Commercial Pact Efficiency and Criminal Syndicates

[A2ch0n]

The Corporate Government type now give a 20% Commercial pact efficiency and the Mercantile tradition tree agenda "open Markets" give 50%. Both of them never had criminal syndicates in mind. A CS can't form commercial pacts.

Now it could be argues that CS have the new 20% BO cost reduction but actually i don't see this for compensating those 20% Commercial pact efficiency from the gov type but a slight help for the regualy annoying loss of BO's.

CS still massively lack in power and this is another thing they're missing out. I suggested recently a Crime Syndicate BO rework (focusing on planet taxes instead of producing crime) that maybe would compensate for the missing Trade value (link in signature) but CS Power and mechanic are another point actually.

My main question at this point is, should there be a different bonus for commercial pact efficiency for Criminal Syndicates and if yes, what could it be?

 

[DeanTheDull]

I don't disagree with the general point, but the commercial pact efficiency as-is seems to suck. Rather than going from 10% trade value to 30% trade value from a commercial agreement, it's 10% to 12%.

A commercial pact with a 1000-trade empire- which is non-trivial for the AI- is giving you about 20 extra resources.

 

[Dementor4]

The Corporate Government type now give a 20% Commercial pact efficiency and the Mercantile tradition tree agenda "open Markets" give 50%. Both of them never had criminal syndicates in mind. A CS can't form commercial pacts.

Now it could be argues that CS have the new 20% BO cost reduction but actually i don't see this for compensating those 20% Commercial pact efficiency from the gov type but a slight help for the regualy annoying loss of BO's.

CS still massively lack in power and this is another thing they're missing out. I suggested recently a Crime Syndicate BO rework (focusing on planet taxes instead of producing crime) that maybe would compensate for the missing Trade value (link in signature) but CS Power and mechanic are another point actually.

My main question at this point is, should there be a different bonus for commercial pact efficiency for Criminal Syndicates and if yes, what could it be?

Probably boost the thing they trade commercial pacts for: more branch office value.

 

[HFY]

Might work better if Criminal Syndicates were "nice" to their allies (conquered vassals, released vassals, overlord, and Federation allies).

Let them have a Commercial Pact with those allies, and let their Branch Office buildings give the colony benefits with a Pact -- there is no crime once you're inside the Family, you support the Family through more direct methods.

 

[Dementor4]

Might work better if Criminal Syndicates were "nice" to their allies (conquered vassals, released vassals, overlord, and Federation allies).

Let them have a Commercial Pact with those allies, and let their Branch Office buildings give the colony benefits with a Pact -- there is no crime once you're inside the Family, you support the Family through more direct methods.

I'd much rather that allies of a syndicate have a stronger variant of the "crime lord agreement" decision for their worlds, one that staves off the worst aspects of crime (the events and resulting criminal jobs). Conceptually that feels much better than "going soft" and opening legit businesses instead of brothels and drug dens.

 

[A2ch0n]

I'd much rather that allies of a syndicate have a stronger variant of the "crime lord agreement" decision for their worlds, one that staves off the worst aspects of crime (the events and resulting criminal jobs). Conceptually that feels much better than "going soft" and opening legit businesses instead of brothels and drug dens.

Have a look at my crime BO rework suggestion. It's less annoying but keeps the fantasy.

 

[honigblute]

My main question at this point is, should there be a different bonus for commercial pact efficiency for Criminal Syndicates and if yes, what could it be?

There should have been a different bonus to begin with, because Syndicates can't have commercial pacts. I don't recall any civic ever changing the authority bonus, so it should be completely replaced imo. As it is now, megacorp authority empire effect gives Syndicates +50% empire size from planets and that's it. Doesn't seem right.

I'd much rather that allies of a syndicate have a stronger variant of the "crime lord agreement" decision for their worlds,

I totally agree with this. Make your allies actually benefit from crime instead of forcing them to fight against it.

Case in point: If you have the oppressive autocracy civic and a criminal branch office on your world, the stability reduction from criminal jobs gets removed.

The fact that nowhere in the game does it actually tell you that this one specific civic changes how criminals work if a criminal branch office is on your world is quite baffling.

 

[HFY]

I'd much rather that allies of a syndicate have a stronger variant of the "crime lord agreement" decision for their worlds, one that staves off the worst aspects of crime (the events and resulting criminal jobs). Conceptually that feels much better than "going soft" and opening legit businesses instead of brothels and drug dens.

Crime flavor with no crime mechanics?

Sure, that's fine with me, and it fits into my wish that the BO become beneficial to the colony.

 

[Twogs]

I don't disagree with the general point, but the commercial pact efficiency as-is seems to suck. Rather than going from 10% trade value to 30% trade value from a commercial agreement, it's 10% to 12%.

A commercial pact with a 1000-trade empire- which is non-trivial for the AI- is giving you about 20 extra resources.

It works both ways though and is a nice boon for your vassals (thats at least one thing I like to do with my vassals, giving them a boost with my trade)

 

[zZander56]

It is a little annoying, but I imagine the -20% cost on Branches was meant to compensate, which it does quite well. Though, other sources of Commercial Pact efficiency Syndicates are likely to see are a little feel-bad to get, but it's not a huge deal.

 

[Harvey_James]

i think the best thing for criminal heritage civic is too convert it to its own government type move it away from megacorp mechanics as they dont really synergise that well especially with how hit and miss it is and how commercial pacts just give it dead bonuses.. something more crime blackmarket related could be much more interesting as in real life you have legal markets then the black markets too.. have them be the black market runners maybe push stealth bonus and espionage with them more.. ofc espionage needs some work maybe give them a more crime/shady version of it.. there is much more too explore i feel.

wasting 1 civic slot and all commercial pact bonuses/agendas are useless also.. kinda feeels like it doesnt make sense too keep as megacorp specific anymore..
they could also fix the bugs CS has whilst they do this..

 

[Dementor4]

I'd love it if more governments interacted with crime in interesting ways. Authoritarian states that use crime as a boogeyman to keep the fearful citizens compliant, convict-based slavery that turns criminals into useful labor, a "pirate haven" civic where crime generates fleet cap, that sort of thing. So there would be a number of different empires who could work happily with a syndicate, grateful for the crime generation for different reasons.