Convoy AA massacres the Luftwaffe

  • We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

ltccone

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Feb 2, 2004
4.746
1.040
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
I hope fixing this is a priority for 1.5, as I had to quit a game because of it.

I was playing a game as Germany in Expert AI and I was doing well. You really don't want to invade the UK before the USSR in this mod, so I defeated the USSR first.

The was a Brit doomstack of 100 ships in the Channel so I thought I would try to whittle down the fleet with air power. LVL 3 radar covered the Channel

In 7 days I lost 134 CAS/NAV. In 14 days I lost 277. In one month I lost 588. In 6 weeks, 747. In three months I lost 1508. I didn't have one NAV left.

I'm not a masochist, but I wanted to keep going to see if this would change; it didn't.

Of those air losses I lost a total of SIXTY to bombing warships. All the rest were lost to convoy AA. Some of the convoys had 3 to 4 hundred convoy ships and would shoot down a score of planes at one time.

After wasting three months trying to control the Channel, the US joined the Allies.

I rage quit.
 

kauzer

Fearless General
73 Badges
Aug 13, 2009
437
195
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Season pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Premium edition
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Victoria 2
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • 500k Club
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
You will not invade UK if you dont pay proper attension to Kriegsmarines from the start. Luftwaffe just can not solo english channel and it is good. So it is your fault.
 

ltccone

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Feb 2, 2004
4.746
1.040
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
You will not invade UK if you dont pay proper attension to Kriegsmarines from the start. Luftwaffe just can not solo english channel and it is good. So it is your fault.
So it is 'my fault' that convoys shot down over 1400 planes in three months? The Axis controls all of Asia, Europe, and most of Africa in1941. I think we are doing OK.
 

Cpack

Field Marshal
39 Badges
Jan 16, 2003
3.014
721
  • Cities: Skylines Industries
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Semper Fi
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
You will not invade UK if you dont pay proper attension to Kriegsmarines from the start. Luftwaffe just can not solo english channel and it is good. So it is your fault.

But that doesn't explain why 1.400 planes where lost due to convoys.

If its due to warships or fighters, that would be ok if there were lack of fighter coverage over the channel......but convoys:confused:
 

ltccone

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Feb 2, 2004
4.746
1.040
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
But that doesn't explain why 1.400 planes where lost due to convoys.

If its due to warships or fighters, that would be ok if there were lack of fighter coverage over the channel......but convoys:confused:
Exactly. Many of the convoys were huge 300-400 ships. And I never sunk ONE convoy. I did manage to damage and sink warships.
 

grandad1982

Field Marshal
103 Badges
May 1, 2012
3.541
4.911
  • Sengoku
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • March of the Eagles
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Semper Fi
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • For the Motherland
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Victoria 2
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV
You will not invade UK if you dont pay proper attension to Kriegsmarines from the start. Luftwaffe just can not solo english channel and it is good. So it is your fault.
I think you missed the point.

As the UK I abused this by sending troop convoys back and forth through the red sea. It's not conquered Ethiopia so the axis tried to bomb those convoys but lost planes to no losses for me!
 

ltccone

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Feb 2, 2004
4.746
1.040
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
I think you missed the point.

As the UK I abused this by sending troop convoys back and forth through the red sea. It's not conquered Ethiopia so the axis tried to bomb those convoys but lost planes to no losses for me!
Wow. That's one way to shoot down enemy planes!
 

billcorr

Field Marshal
51 Badges
Feb 5, 2010
8.249
2.177
  • Cities in Motion
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Semper Fi
  • Rome Gold
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Divine Wind
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Knights of Honor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Pride of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Rome: Vae Victis
I think you missed the point.

As the UK I abused this by sending troop convoys back and forth through the red sea. It's not conquered Ethiopia so the axis tried to bomb those convoys but lost planes to no losses for me!

If it happened in a multiplayer game, I can hear your helpless opponents praising you for your imagination and creativity.

"Well done, Bob! Well played! "

...not.

:confused:
 

Axe99

Ships for Victory
125 Badges
Feb 13, 2003
15.758
12.340
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Lead and Gold
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Supreme Ruler 2020
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Pride of Nations
  • Rise of Prussia
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
I've never noticed convoy AA being near that dangerous - and I usually have some NAVs on anti-convoy duty in most games somewhere. That said, I haven't played vanilla in a little while now (since 1.4.2 was released), so I may have forgotten something.
 

ltccone

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Feb 2, 2004
4.746
1.040
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
I've never noticed convoy AA being near that dangerous - and I usually have some NAVs on anti-convoy duty in most games somewhere. That said, I haven't played vanilla in a little while now (since 1.4.2 was released), so I may have forgotten something.
The problem was that the UK convoys in the Channel were huge, numbering 3 to 4 hundred.
 

Axe99

Ships for Victory
125 Badges
Feb 13, 2003
15.758
12.340
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Lead and Gold
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Supreme Ruler 2020
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Pride of Nations
  • Rise of Prussia
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
The problem was that the UK convoys in the Channel were huge, numbering 3 to 4 hundred.

Aye, but my understanding was the AA mechanic was one plane vs one ship, so in theory, as I understand it (which could be way out), aircraft should still be overpowering convoys shouldn't it? Or do I need to brush up my understanding of air vs ships?
 

ltccone

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Feb 2, 2004
4.746
1.040
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron Anthology
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
Aye, but my understanding was the AA mechanic was one plane vs one ship, so in theory, as I understand it (which could be way out), aircraft should still be overpowering convoys shouldn't it? Or do I need to brush up my understanding of air vs ships?
I don't know. I do know those huge convoys were shooting down 20 planes at a clip, and while a lot of convoys were damaged, none were getting sunk.
 

Meglok

Grognard
32 Badges
Feb 29, 2012
7.462
3.765
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • 500k Club
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
Aye, but my understanding was the AA mechanic was one plane vs one ship, so in theory, as I understand it (which could be way out), aircraft should still be overpowering convoys shouldn't it? Or do I need to brush up my understanding of air vs ships?

There is a problem with something PDS did in 1.4 regarding convoys and naval air attacks. Naval air alone can not harm convoys and convoy aa for some reason now seems to be stacking or causing inordinate amounts of damage. You have to have some type of sea attack combined with the naval air attack to be effective.

The problem is that any naval air patrolling a sea zone alone will repeatedly attack any convoys transiting the sea zone and suffer aa casualties while only doing % damage without sinking any convoys or causing any disruption. You literally can not leave land based air patrolling any sea zone where an enemy convoy may be transiting unless you have ships there also or your bombers will be atrittioned to zero.

This screws both German, Japanese, and Italian strategies of using land based bombers to whittle down enemy fleets.
 

Secret Master

Covert Mastermind
Moderator
92 Badges
Jul 9, 2001
35.678
16.545
  • 200k Club
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Semper Fi
  • Sengoku
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • March of the Eagles
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Pride of Nations
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Limited Collectors Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Achtung Panzer
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Commander: Conquest of the Americas
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • A Game of Dwarves
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • King Arthur II
  • The Kings Crusade
Hmm. That's odd.

Make sure you post a bug report on it. I don't think convoys, even 400 ship convoys, should be able to do that to aircraft.
 

Secret Master

Covert Mastermind
Moderator
92 Badges
Jul 9, 2001
35.678
16.545
  • 200k Club
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Semper Fi
  • Sengoku
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • March of the Eagles
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Pride of Nations
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Limited Collectors Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Achtung Panzer
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Commander: Conquest of the Americas
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • A Game of Dwarves
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • King Arthur II
  • The Kings Crusade
Some of the convoys had 3 to 4 hundred convoy ships and would shoot down a score of planes at one time.

Wait, wait, wait.

Why are there that many convoys in the Channel? What is the AI doing in the Expert AI mod that would cause there to be 400 ship convoys in the area?
 

Axe99

Ships for Victory
125 Badges
Feb 13, 2003
15.758
12.340
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Lead and Gold
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Supreme Ruler 2020
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Pride of Nations
  • Rise of Prussia
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
As far as I recall convoys don't retain damage either so if the plants fail to kill them they are magically ok next time they are hit.

This is indeed an issue (sorry, I forgot it earlier) - so it could well be that a whole heap of convoys are getting badly damaged, and shooting down aircraft as well, but that the convoys auto-repair and the aircraft are gone. @lttcone - my bet is this is what is happening.

There is a problem with something PDS did in 1.4 regarding convoys and naval air attacks. Naval air alone can not harm convoys and convoy aa for some reason now seems to be stacking or causing inordinate amounts of damage. You have to have some type of sea attack combined with the naval air attack to be effective.

The problem is that any naval air patrolling a sea zone alone will repeatedly attack any convoys transiting the sea zone and suffer aa casualties while only doing % damage without sinking any convoys or causing any disruption. You literally can not leave land based air patrolling any sea zone where an enemy convoy may be transiting unless you have ships there also or your bombers will be atrittioned to zero.

This screws both German, Japanese, and Italian strategies of using land based bombers to whittle down enemy fleets.

I've definitely had naval air (NAVs) sink convoys post 1.4 in vanilla, but you do see far more instances of partially damaged convoys that auto-repair before their next battle. Random though - but perhaps whatever adjustments they did to naval air to balance it vs ships for long battles means they're no longer sinking as many convoys (and getting hammered in the meantime) in short ones?