Crusader Kings III: Modding?

[LizardCommander]

How mod-able will the game be from launch? Will there be any assets or resources available to make it easier?

Given some of the new changes to CK3 (as opposed to CK2), how difficult or easy will it be for modders to add in custom assets (i.e. say Warcraft, Elder Kings?)

This would be a major selling point for me at least, while I certainly have several hundred hours of gameplay in base CK2, the Mods are definitely a solid addition to the game, and are the only reason I still enjoy the game

 

[Alfray Stryke]

It’ll be as easy to mod as Imperator.

 

[prismaticmarcus]

PDS games are always designed to be moddable

 

[Kadmus]

I'm pretty sure it'll be moddable but I can't wait to see what the asoiaf characters look like in ck3

 

[Mark von Trient]

I've had a quick look at the Imperator files and it looks like the code logic is still quite similar to all the other PDS games, including CK2, and this is true for the map files as well, so I guess that porting CK2 mods to CK3 shouldn't be that hard, we will see

 

[LizardCommander]

I've had a quick look at the Imperator files and it looks like the code logic is still quite similar to all the other PDS games, including CK2, and this is true for the map files as well, so I guess that porting CK2 mods to CK3 shouldn't be that hard, we will see

I imagine that most of the mods will NOT be portable, beyond lore / events / etc., as the syntax will probably change due to a change in the resources available

Assuming it is possible, I expect that the 'focus trees' will be used by Modders to form Classes, i.e. Paladin, Ranger, Warrior in Warcraft, or say Mage in Elder Kings

Beyond that though, every update they had to rewrite a lot of the existing code to deal with changed references or syntax, etc., so I imagine it'll be the same in CK3

 

[Mark von Trient]

I imagine that most of the mods will NOT be portable, beyond lore / events / etc., as the syntax will probably change due to a change in the resources available

Assuming it is possible, I expect that the 'focus trees' will be used by Modders to form Classes, i.e. Paladin, Ranger, Warrior in Warcraft, or say Mage in Elder Kings

Beyond that though, every update they had to rewrite a lot of the existing code to deal with changed references or syntax, etc., so I imagine it'll be the same in CK3

Some of the syntax will probably change, but it's likely that at least the basic commands will keep being the same. I did some CK2 modding for example, then I looked at a HoI3 mod and I was able to understand its syntax even though I never did HoI3 modding before because the syntax is very similar across all PDS games throughout different years. A concern could be the fact that they're using an updated game engine for CK3 but as I said I looked at some IR files (updated game engine as well) and the classic syntax for the events/decisions etc (with allow, potential, effect, the scopes etc) looks almost identical to the CK2 syntax, and I guess that the CK3 syntax will be even more similar as it's a direct sequel

I'm not saying that the modders will be able to port the mods to CK3 with no changes but I'm quite sure that most of the syntax will keep being the same. The main problem could be about new/removed gameplay mechanics if the mod relied on them

 

[Cardolam]

[..]I'm not saying that the modders will be able to port the mods to CK3 with no changes[..]

Pretty sure it is impossible as the mean time to happen has been cut, for isntance. Now possibly the events must be declared in on_actions and randomized its frequency through there. Also, there will be different commands/triggers to consider.

Regarding the main subject of the thread and without expanding further, I know for a fact that Paradox is deeply taking into consideration the modders, their dedication and their work.

 

[Dragatus]

I expect it'll be highly moddable from the get go. Modding CK2 is mostly just fiddling with text files. The one issue will be mods that require new graphical assets as those will take time to create. PDX did mention the possibility of giving certain modders early access to the game, though I expect that'll be mostly people who worked on total conversions such as AGOT or Elder Kings. So they'll get a bit extra time to make their graphical assets.

 

[Nikolai]

For one, I'm pretty sure CK2 uses MTTH in their event files. These are no longer used in CK3, so the events will have to be rewritten at the least. Map also will have to be reworked I'd imagine, so I don't expect 1:1 converstion anytime soon. Except if the members of those mods are included in the beta and get enough time to write their mods. After all, things change a LOT in games dev, all the way until shortly before launch.

 

[Mark von Trient]

For one, I'm pretty sure CK2 uses MTTH in their event files. These are no longer used in CK3, so the events will have to be rewritten at the least. Map also will have to be reworked I'd imagine, so I don't expect 1:1 converstion anytime soon. Except if the members of those mods are included in the beta and get enough time to write their mods. After all, things change a LOT in games dev, all the way until shortly before launch.

We won't know until the game is out obviously, but looking at IR the map files, the rivers, provinces and heighmap pictures are identical to the CK2 ones (not exactly identical as they're bigger, the provinces are different etc, but you get what I'm saying). I mean, if someone showed me those pictures I wouldn't be able to tell whether they're from IR or CK2 other than for their size. What could be slightly different is the terrain map and there are a couple of additional heightmap files. The CK3 counties look quite similar to the CK2 ones so it could be enough to just increase the size of the modded CK2 map, the problem then is that you'd have to split up all the counties into baronies as they're on the map in CK3. On top of that modders may want to recreate the maps from scratch, or add some more impassable terrain as it seems like it will have a bigger impact in the CK3 gameplay. Another potential difference could be the provinces/titles files but I expect that they will keep using a similar structure, we will see

As for the lack of MTTH that's true, but that's still just the trigger condition, it shouldn't require too much work on its own, but then there could potentially be other changes in the syntax that require additional work. It won't be easy but it will take way less time than it took to create them from scratch for CK2 for sure

 

[blackninja9939]

There is a fair amount of syntax differences, the core of the CK2 script language is 8 years old, the CK3 script setup was built from the ground up by making Jomini so it has a better and more general way to do things and share feature across newer games such as with Imperator.

Things like history files are probably the thing that has remained the closest, but all the event scripting will be different enough that you can't copy paste things directly and have it work they would all need a lot of modification.

 

[Mark von Trient]

There is a fair amount of syntax differences, the core of the CK2 script language is 8 years old, the CK3 script setup was built from the ground up by making Jomini so it has a better and more general way to do things and share feature across newer games such as with Imperator.

Things like history files are probably the thing that has remained the closest, but all the event scripting will be different enough that you can't copy paste things directly and have it work they would all need a lot of modification.

Ok, thanks for the info

 

[MHC]

Is there a reason that the engine only supports static changes via the Paradox scripting language? I get that full plug-in support is too much to ask, but I'd really like a way to run another program asynchronously that could read the game state, adjust the game scripts on the fly, and run console commands (to trigger events or change the game state).

There are mods I'd like to try making that aren't really feasible without that capability. E.g. I'd like to try generating events dynamically using computational narrative intelligence.

On a more basic level, I'd like to be able to generically keep things "interesting" or otherwise have the game respond to what the players are doing in fairly sophisticated ways. I can go into the console manually and make changes to do this temporarily. But there's no generic way to do a "Mario Kart" type thing in multiplayer where the game actively helps weaker players and hinders stronger ones.

Is this something that is even possible to add in principle? (Or is there a way to do this sort of thing already that I don't know of?)

 

[Ixalmaris]

The biggest obstacle for modding will be the 3D portraits, especially for mods like Elder Kings or Mythos 2.

Making a few hand drawn 2D portraits of, for example, Khajit (Cat people in Elder Kings) is one thing.
But morphing 3D models with lots of variables to take genetics into account? Thats on a whole different level.

I doubt CK3 will get any bigger fantasy mods, at least mods with playable monsterous characters. At best we get elves or dwarfs which can be created by modifying human models (always short with a big beard for example) but no fantasy race that requires new models. And I also doubt CK3 will be able to handle nonhuman models for things like dragons unless Paradox adds support for this in order to have Glitterhoof.

Also I wonder if there still will be random events even without MTTH. Some things like a natural disaster are not triggered by actions.

 

[Karl244]

The biggest obstacle for modding will be the 3D portraits, especially for mods like Elder Kings or Mythos 2.

Making a few hand drawn 2D portraits of, for example, Kahajit (Cat people in Elder Kings) is one thing.
But morphing 3D models with lots of variables to take genetics into account? Thats on a whole different level.

I doubt CK3 will get any bigger fantasy mods, at least mods with playable monsterous characters. At best we get elves or dwarfs which can be created by modifying human models (always short with a big beard for example) but no fantasy race that requires new models. And I also doubt CK3 will be able to handle nonhuman models for things like dragons unless Paradox adds support for this in order to have Glitterhoof.

Also I wonder if there still will be random events even without MTTH. Some things like a natural disaster are not triggered by actions.

In Stellaris you can make static species characters instead of moving ones. Sure they do not look as great, but it is possible. I can imagine a similar method of creating new 'species' in CK3. Remember that the modding community is one of the most resourceful community and they will always find a way. Don't worry.

 

[Dragatus]

Is this something that is even possible to add in principle? (Or is there a way to do this sort of thing already that I don't know of?)

As far as the game actively helping players that are doing less well, it should be possible. You would just need to figure out a proper metric to measure, such as tier or realm size. You can then have positive events that trigger only for players below a certain threshold and negative events that trigger only for players above a certain threshold. You can also have hidden events that give say +/- 20% fertility and +/- 1 health, which wouldn't be immediately noticeable, but would have a tangible effect over a longer period.

Also I wonder if there still will be random events even without MTTH. Some things like a natural disaster are not triggered by actions.

When CK2 moved away from MTTH it wasn't towards action triggered events as much as periodic pulses that could result in a number of random actions. So instead of constantly monitoring all events and their chance to trigger the game would pick a random event at the start of a game year.

 

[Ixalmaris]

In Stellaris you can make static species characters instead of moving ones. Sure they do not look as great, but it is possible. I can imagine a similar method of creating new 'species' in CK3. Remember that the modding community is one of the most resourceful community and they will always find a way. Don't worry.

In Stellaris you still have hand drawn 2D models though. Even if they don't move it nit all that hard to add new ones. I have done that myself (even if I had to ask others to draw them).
Even static they do not look out if place.
Dealing with 3D models us a lot harder. Even if you ignore all the morphing and genetics, if that is even possible, and just have a dozen or so static models it is a lit harder to create them to not look out of place. And if they have a different body type you need to redo all the clothes etc.
That may be something the largest modding teams like the the Agot guys can do, but I doubt that there will be smaller mods like Mythos 2 (only 1-2 persons).

Still, if it will be possible to use static models without the morphing would be valuable information.

When CK2 moved away from MTTH it wasn't towards action triggered events as much as periodic pulses that could result in a number of random actions. So instead of constantly monitoring all events and their chance to trigger the game would pick a random event at the start of a game year.

Somewhere it was said that most (all?) events in CK3 are triggered.

Edit: And for me pulses are too predictable.

 

[Dragatus]

Ah, I haven't seen that quote. Did they specifically say triggered by characters? Because technically the periodic random events in CK2 were triggered too, just by a yearly pulse.

 

[Arko]

The biggest obstacle for modding will be the 3D portraits, especially for mods like Elder Kings or Mythos 2.

Making a few hand drawn 2D portraits of, for example, Kahajit (Cat people in Elder Kings) is one thing.
But morphing 3D models with lots of variables to take genetics into account? Thats on a whole different level.

I doubt CK3 will get any bigger fantasy mods, at least mods with playable monsterous characters. At best we get elves or dwarfs which can be created by modifying human models (always short with a big beard for example) but no fantasy race that requires new models. And I also doubt CK3 will be able to handle nonhuman models for things like dragons unless Paradox adds support for this in order to have Glitterhoof.

Also I wonder if there still will be random events even without MTTH. Some things like a natural disaster are not triggered by actions.

No doubt there will be some 3D skilled people around. Let's be positive.