Crossing Straits is bugged

[The Buyer]

Playing as England I was drawn into a war with Scotland by one of my allies declaring war on France.

Scotland crossed the Irish Sea to attack my province Meath. I moved naval units into the Irish Sea to trap Scotland in Ireland by preventing them from crossing the straits back into Scotland while I moved a small army up to Scotland to raid while the Scots were stuck in Ireland.

Scottish army completely ignored my naval units and crossed back over the straits to the mainland and attacked my small army.

 

[AndrewT]

Not a tech support issue so moved to main forum.

This is not a bug but a feature, it's in the 1.14 patch notes. If an alliance holds both land provinces on either side of a strait, they can now cross regardless of fleets.

 

[The Buyer]

Not a tech support issue so moved to main forum.

This is not a bug but a feature, it's in the 1.14 patch notes. If an alliance holds both land provinces on either side of a strait, they can now cross regardless of fleets.

Ok thanks for the info

 

[Powder hound]

Just being awkward, but how come Stranraer to Larne, 49 miles, is a strait yet Dover to Calais, 26 miles, isn't. Note measured using decent harbours, some of the straits in this game are a little wide, especially if you didn't have naval control.

 

[pgroves]

Just being awkward, but how come Stranraer to Larne, 49 miles, is a strait yet Dover to Calais, 26 miles, isn't. Note measured using decent harbours, some of the straits in this game are a little wide, especially if you didn't have naval control.

Probably for game play reasons e.g. England having problems taking out Ireland

 

[Xiahou Mao]

Just being awkward, but how come Stranraer to Larne, 49 miles, is a strait yet Dover to Calais, 26 miles, isn't. Note measured using decent harbours, some of the straits in this game are a little wide, especially if you didn't have naval control.

They don't want the English AI to have to struggle with moving armies to and from Ireland via transport, which can cause a lot of issues for them. On the flip side, they also don't want France or Burgundy to have easy access to England with their armies, potentially not needing even a single ship.

In short, England is meant to hold power and an advantage over Ireland. Mainland European powers are not meant to hold power and an advantage over island-bound England.

 

[Powder hound]

A reasoned but not an elegant solution

 

[Nick VR85]

Just being awkward, but how come Stranraer to Larne, 49 miles, is a strait yet Dover to Calais, 26 miles, isn't.

Indeed! They should take out that strait. Give Ireland a chance and all, it's a sandbox game anyway. In my last game as Spain (full game), England got invaded ELEVEN times, the algorithms (it's not an AI people!), fuck up anyway...




Grtz
Nick

 

[CoolSquid]

It's not a bug, but an annoying feature. I mean, controlling both sides wouldn't make it any easier to bypass a hundred warships...

Just being awkward, but how come Stranraer to Larne, 49 miles, is a strait yet Dover to Calais, 26 miles, isn't. Note measured using decent harbours, some of the straits in this game are a little wide, especially if you didn't have naval control.

England would be completely fucked if France could just walk into Britain. While England is relatively strong at the start of the game, France tends to get more powerful allies, and has easy ways to expand quickly. By 1480 they would be able to eat England.

 

[Kansai-kun]

It's not a bug, but an annoying feature. I mean, controlling both sides wouldn't make it any easier to bypass a hundred warships...

England would be completely fucked if France could just walk into Britain. While England is relatively strong at the start of the game, France tends to get more powerful allies, and has easy ways to expand quickly. By 1480 they would be able to eat England.

Same reason why the the Strait of Gibraltar isn't a strait gameplay-wise, then.

 

[CoolSquid]

Same reason why the the Strait of Gibraltar isn't a strait gameplay-wise, then.

Basically. At least one of the Berber nations is normally allied to the Ottoblob, so there would be a certain chance of Spain being eaten.

 

[Kansai-kun]

Basically. At least one of the Berber nations is normally allied to the Ottoblob, so there would be a certain chance of Spain being eaten.

Or the Berber states being overrun by the Iberians even faster.

 

[ForzaA]

I mean, controlling both sides wouldn't make it any easier to bypass a hundred warships...

While there is no actual "ships shoot at land units" or "land units shoot at ships", blocking straits is an abstraction of the former, not being able to block a strait when the other side controls both shores is an abstraction of the latter.

 

[ChildeR]

Or the Berber states being overrun by the Iberians even faster.

Especially as with a strait it would no longer be distant overseas.

 

[delpiero1234]

Calling this change an abstraction seems wrong. The AI is just not very good with using its navy and this change has "improved" the performance of the AI as it no longer has to build a navy to protect its straits for as long as it holds both sides.

 

[Sunspawn]

Especially as with a strait it would no longer be distant overseas.

Actually, the Barbary coast not being distant overseas could make sense.

 

[CoolSquid]

While there is no actual "ships shoot at land units" or "land units shoot at ships", blocking straits is an abstraction of the former, not being able to block a strait when the other side controls both shores is an abstraction of the latter.

I would rather introduce some kinda mechanic where forts cause heavy damage to nearby ships (and stops them from blockading straits properly). Land units are generally not built for shooting at ships, whereas coastal forts normally get equipped with properly placed and designed cannons. This would also add a use for placing forts on islands (i.e Bornholm and Crete), and give them an actual gameplay value.

 

[ForzaA]

Calling this change an abstraction seems wrong. The AI is just not very good with using its navy and this change has "improved" the performance of the AI as it no longer has to build a navy to protect its straits for as long as it holds both sides.

That is the main gameplay reason for implementing, yes. Does not change the fact that it is an abstraction of what (to a degree) could/would happen IRL. Granted, not as accurate for the Irish strait as it is for some others.

I would rather introduce some kinda mechanic where forts cause heavy damage to nearby ships (and stops them from blockading straits properly). Land units are generally not built for shooting at ships, whereas coastal forts normally get equipped with properly placed and designed cannons. This would also add a use for placing forts on islands (i.e Bornholm and Crete), and give them an actual gameplay value.

And perhaps that will happen at some point; it's a fair bit more work than a quick check in "allowed movement" on whether "I" control both sides of a strait.

 

[grommile]

Actually, the Barbary coast not being distant overseas could make sense.

For Castile or Portugal, significant chunks of the coast are not distant overseas, due to the "distance from capital" rule.

 

[kviiri]

Distant overseas needs to be reworked anyway, it's a poor concept especially around continental borders.