see the connection.
How so? I fail to see the connection.
Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
Well for every month that a concentration camp isnt liberated, the death count continues.
Re: Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
But wasn't all the big ones in the east?
Re: Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
at the same time one can argue that most of the killing took place as the Allies were approaching the camps. Why bother killing the workforce?
at the same time one can argue that most of the killing took place as the Allies were approaching the camps. Why bother killing the workforce?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
Add to this the hard winter of 1944, the lack of food and the increasing brutal behaviour of the germans in the west.
yes, but without d-day, the progress would have been slower, how much is up to speculation, plus that not all were in the east and there were durchganglagers as well, which could have been put to a different use.
Add to this the hard winter of 1944, the lack of food and the increasing brutal behaviour of the germans in the west.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
I disagree. Paradoxically, it was the Allied advance that was responsible for many victims in the camps. Extermination of camp prisoners was a direct result of German incapability to support them, which, in turn, was a result of Allied success to cut off German supplies. Not to mention that many died from hunger, sickness and bombs.
I disagree. Paradoxically, it was the Allied advance that was responsible for many victims in the camps. Extermination of camp prisoners was a direct result of German incapability to support them, which, in turn, was a result of Allied success to cut off German supplies. Not to mention that many died from hunger, sickness and bombs.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
What you say is true, but the camps were working before, they just speeded up when the allies approached.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: D-Day didn´t save Europa from the nazis
that's what I am saying. If no one is approaching why speed up? Jews and Slavs come cheap, but there is only a fixed number of them. Why kill them before their time when they can serve the Reich?
that's what I am saying. If no one is approaching why speed up? Jews and Slavs come cheap, but there is only a fixed number of them. Why kill them before their time when they can serve the Reich?