Coalition option lackluster?

[KaiserJohanHome]

Greatly enjoying the game, one big issue though..

Playing Austria and everything went well and in 1505 france formed a major coalition against me, and in turn I joined the major coalition against france. In the coalition against france, there were some 10 states, the two big being me and spain. Then spain declared war and hell broke loose. France was easily crushed (35k vs our 90k of which I had 75k), I occupied pretty much whole of france, but spain DoWd and was thus the coalition leader and only the coalition leader can dictate the peace terms, even though they only captured a province or two. Come the peace talks and guess what, I gained absolutely nothing, being the only coalition member who actually accomplished anything by taking almost all of france myself. I was even in alliance and royal marriage with max opinion with spain...

Two glaring issues with what would otherwise be an awesome addition to EU:

1. For some reason there is seems to be no option to change/contest coalition leader status. The war contribution should either decide the leader or the leader MUST give out proportionally.
2. There is no way to ask another state to join a coalition against another state

I think an awesome change would be so that the coalition leader must give out in proportion to what the coalition members accomplished in terms of war points.

 

[theshrub]

Did you have the option for the AI to give/take your territory in negotiations turned off? I know I turned it off when I played as Portugal, and I think it stays off even when you load up a different country unless you turn it back on.

 

[Sugary]

Did you have the option for the AI to give/take your territory in negotiations turned off? I know I turned it off when I played as Portugal, and I think it stays off even when you load up a different country unless you turn it back on.

This. I think it's really annoying and frustrating, i hope they just add that option in the main game where it's more visable

 

[Decimal]

My understanding of coalition wars is that they don't have modifiers for taking cores/claims, they are the "show superiority" CB, so the AI will probably not want to give you anything even if you have give/take checked off.

If you are a nation that can take the stab hit, you could always break truce right after the coalition war is finished and re-siege everything

 

[Korashy]

They should make it similar to how Crusades work in CK2, where you have separate war scores for every participant, which then add up to a collective war score. High score at the end gets the spoils (dictate the peace terms).

 

[lucaluca]

how do coalitions work anyways? I can create a coalition against a nation but I can't ask others to join it... how do I know if others have joined or not? and I do I join an existing coalition?

 

[Korashy]

They join when they feel threatened by that nation. Basically when they have a terrible relationship with them. Threat can be pretty deceiving tho. For example Bohemia starts the demo in a PU with Hungary, when they inherit, they technically didn't do anything bad, have no overextension etc, and therefore aren't seen by the AI as the same threat as a human who suddenly sees superhemia.

 

[unmerged(584823)]

how do coalitions work anyways? I can create a coalition against a nation but I can't ask others to join it... how do I know if others have joined or not? and I do I join an existing coalition?

To join an existing coalition, this one must exist, you can see it in the diplomacy screen, instead of a "create coalition" button, you have a "join coalition" button. And, AFAIK, you can't ask people to join a coalition, but, if they have bad relations with the target which suffer from agresssive expansion malus and is a threat to a AI country, they will join.

edit: half ninja'd

 

[underlordgc]

They should make it similar to how Crusades work in CK2, where you have separate war scores for every participant, which then add up to a collective war score. High score at the end gets the spoils (dictate the peace terms).

I was extremely surprised that this wasn't the case when I first started. Another problem is I had a coalition against me but I had a truce with some of the newer members so when the coalition fought some of the members were left out. I won the war then immediately attacked Ragusa whose peace treaty had run out and was part of the coalition. Hungry then joined the war due to the coalition but the tiny OPM was the war leader. I was able to quickly siege their province and annex them while completely avoiding the Hungarian menace.

 

[lucaluca]

but if i start a coalition against a nation, how do I know who else has joined? Or if I join one, how do I know who is in it? It's differerent if I am in a calotion with say Brittany or Austria against France, I would not want to join the first one but I'd likely join the second one

 

[unmerged(584823)]

but if i start a coalition against a nation, how do I know who else has joined? Or if I join one, how do I know who is in it? It's differerent if I am in a calotion with say Brittany or Austria against France, I would not want to join the first one but I'd likely join the second one

To know who is in a coalition against a country, you go on the diplomacy screen of this country and watch, on the left side of it, an icon which shows who (all the countries) is targetting it with a coalition.

 

[Korashy]

Click any country and then go into the diplo menu and on the left where you see their alliances and such you will see if they are being targeted by a coalition and from whom.

 

[lucaluca]

To know who is in a coalition against a country, you go on the diplomacy screen of this country and watch, on the left side of it, an icon which shows who (all the countries) is targetting it with a coalition.

wow did not notice it thanks

 

[Hive]

They should make it similar to how Crusades work in CK2, where you have separate war scores for every participant, which then add up to a collective war score. High score at the end gets the spoils (dictate the peace terms).

This sounds like an awesome feature, I hope they'll tweak it into EUIV.

 

[Heatth]

I think Victoria II have the best system for dealing with this sort of stuff. There, only the war leader can broke the peace deal, however, anyone who contribute in the war can set a war goal to claim their own gains in the war. Overall the AI is very nice at enforcing the players goals, so there you can reasonably expect to gain something from a way even when you are not the leader. The same can't be said here, where you must depend on the whims of the AI.

Of course, EUIV doesn't use Vic's War Goal system, so this couldn't be replicated exactly. However, I though in a way to mimicry it somehow: At any point during a war, the junior members can open the peace deal window and set the goals they want at the end. The can only set goals they would otherwise be able to enforce (so, one can only claim a province if they occupy it) and the warscore of the goal must be within the member personal warscore. During the actual peace deal, the war leader can them chose the options the other members "proposed". Neither the player nor the AI is forced to, but failing to do so would mean a relationship. Also, the one to pay for any eventual "aggressive expansion" would be the member who proposed the goal, not the war leader.

I think this is a good way to deal with this stuff. No more frustration with the AI giving you nothing when you won the war all by yourself. On the other hand, the player would have an incentive to give stuff to their allies in a way as well, as not doing so may means opinion penalties.

 

[jockedahl]

I too find that the AI in this game never seem to give you anything in the peace deal.

This is not mimicking what human players do. I'm sure I'm not alone in giving my allies stuff out from the peacedeal because of the roleplaying factor or simply because that the Warscore far exceeds the territory and money I wanted.

 

[BoleslavLev]

Yeah, you just have to do it yourself. Also, I hate that giving and taking away provinces by AI is solved by one single box. That is ridiculous. AI can take away YOUR provinces if you have that ticked and you can´t get YOUR (again) provinces (occupied) if it´s not ticked? WTF is that prank. I thought we have Comet sighted for this. I welcome the fact you can give something to the second or even third party, great addition to the game, but this two-way double crossed feature in which you loose every time is just dreadful. In EU3, AI usually didn´t give you anything too, but at least it can´t give away your provinces which weren´t occupied to someone who even wasn´t at war. If they were occupied, fine - give them to anybody, but not when they are not and I am winning the war.

 

[Haresus]

Spain declared the war, they get to decide in the war negotiations, they are the coalition leader during that war. By joining the coalition you just agreed to help fuck over France whenever possible, without any direct reward being guaranteed for yourself unless you are the one directly attacked or directly attacking. If you had cores/claims on France, it might have been possible that Spain would give you something, but I am not sure of the situation.

Did you have claims/cores on France?

 

[KaiserJohanHome]

I did have one core in France and also one claim.

It dosn't make sense though, I mean a tiny little state can go all opportunist-like and just join a coalition, go to war and let the big guys do the fighting and then alone take all the loot and spoils. Why on earth the wargoals as was in Vic2 isn't present for coalitions I have no idea.