CK3 Dev Diary #33 - An Offer You Can’t Refuse

[mpsdevil]

Sorry if this has been answered and I missed it, but is the swear fealty option still in the game, and how does this work with these contracts?

For example, say I the player am a duke bordering a relatively small kingdom, and am worried that my armies aren't enough to defend against nearby threats, so decide to willingly become a vassal of the neighboring king, could I negotiate a better contract for me from the beginning seeing as the king is getting me as a vassal effectively for free? Or would I be forced to accept the default contract and then slowly modify it?

Just thought it would make more sense to start with a unique contract when swearing fealty, for example if the new vassal was of a different religion they would only agree to vassalage on the condition their religious rights are guaranteed as a part of their contract.

 

[Mindel]

These contracts look interesting and all, but here is the big question:

Will the King of England have one of these contracts with the King of France?

 

[Videogames]

I really like this system, but it also raises all sorts of edge case questions.

One that I haven't seen brought up yet in the thread: let's say I have a vassal with Religious Protection in his contract, and I want to get rid of him. Can I just impose a "fair" modification that gets rid of the Religious Protection in exchange for lower taxes, and then immediately afterwards revoke his title for being the wrong religion? I'm a bit worried that, if this is possible, Religious Protection will be sort of an empty promise.

 

[Mindel]

Wouldn't it make more sense to have feudal contracts tied to titles rather than people? This would offer much greater technical flexibility, simply because people can occupy many titles, but titles are never held by more than one person at a time.

For instance, then the King of England could have a contract with the King of France as Duke of Aquitaine without having to jury-rig some special mechanics to make this happen.

 

[Veldmaarschalk]

I like the pets, and so does one of my pets.

Spoiler

 

[gekj]

are vassal levies actually taken from the vassal pool ? or are created from the void like CK2 ?

meaning you can lower the power of a vassal by increasing the levies vassal contract.

 

[Darrigan]

Some vassals start with contracts different to the default, in the Holy Roman Empire all vassals start with low taxes and levies to represent the internal state and the lower amount of control the Emperor was exerting over their vassals at the time.

I hope this is not only for the Holy Roman Empire but for all post-Carolingian lands. Matter in fact, in 1066 the French king had less influence in his realm than the emperor in his. HRE in 1066 is not the same as the HRE in 1600

 

[ArVass]

As special naming for vassals of special contracts types does not exist, can modders add them (so a vassal with Palatinate-type contract will be called a Palatine or Pfalzgraf/Palsgrave, etc.) in a way or an other?

So I guess you can't make mods for that?
I can imagine that, judging from CK2 where localisation had some limitations, but would still be neat

 

[Willem IV]

Wouldn't it make more sense to have feudal contracts tied to titles rather than people? This would offer much greater technical flexibility, simply because people can occupy many titles, but titles are never held by more than one person at a time.

[whisper]Prince of Andorra, City of Maastricht (1204-1795)[/whisper]
But I completely agree with you, you should tie them to titles

 

[Alblaka]

Kudos to listening to community feedback, and redesigning the Feudal Contract system to actually be more nuanced. Much appreciated, and I'm looking forward to see how it will further develope over time / mods, now that it is this modular.

 

[DreadLindwyrm]

Below that we have what we call the “Fine Print” options. These fine options are unlocked via various innovations and provide various modifications to the contract.
The first row being the Special Contract options of Scutage, March, and Palatinate which are available for vassals that are Dukes or Kings.

View attachment 595181
[Effects of scutage]

I foresee vassals under scutage being given relatively high tax obligations and zero levy obligations.

View attachment 595182
[Effects of march]

And conversely marches being given zero tax obligation and high levy obligations.

At the bottom we have the rest of the Fine Print options available, these are things like guaranteeing your vassal a spot on the council or granting them coinage rights. Some options are only shown if the vassal meets specific conditions, for example if the vassal is of a different faith to the liege. In such a case the “Religious Protection” gives them special rights to practice their faith without risk of the liege demanding their conversion or converting the faith of their provinces.

And various Insular nobles being given religious protection by Catholic overlords (or vice versa) for a free "positive" to their contract. Similarly for any other mutual "righteous" faiths such as the gnostic ones.

 

[Ridixo]

Blackmailing people is surprisingly effective.

Surely that is why in the pets photos its a plant. Some one used a hook on you to force you to post that photo. I mean it's the only way since plants are neither animals nor pets

 

[seymouruk]

I really like this system, but it also raises all sorts of edge case questions.

One that I haven't seen brought up yet in the thread: let's say I have a vassal with Religious Protection in his contract, and I want to get rid of him. Can I just impose a "fair" modification that gets rid of the Religious Protection in exchange for lower taxes, and then immediately afterwards revoke his title for being the wrong religion? I'm a bit worried that, if this is possible, Religious Protection will be sort of an empty promise.

I would imagine that the removal of his religious protection would either be classed as a tyrannical act regardless of what you offered or would be heavily weighted so that just by lowering their tax obligations wouldn't outweigh it. Such that you would have to offer more in concessions to remove it 'fairly'. To stop gaming the system you could add a clause that re-negotiated contracts cannot be revoked within a set period. New characters shouldn't suffer that cooldown so if your liege character dies there should be nothing to stop his heir, your new character, from re-negotiating or revoking. Maybe however an heir re-negotiating a feudal contract of someone who has just had a re-negotiation could incur tyranny or more of an opinion hit.

 

[Masternachos]

Surely that is why in the pets photos its a plant. Some one used a hook on you to force you to post that photo. I mean it's the only way since plants are neither animals nor pets

ANYTHING can be a pet if you love it enough.

 

[Ridixo]

ANYTHING can be a pet if you love it enough.

I would rather prefer a rock than a plant as a pet
But it's about how much you love something, its about how much it loves you back

 

[TL_]

Very interesting, but the #1 thing I want to know is this:

When you offer to diplo-annex someone, do you send a contract with your offer? For example, is it possible I could convince someone of a different faith but same culture + dejure liege to accept peaceful annexation if their feudal contract will guarantee them religious protection?

 

[Pjotr2k97]

Am I the only one thinking that Vic2 like system for peace deals would be perfect for CK3? I can see here like you start some less taxes rebellion and after some time it transforms into overthrow ruler, because it goes nicely. In ck2 it was really strange that you have everything or nothing, or nothing but different

 

[Revshawn]

I used that same parchment background that you guys are using to write letters to my boss and coworkers about important tasks. Big ol cursive writing font. Written like a letter from the front lines of early 1800's warfare complete with references about squirrel oil and possum scrum. They loved it. But then when I used the same parchment to resign from my job because I got a better one, all of the sudden I received a complaint from one of the higher ups I never met before that it was somehow 'unprofessional' and that they'd be noting it in my 'official record.' XD!

Love the hard work Paradox. Keep it up!

 

[Nc-Rm]

How do hooks work on players in MP though? Does it auto-accept the deal for them?

 

[Revshawn]

How do hooks work on players in MP though? Does it auto-accept the deal for them?

It doesn't autoaccept, but if you do not do what the hook tells you to do that you will receive a general negative opinion from everyone that is relative to the strength of the hook they have upon you. A fabricated lie is of course going to be a lot less harmful than the revelation that you have been pounding your sister and the heir to the Kingdom everyone thought was from your wife is actually the inbred spawn of Satan.