That should be prevented by the other conditions I suggested, as no neighbouring province would be in the celtic group (The Ibero-Celts are in a separate continental_celtic group), and it would be likely that the Saxon dynasty would not have a capital in the British Isles.
I just meant to use the Alemanni & Suebi as examples. Perhaps a better one would be Lombards or Bavarians, but my point was that it'd be rather odd to see non-Anglo/Saxon/Jute/generally Ingvaeonic Germanic groups in Britain (and especially ruling characters of their culture) inexplicably turning into, and calling themselves Anglo-Saxons over time.
How about something like the following as a series of events:
namespace = WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture
character_event = {
id = WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture.1
title = EVTTITLE_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_1
desc = EVTDESC_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_1
picture = GFX_evt_stone_church #Placeholder
border = GFX_event_normal_frame_diplomacy
trigger = {
#has_global_flag = saxon_lancaster
NOT = { has_global_flag = anglo_saxon_ethnogenesis }
NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture = english }
year = 500
OR = {
culture = anglo
culture = jute
culture = old_saxon
culture = old_frisian
culture = frisian
#culture = chatti
#culture = cheruscii
#culture = thuringian
#culture = warnic
#culture = reudignian
}
capital_scope = {
region = world_europe_west_brittania
NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture = english }
}
OR = {
any_realm_province = {
OR = {
culture_group = celtic
culture = romano_british
}
}
any_realm_province = {
any_neighbor_province = {
OR = {
culture_group = celtic
culture = romano_british
}
}
}
}
}
mean_time_to_happen = {
years = 100
modifier = {
factor = 0.2
NOT = { religion_group = pagan_group }
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.5
is_reformed_religion = yes
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.5
spouse = {
NOT = { culture = ROOT }
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
}
}
}
immediate = {
set_global_flag = anglo_saxon_ethnogenesis
}
option = {
name = EVTOPTA_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_1
trigger = {
NOT = { culture = saxon }
}
any_child = {
limit = { culture = ROOT }
culture = saxon
}
culture = saxon
if = {
limit = {
capital_scope = {
NOT = { culture = saxon }
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
}
}
capital_scope = {
culture = saxon
religion = ROOT
}
}
}
}
character_event = {
id = WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture.2
title = EVTTITLE_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_2
desc = EVTDESC_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_2
picture = GFX_evt_stone_church #Placeholder
border = GFX_event_normal_frame_diplomacy
trigger = {
has_global_flag = anglo_saxon_ethnogenesis
culture = saxon
any_realm_province = {
region = world_europe_west_brittania
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture = english }
}
}
mean_time_to_happen = {
months = 12
modifier = {
factor = 0.2
NOT = { religion_group = pagan_group }
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.5
is_reformed_religion = yes
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.5
spouse = {
NOT = { culture = ROOT }
#NOT = { culture = saxon }
#NOT = { culture = english }
#NOT = { culture = saxon }
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
}
}
}
option = {
name = EVTOPTA_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_2
trigger = {
culture = saxon
}
random_realm_province = {
limit = {
region = world_europe_west_brittania
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture = english }
}
}
}
}
character_event = {
id = WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture.3
title = EVTTITLE_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_3
desc = EVTDESC_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_3
picture = GFX_evt_stone_church #Placeholder
border = GFX_event_normal_frame_diplomacy
trigger = {
has_global_flag = anglo_saxon_ethnogenesis
NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture = english }
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
OR = {
AND = {
independent = no
top_liege = {
culture = saxon
}
}
AND = {
is_landed = no
host = {
culture = saxon
capital_scope = {
region = world_europe_west_brittania
}
}
}
AND = {
independent = yes
num_of_count_titles = 1
NOT = { num_of_count_titles = 2}
tier = COUNT
capital_scope = {
region = world_europe_west_brittania
any_neighbor_province = {
culture = saxon
owner = {
top_liege = {
culture = saxon
primary_title = { higher_tier_than = COUNT }
}
}
}
}
}
}
}
mean_time_to_happen = {
days = 30
modifier = {
factor = 0.2
NOT = { religion_group = pagan_group }
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.5
is_reformed_religion = yes
}
}
option = {
name = EVTOPTA_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_3
trigger = {
is_landed = no
}
any_child = {
limit = { culture = ROOT }
culture = saxon
}
culture = saxon
}
option = {
name = EVTOPTB_WTWSMS_anglo_saxon_culture_3
trigger = {
is_landed = yes
}
any_child = {
limit = { culture = ROOT }
culture = saxon
}
culture = saxon
random_demesne_province = {
limit = {
region = world_europe_west_brittania
OR = {
culture_group = central_germanic
culture_group = east_germanic
culture_group = west_germanic
culture_group = north_germanic
}
NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture = english }
}
culture = saxon
}
}
}Wow, that chain looks awesome. So awesome, in fact, that I can't think of anything else to add, haha.
Regarding the discussion on Anglo-Saxons I agree with the broad thoughts outlined and suggested as a basis of implementation and thank you for the helpful illustration in the code, but this is particular condition is one I don't understand the motivation behind.
My motivation is that it seems that it was the juxtaposition of the Germanic peoples in contrast to the native Britons that led to the common Anglo-Saxon identity, rather than continuing with their original tribal identities.
That is an interesting view on the matter! But wouldn't one in-game terms be able to say the progression towards a system closer to the Anglo-Saxon model of feudalism also spawned a distinct identity from the previous tribal systems?
Yes, there are broadly two different conflicting views on the matter from what I understand, with some believing in the arrival of large numbers of Germanic migrants and their takeover through hostility against the native population of Britons, while others see it more like a process where small groups of Germanic migrant elites influenced and were emulated by the indigenous Britons. I guess both could be interpreted as arguments in favour of seeing the Britons as a factor in the Anglo-Saxon emergence.
Well, I personally think that even if the Britons or Romano-British are not in majority in any province, their influence on the area is felt, especially since in your suggested example you have a region defined in the trigger. Therefore it seems like a plausible development nonetheless.
Not planned, no, because that might as well be done with every single culture. Also, the provinces don't just turn into the other culture, it is a long process in the mod.
Fair enough, I got curious because I found an unused culture called brittonic_jute in 00_cultures. Unfortunate, as I believe a Romano-Briton-Saxon melting pot would be plausible, but I understand why it won't be done. I also found what appear to be other melting pots, some which I think are about as plausible as brittonic_jute or Romano-Briton-Saxon like romano_persian and greek_persian, but their namelists seem to just be copypasted mashups of their constituent cultures' - will those also remain unused or be fleshed out as additional melting pots down the road?
brittonic_jute will definitely be shelved for now, as it would overlap with the existing plans. When it comes to romano_persian and greek_persian, the name lists would first of all have to be redone to be plausible, and then we would have to evaluate if they can come to use.
If this gets implemented, the Romano-Briton-Saxon culture could be called "Anglian" or "Sæxanglí/Sæxanglî" (combination of Saxone (Latin), Seaxe (Old English), and Anglii (Latin))
Thank you, but the thread is still open, there is absolutely no need to post here if you don't have anything to add to the discussion.
I don't understand where you get that from. We have several alt-history melting-pots, such as Galleis, Brídaney, Réyanu or Pièlsuzhany. Although only for those that we decided to make based upon the criterias of the time we had available and plausibility, hence why we started working with the Romance group and released that.
