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Well, it's been two weeks, so it's time for another bi-weekly entry in the saga of The Old Gods expansion for Crusader Kings II (we will ramp up the pace to weekly dev diaries from May 1). Today, I'll talk about what is, perhaps, the core feature of the expansion: raiding. All pagans have the option to raid, but it is especially important for Norse and Tengri rulers, who will start losing Prestige if they have been at peace for too long. Rather than declare a regular war, they can opt for some good old fashioned raiding.

CKII_ToG_DD_02_Heathen_Raid.png

So how does it work? It's easy; you simply raise an army, toggle it to raiding and move it to a suitable county. You cannot raid counties within the same realm as you, nor can you raid brothers of the faith, but everyone else is fair game. All counties now have a wealth bar that shows how much gold you can loot from the province. As long as your raiding army is standing in the province, it will drain the wealth bar. The loot is not taken from the treasury of the local ruler, but rather represents the possessions of the local clergy, burghers, farmers and lesser nobility. However, the top liege of the looted county will lose Prestige and all Holdings in a looted county will have a lower tax income until the bar has (slowly) replenished. Incidentally, all sieges (not just raiding) in a county will damage the wealth, but only raiders will get money from it.

CKII_ToG_DD_02_Loot_Bar.png

Loot from counties neighboring your own realm goes directly into your treasury, so looting farther afield is normally relatively pointless. However, Norse pagans have the option of raiding all coastal areas, no matter how distant. The problem is that such loot must be carried on ships and when the ships fill up, the raiders must return home and deposit the gold in the treasury. Initially, Norse fleets are also able to navigate many major rivers, like the Volga and the Seine, but when fort levels get too high in the adjacent counties, the rivers will become blocked off, representing fortified bridges and other key fortifications. Using the great eastern rivers and portages, the vikings are able to reach even the Caspian Sea.

The fort level in Holdings has another effect on raiding; it can protect a part of the wealth bar. Unfortunately for the defenders, this protection is of course lost if the raiders actually manage to occupy the local castles, cities and temples. Even worse, when raiders successfully siege down a Holding, there is a chance that some of its buildings are destroyed. In fact, the entire Holding can be razed to the ground, although this is a rare event. The raiders will get much loot from cracking open such golden eggs in addition to draining the wealth bar dry.

CKII_ToG_DD_02_Raid_on_Paris.png

The dynamic we have set up basically forces aggressive pagans (especially lower rank ones, like counts) to raid unless they want to live with negative Prestige. On the other hand, the gold and Prestige they get from raiding can be used to declare special wars, which I will talk about in the next developer diary (on April 17)!

Bonus:
A Paradox Development Studio Feature - Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods Highlights from the livestream:

Part 1
[video=youtube;eIX3zOChdgE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIX3zOChdgE[/video]

Part 2
[video=youtube;rysyfLfcpbw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rysyfLfcpbw[/video]
 
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You want to give Muslims both the ability to gain vast amounts of loot and the ability to freely invade all neighbours? There would be nothing left of Europe by 1100. I agree it's a little ahistorical not to let them but simply for balance purposes...

In fact, I would give them the former and strip them from the latter, because the latter has no sense after the initial Muslim expansion in the VII century. Just look at Iberia. In OTL Muslim conquest after the initial invasion of the Visigothic Kingdom was almost null, whilst raids happened periodically.

in my honest opinion, both muslims and christians should be able to raid aswell, BUT with a special condition, they MUST be at war against the target raided. Muslims used to raid and pillage a LOT in Iberia, and what to say about the muslim pirates raiding the Byzantine Empire (among other targets...). about the christians, shall we not forget about the many raid campaigns conducted during the 100 years war (just as an example).

I think the same. Just remember what did the Crusaders.

Perhaps everyone should be able to raid their respective heathens...

Of course, you still can raid as it is, even in 1.092: When you siege holdings, you get gold. Perhaps P'dox decided that traditional wars better represent the raiding activities of non-pagans.



Thats pretty much just normal warfare in CK2, then. With the added feature that the gold is coming from the county rather than the characters.

But there is no damage in this. No destruction of improvements.
 
In fact, I would give them the former and strip them from the latter, because the latter has no sense after the initial Muslim expansion in the VII century. Just look at Iberia. In OTL Muslim conquest after the initial invasion of the Visigothic Kingdom was almost null, whilst raids happened periodically.

The whole holy war, invasion and jihad mechanics are broken (jihad is for sunnites, orthodox don't get crusades either), but I think paradox cares much more about making gameplay fun for the average player than making it historical.
 
This looks interesting. :) Though I assume, that a defender can call his levies and his vassals to arms in order to try and drive the raiders back? Finally totally razing holdings often doesn't make sense anyway, since that means less potential loot for next raids.
 
Does the last fort level prevent the province from being looted at all?
 
How about raiding for Christians and Muslims as well, but toggling raiding on your army would cost you half of your prestige (minnimum of 10 or something like that) and/or piety. So that when you are still a nobody type of count on the end of the world, you don't actually care, but when you are like king of France and you start to count your game points it's kinda not advisable anymore. Or maybe even -50 or so to Pope relations (free excomunnication!). Free of charge for Tengri and Vikings.

EDIT: Or maybe just count it as tyranny -20 level. You know I'm kinda trying to model Reynald de Chatillon form Kingdom of Heaven type of raiding Christian guy.
 
The whole holy war, invasion and jihad mechanics are broken (jihad is for sunnites, orthodox don't get crusades either), but I think paradox cares much more about making gameplay fun for the average player than making it historical.

Did Orthodox Church ever crusade? No! So this is quiet historical.
 
Yea, crusades made no sense to the Orthodox, concept was foreign. I recognize the difficulty of balancing out historical facts with fun gameplay and game balance while also making religions feel different from each other.
 
take a look at East Francia too :)

They said they'd test that setup (where's the image from?), but if they go with it I hope they make the AI more aware of alliances - it would be stupid for the king of West Francia to fold to a faction with even 150% strength if his heir the king of Aquitaine is ready to help.
 
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Why not make navigable rivers as Shipbuilding technology unlock?

Or is it at least moddable?

May I try?

Navigating rivers should not be a matter of the level of technology, it should be a matter of ship types. I wish there were different ship types and only select provinces (or cultures or religions, whatever does the trick) were able to build ships that can travel by rivers.
 
Did Orthodox Church ever crusade? No! So this is quiet historical.

Exactly my point, so why do shiites get jihads?

May I try?

Navigating rivers should not be a matter of the level of technology, it should be a matter of ship types. I wish there were different ship types and only select provinces (or cultures or religions, whatever does the trick) were able to build ships that can travel by rivers.

I believe they said in the livestream that only vikings could do it (only viking longboats).
 
They said they'd test that setup (where's the image from?), but if they go with it I hope they make the AI more aware of alliances - it would be stupid for the king of West Francia to fold to a faction with even 150% strength if his heir the king of Aquitaine is ready to help.
they put that image on facebook this morning
 
Exactly my point, so why do shiites get jihads?



I believe they said in the livestream that only vikings could do it (only viking longboats).

I believe you are right. Shame though. Once Rus becomes Russian, will the river travel be impossible for it then? Makes little sense limiting this to just one culture.
 
With the Dev Diary 2 I am now twice as excited. Rivers were so valuable to trade and wealth, I'm glad they are finally going to have an impact. With wealth and plunder affecting how useful your holding is, ooh, I can't wait!

I really have issues with provinces only becoming more powerful as the game progresses, without regard for how raids and invasions can set a region back. Plus, with raid and siege damage, I might finally consider protecting my provinces rather than throwing the entire army into sieging the enemy faster than they siege me.