Crusader Kings II - Dev Diary 8 - Religion

Crusader Kings II - Dev Diary 8 - Religion

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Doomdark

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I like what I'm seeing. Will there be ways to up Moral Authority to balance out having an anti-pope? Will other secular kingdoms have options or AI tending to stamp out anti-popes?
Religions gain Moral Authority from things like succeeding with crusades, and also the skills of its chief pontiff.
 
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unmerged(33241)

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Hello, there will be another Developer Diary for heresies, ok. Will it be other differents mechanisms for the other religions ?
 

Doomdark

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Hello, there will be another Developer Diary for heresies, ok. Will it be other differents mechanisms for the other religions ?
There might be something more for religions with no official head.
 

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I like what I'm seeing. Will there be ways to up Moral Authority to balance out having an anti-pope? Will other secular kingdoms have options or AI tending to stamp out anti-popes?

I'm looking forward to how heresies work out, too. Will there be an implied "religious stringency" vs. "religious flexibility" slider working in the background as in CK1?

But I am imagining a progression here: Crown Investiture > Antipope > Heretical State Religion.
Really interesting question.

And I'm imagining another scenario : Heresy --> State adopting heresy as State Religion --> Schism !

I insist asking : may our ruler recognize an Antipope as legitimate ? And at what cost ?
That would be interesting if our ruler hasn't a great relationship with the current Pope but has a good one with someone else's Antipope.
 

Doomdark

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Really interesting question.

And I'm imagining another scenario : Heresy --> State adopting heresy as State Religion --> Schism !

I insist asking : may our ruler recognize an Antipope as legitimate ? And at what cost ?
That would be interesting if our ruler hasn't a great relationship with the current Pope but has a good one with someone else's Antipope.
Currently that is not possible, but it's something we've thought about.
 

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Really interesting question.

And I'm imagining another scenario : Heresy --> State adopting heresy as State Religion --> Schism !

I insist asking : may our ruler recognize an Antipope as legitimate ? And at what cost ?
That would be interesting if our ruler hasn't a great relationship with the current Pope but has a good one with his Antipope.
That would fit the situation during the Avignon Papacy, when the recognized Pope was essentially the French King's vassal. Can we do that by the way? Even with no Papal Controller, will secular rulers have influence if their bishops get elected Pope? How will Papal elections work?
 

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Dynasties have their own Coats of Arms in CKII, separate from titles.
I meant the "title" coat of arms. Also, you said that dynastis coat of arms would be random. That's bad :p I would offer myself to research dynastic coats of arms.

But also, my complain was more about the "coat of arms support" that appears in the map. The Imperial support is flashy, but OK, it's Imperial stuff. But the shape of the rest... is just too baroque. I really think it should be changed to permit something more genuinely medieval.

Also, is there a chance to get different degrees of heresy? I mean, Avignon's Papacy was not a heresy, but a schism for political reasons. If France adopted Catharism, things would have changed. I can picture the Cathars turning into some kind of repressive Calvinist-like inquisitors. Purity above all. Things would be different than just changing one pope for another.

Something like:

- Political schism
- Apostolic poverty preachers
- Waldensians
- Cathars
- Free Spirit and Fideles Amicitis
- Dulcinists

There's a huge difference between a schism (like the Anglican Church would be) and the Dulcinists (a violent communalism movement with mobs running across the country sacking churches, killing bishops and "levelling" the people to make everyone equal and destroy private property). Is there a way to represent that?
 

unmerged(18992)

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The more I hear, the more enthusiastic I am about this game.

CK 1 had great concepts but was bogged down by things that often made it annoying as hell to play. This looks like it will be everything that made CK1 fun, and everything that CK1 lacked.
 

the_hdk

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can there be more than one anti-pope? Like one for England and one for HRE? (at the same time )
 

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If it's a war over your antipope's claim to the Papacy, you can end the schism, yes.
Would'nt that defeat the point of having an Antipope ? Or would he keep the pork flowing in your direction ?

Also : can you revoke or lose your antipope ?

Sounds cool otherwise.
 

Doomdark

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can there be more than one anti-pope? Like one for England and one for HRE? (at the same time )
Yes, there can be several.
 

Doomdark

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Would'nt that defeat the point of having an Antipope ? Or would he keep the pork flowing in your direction ?
Making him official would be very prestigious and would restore Moral Authority to Catholicism.
 

the_hdk

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tnx for reply :D

how about regal names and anti-popes? will they follow the same path as popes?

for instance pope Alexander II and there is an anti-pope who's name is also Alexander. Will he be Alexander I or III?
let's say that anti-pope never become the real pope. and than 30 years later another real pope choose the name Alexander. Will he be Alexander III or IV? :)
 

phantom6700

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Religion is looking pretty cool. Got another unrelated question though: How will CK2 be handling the HRE? Will it work like a proper HRE like in EU3, or will it be a German Kingdom again like in CK1?
 

Doomdark

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tnx for reply :D

how about regal names and anti-popes? will they follow the same path as popes?

for instance pope Alexander II and there is an anti-pope who's name is also Alexander. Will he be Alexander I or III?
let's say that anti-pope never become the real pope. and than 30 years later another real pope choose the name Alexander. Will he be Alexander III or IV? :)
He would be Alexander III, but his name would not be recognized by the real Popes.
 

Doomdark

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So there is only one "regular" Orthodox patriarch in the game? No possibility to create a regional/autocephalous Orthodox church without being a heretic?
No.
 

RedRooster81

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Really interesting question.

And I'm imagining another scenario : Heresy --> State adopting heresy as State Religion --> Schism !

I insist asking : may our ruler recognize an Antipope as legitimate ? And at what cost ?
That would be interesting if our ruler hasn't a great relationship with the current Pope but has a good one with someone else's Antipope.
I'm already imagining the emergence of national churches across medieval Europe. Hopefully there will be a mechanism for religious flexibility and allowing some regional autonomy while staying under the umbrella of the Catholic Church. Heresy should above all be a willful political action.
 

Zechariah Zevi

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Can the Pope be moved from Rome without the existence of an Antipope (as happened with the Avignon Papacy up to 1378)?