CK3 Summer Teaser #1

[Kadmus]

i just want the dlc to come out ;-;

 

[Kadmus]

Poor Estonians have a trait that not only seems pretty bad, it also increases the cost of changing away from the tradition... maybe tweak that one a bit?

agreed i think staunch traditionalist needs a little tweaking

 

[Kiffe]

I think given what we know about the culture system so far it will work out fine. I don't mind if there are some exclusively negative or very powerful traditions, if those better represent society as it was, and are adequately restricted to their cultures. Some overpowered combinations are bound to appear but only map painters will see them come to be.

Also I don't get why people are worried about blobbing. Is not like the AI is going to do it any time soon. Sure by the sword would be a fucking disaster if somehow greek culture got a hold of it but if you don't want that to happen just don't do it yourself and i guarantee you AI is not intelligent enough to pull it off. In fact we might finally see the AI declare a holy war for a kingdom target for once, since i've yet to see it happen in hundreds of hours. Stalwart Defenders seems powerful but is anyone worried Croatians will take over the world? If anything it may lead to themnot being annexed by the byzantines that fast, though i doubt it.

 

[Tiax]

Everyone's talking about By the Sword's unlimited Kingdom holy wars, but the second effect makes it so that you can declare duchy holy wars without needing any devotion. The flavor text says, "motives are scrutinized so as to make sure the divine powers would approve" - but the effect is that you can be at negative piety and zero devotion and use "holy" wars to conquer duchies. Doesn't really seem like the effect matches the flavor to me.

 

[wilcoxchar]

You see, I *want* to conquer the world. I just want it to be harder. I want it to offer me an actual challenge.

Then since you've apparently mastered the minmax way of playing the game, might I suggest taking a note from other RPGs and adding some house rules to make things more of a challenge. Perhaps, off the top of my head, only having gavelkind succession or only using levies.

 

[fodazd]

Then since you've apparently mastered the minmax way of playing the game, might I suggest taking a note from other RPGs and adding some house rules to make things more of a challenge. Perhaps, off the top of my head, only having gavelkind succession or only using levies.

Sure, I can try to make the game harder for my myself, either through house rules or through mods.

I am still going to participate in discussions about which strategies (or in this case traditions) are strong or weak though. And when I do, I will mostly assume base game rules.

 

[Zhetone]

Then since you've apparently mastered the minmax way of playing the game, might I suggest taking a note from other RPGs and adding some house rules to make things more of a challenge. Perhaps, off the top of my head, only having gavelkind succession or only using levies.

Yes, the classic excuse for any unbalanced game mechanic I see on these forums - just handicap yourself. No longer can we criticize game design that we don't like, the onus is on the player to balance the game alone.

Beyond the OP nature of the free kingdom holy wars it also may make balancing of traditions out of whack because people will just prioritize this one tradition, and it means certain cultures will undoubtedly be superior to others by virtue of having it. That is bad balance and it shows that this needs work. Just compare By the Sword to Isolationist - why would you ever want the latter? Why would you not want the former?

 

[Agnate7]

In terms of cheating the mechanics, I'm worried about Renown farming with Mystical Ancestors. If I'm not actively declaring Holy Wars or planning on reforming a faith, Piety is usually worthless. Seems very simple to grant your cowardly cousin a county for Renown, revoke the title, and repeat. The cost of revoking a title from a house member should be at least equivalent to the benefit of granting the title.

 

[Jon the Wizard]

What is this, Soviet traditions?

Ha ha ha, funny. We all know Soviet development growth was nonexistent.

 

[wilcoxchar]

Yes, the classic excuse for any unbalanced game mechanic I see on these forums - just handicap yourself. No longer can we criticize game design that we don't like, the onus is on the player to balance the game alone.

Beyond the OP nature of the free kingdom holy wars it also may make balancing of traditions out of whack because people will just prioritize this one tradition, and it means certain cultures will undoubtedly be superior to others by virtue of having it. That is bad balance and it shows that this needs work. Just compare By the Sword to Isolationist - why would you ever want the latter? Why would you not want the former?

Discussing balancing the game is perfectly fine. Pretending that the game is being or should be balanced solely for map painters, and not for role players or any other playstyle of the game is not. A lot of map painters here want the game to be designed for them and them only, when from its outset the Crusader Kings franchise has been explicitly designed to not have map painting front and center, and to have role playing, which yes requires some actual investment on the part of the player, as its focus. Which is refreshing to see in a game for once.

 

[Zhetone]

Discussing balancing the game is perfectly fine. Pretending that the game is being or should be balanced solely for map painters, and not for role players or any other playstyle of the game is not. A lot of map painters here want the game to be designed for them and them only, when from its outset the Crusader Kings franchise has been explicitly designed to not have map painting front and center, and to have role playing, which yes requires some actual investment on the part of the player, as its focus. Which is refreshing to see in a game for once.

how does by the sword make sense for roleplaying either? what "culture" fought a bunch of wars taking massive swathes of land for religious purposes, all for themselves?
if scanians have it, I would assume this is meant to represent the baltic crusades, which conquered exactly one "kingdom" for the swedes, Finland. except it was not held by a hegemon, but rather disparate tribes, meaning that a buff to taking whole kingdoms makes absolutely no sense

 

[Kristjan108]

what "culture" fought a bunch of wars taking massive swathes of land for religious purposes, all for themselves?

The Franks? The Arabs? The Iberians?

 

[Zhetone]

The Franks? The Arabs? The Iberians?

in the ck timeline? I think you'll find that none of them did

 

[wilcoxchar]

how does by the sword make sense for roleplaying either? what "culture" fought a bunch of wars taking massive swathes of land for religious purposes, all for themselves?
if scanians have it, I would assume this is meant to represent the baltic crusades, which conquered exactly one "kingdom" for the swedes, Finland. except it was not held by a hegemon, but rather disparate tribes, meaning that a buff to taking whole kingdoms makes absolutely no sense

Gee, I wonder what cultures in Crusader Kings would fit the description: "Members of this culture believe the best missionary is one carrying a sword. While support for holy wars are widespread, motives are scrutinized to make sure the Divine powers would approve."

Not speaking of all of the ones that would fit this, but just an example.

 

[Kristjan108]

in the ck timeline? I think you'll find that none of them did

The Iberians did all the way throughout the timeline, The Franks had theirs in the CK2 timeline 60 years before the CK3 timeline starts and the early islamic arab conquests ended 100 years before the CK3 timeline.

 

[Zhetone]

Gee, I wonder what cultures in Crusader Kings would fit the description: "Members of this culture believe the best missionary is one carrying a sword. While support for holy wars are widespread, motives are scrutinized to make sure the Divine powers would approve."

Not speaking of all of the ones that would fit this, but just an example.

yeah, the crusaders definitely, as a united culture, conquered several kingdoms in a lifetime. that totally happened, I'm sure you can show me where on a map and which culture it was.

 

[MichelsBR]

Oh fun concept! Will there be culture-group specific traditions like there are innovations?

nop, will be like religion traits

 

[Dayvit78]

I really like the downsides. Not every culture should be buffed. Some cultures should be a bit ... difficult.

 

[DreadLindwyrm]

nop, will be like religion traits

It's *possible* we'll get some that are tied to a particular cultural pillar.

And as a parallel to the religion traits we have some tenets that are only available to limited numbers of religions, so it'd be entirely reasonable.

 

[wilcoxchar]

nop, will be like religion traits

They did say some traditions would be limited by heritage.