CK3 Dev Diary #17 - Governments, Vassal Management, Laws, and Raiding

CK3 Dev Diary #17 - Governments, Vassal Management, Laws, and Raiding

  • Pre order now!

    Paradox Development Studio brings you the sequel to one of the most popular strategy games ever made! Crusader Kings III is soon upon us and you can pre order it today!


    Releasing September 1st 2020

Denkt

Field Marshal
May 28, 2010
15.701
6.025
27
They still have where birth order will determine who is the primary heir, but they no longer have single recipient inheritance as even high partition will lose you 50% of your titles if you have more than one child of the inheriting gender.
I'm pretty sure they did not say who will be the primary heir.

High Partition is basically still Gavelkind, but the primary heir gets to keep a larger chunk, and gets this regardless of how many children.
The difference is the primary heir get atleast half the titles vs probably an rather equal split of titles between the heirs.
 

starkwolf

Second Lieutenant
Jan 13, 2019
165
14
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • King Arthur II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Sengoku
  • Crusader Kings II
They still have where birth order will determine who is the primary heir, but they no longer have single recipient inheritance as even high partition will lose you 50% of your titles if you have more than one child of the inheriting gender.
That's not how I understood it, but it was ambiguous. Some dev clarity here would be appreciated how that was meant to be understood!
 

blackninja9939

Programmer
Aug 28, 2013
2.239
2.054
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • BATTLETECH
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Prison Architect
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
They still have where birth order will determine who is the primary heir, but they no longer have single recipient inheritance as even high partition will lose you 50% of your titles if you have more than one child of the inheriting gender.



High Partition is basically still Gavelkind, but the primary heir gets to keep a larger chunk, and gets this regardless of how many children.
We still have single recipient inheritance, its in the bit quoted you responded to, the Oldest Child Succession where it all goes to the single heir, its even listed in the screenshot as one of the single heir succession types.
 

zbyrne

Major
Jul 19, 2013
592
837
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2
I agree. It is very unfortunate that the system looks to be very "flat" and every basic - as in only have 3 basic tiers of soldiers/tax. As you said, it would've been very exciting to see an in-depth system where different vassals could have special contracts. It would largely depend on various aspects - like are your dukedom bordering the king - maybe you might not have much autonomy then. Or maybe you are far away and the king might have a hard time actually doing anything about you disobeying the contract. Maybe you offer your realm as a vassal if you get a really good vassal contract.

Not to mention, vassals often relied on good relationships with the ruler. If I get a really good contract then I'm much more inclined to help my ruler out when other nobles try to depose him. Why? Because if a new ruler ascends then he might want to remove my nice contract. In this way I have some vested interests in the preserving the ruling monarch. Alas, it seems we'll be stuck with a really basic and shallow system.
Yes I agree - the geography of where you are should feature of course (which would also help blobbing - even if it was a large Empire, there would be limited central authority)!

My biggest issue here, besides the general lack of imagination, is I don't want this to be a box you tick and now I give more money/men. The contract should encourage the vassal to behave in a certain way, motivated by vested interests as you say, but not railroad them into a way of playing. This is the only way to make playing as a vassal fun.

If my contract says I should do this (give X amount in tax for example), but I have to actively decide to do so. If I refuse to do whatever it is I'm supposed to do, either through open rebellion, or just through non-compliance, it weakens the liege, and could give you some influence if you are powerful. Likewise, if you have a good deal already, you would be loyal and play ball. I want CK3 to have the strange medieval concept of 'lord shows up to join his liege in battle but doesn't join in until he thinks he'll be on the winning side'.

contracts should tell you what you can or cannot do, and you have to decide is it strategic if i comply. Would make vassals more fun to play, and lieges harder - unless you don't want to enforce compliance!
 
Mar 18, 2020
14
35
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
Wanted to throw my two cents in, even though I'm late:

Every feudal vassal (except barons) has an individual contract with you,
A fantastic change! Definitely increases the feel of being a feudal lord with personal fealty being paramount. And I love that a small, centralized realm with high obligation will be able to punch well above its weight against a larger federated opponent.

These contracts have three levels; Low, Medium, and High, with Medium being the default.
I am going to echo some of the other sentiments on this thread to say this seems a little overly simplistic. In an ideal world would love to see a full suite of rights and privileges you could negotiate with your vassals (imprisonment, revocation, even things like trading lowering the obligations of a powerful but incompetent vassal to make them content without a council seat), but I think even something just slightly more complex than a three-tier system would be fine.

You could simply split taxes and levies to make each individually negotiable, but I think an even better system is to keep the three-tier obligation but have a slider of how much of their obligation is paid in levies vs. gold. So a vassal with middle-level obligation would owe, say, 10% of his income or levies. You can choose to have him pay 5% in gold and 5% in levies, or 7% in gold 3% in levies, etc. So you might be making more money during peacetime, but if an unexpected war crops up - you're going to need to start asking for more troops and less gold from your vassals with high- and middle-level obligations. Maybe there's a limit on how often you can change the percentage of each to limit min/maxing.

Obligations are heavily based on opinion rather than being contractual, with happy vassals providing significantly more taxes and levies than unhappy ones. A happy family is a powerful family.
I really like the feel of this - how much can you play your family off against each other while keeping them happy with you?

Tribal rulers base their obligations on levels of Fame rather than on contracts or opinion; the more famous your ruler is, the more troops and money your vassals will be willing to provide for your pursuits.
I don't use tribal much in CK2, but this seems like it will create a fun and realistic dynamic where if you lead a successful raid, more people will show up to go on your next one, and so on.

To get an easy overview of your realm, we in CK3 have the Realm screen. Let’s start with the Vassals tab of this screen where all your vassals are shown. This gives you a clear overview of where your levies and taxes come from, who might be a threat to you, and allows you to renegotiate feudal contracts.
Then we have the Domain tab. This lets you easily inspect your domain, showing where you’re earning money and levies, and where you can build more buildings. It also shows the level of development and control in the counties you personally hold, letting you easily tell where you can make improvements.
Here you can change your succession laws, see your heir(s), and check what titles, if any, you will lose when you die. If you hold any elective titles, you’ll be able to easily get to the election screen from here.
The UI improvements are huge. I see some people complaining about it being "dumbed down" and I could not disagree more - everything is so much clearer and more aesthetic. The information on these three tabs is spread across probably five different places in CK2 and is much harder to parse at a glance than what's being shown here.

I do have to say, I'm not a huge fan of the portraits here, they all look very similar and also like their eyes are closed. I'm guessing these aren't fully rendered, but I do have to say I hope the overall portrait color scheme is a little more vibrant.

Gavelkind is making a return, though we’ve renamed it to Partition to make it more obvious what it actually means.
Oldest Child Succession (replacing Primogeniture), Youngest Child Succession (replacing Ultimogeniture)
My take on the great renaming controversy: all of the simplifications are good (including demense to domain and getting rid of agnatic/cognatic) except primogeniture. Primogeniture is the normal, standard word for first-born succession, and if anyone really is confused a simple tooltip can explain.

For added fun, there’s now three variants of Partition.
This is really, really good. I think the stratification of Partition succession will create a really fun dynamic of trying to move higher up the chain, as I'm assuming it will be harder to implement high partition vs. standard partition, with primogeniture usually being the final goal.

We’ve also done a lot of tweaks to the internal logic of who gets what titles, which tends to lead to far nicer splits than in CK2
While I'm glad to see this, what I really want is a system where you get to choose who gets what titles, within the bounds of your succession system. For example, let's say you are a king with four heirs, two ducal titles and six counties in your domain, and High Partition succession. You pick which of your heirs is your primary one, they gets the royal title, as well as a ducal title and three counties that you choose. The other ducal title and one county goes to another son, and your two other sons get one county each.

Imagine the drama that creates (and did create in real life) as you are literally telling how much you think each of your heirs is "worth" in a medieval sense. This would really play into the roleplaying element you're going for in CK3 - and it could create long-lasting ramifications for your primary heir (aka you in three hours of playtime) as your embittered first-born son plots revenge against the younger, more talented heir he was passed over in favor of.

We also have a number of variants on elective succession, ranging from Feudal Elective, to Princely Elective (HRE succession), and a handful of cultural variants.
Going to echo some of the disappointment that others are expressing around not having a specific system for the ERE at launch. I'm happy to see you're planning to get to it at some point (and my vote is, the sooner the better!) though I hope that one of those "cultural variants" of elective is for them to start with at least. I know that they played by wildly different rules with regards to land rights and fealty than most of Europe, so I get why it had to be pushed down on the priority list, but they were massively important in the titular Crusades and had an incredible amount of personal drama being played out on a national or international scale, which basically means they are perfect for CK if the mechanics can be done correctly. They could be an incredibly popular and fun playground for players looking for a change from French-style feudalism while keeping the roleplaying and political machinations that make CK so great. You've said that you'll get it right when you get there - I'm taking you at your word on that.

Once at your target your army will start looting the barony they’re in. This is a pretty quick process, but during it your army will be unable to move, preventing you from running away from any counter-raiding force.
Another significant change is that if you beat a raid army, you receive all the gold they’re carrying.
As someone who doesn't do a lot of raiding myself but loves playing in the British Isles, these are both enhancements I absolutely love.
 

Andrzej I

Ætheling
Nov 27, 2004
2.037
132
31
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Warlock 2: The Exiled
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Pride of Nations
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Magicka
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Sengoku
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
You know, I don't think it was ever answered, but I'm curious about this: what form of government will (the majority of) India have on release? Feudal? Clan? I'd be a bit surprised to see most of it as Tribal, but maybe?
 

Eric The Red 33

Reactionary Revolutionary
Dec 28, 2010
1.001
79
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Magicka 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Magicka 2: Ice, Death and Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Victoria 2
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Rome Gold
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Supreme Ruler 2020
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • For the Motherland
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
We still have single recipient inheritance, its in the bit quoted you responded to, the Oldest Child Succession where it all goes to the single heir, its even listed in the screenshot as one of the single heir succession types.
Thanks for the clarification. I mistakenly thought you would have to pick one from each row (one for who is primary heir, the other for how land is divided). So you could end up with primogeniture gavelkind or ultimogeniture gavelkind for instance. Glad to have the confusion cleared up though.
 

Pied-Noir

a leader in the field of shallow thought
Sep 6, 2011
1.304
34
  • For The Glory
  • Prison Architect
  • Victoria 2
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Sengoku
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Divine Wind
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • March of the Eagles
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
Will you guys consider introducing a better more accurate representation of complex feudal relations? For example English holdings in France still being vassals of the French crown?
No (won't be in).
 

DassiD

Private
Jun 26, 2011
24
0
  • Divine Wind
  • Sengoku
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Cities in Motion
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife Pre-Order
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Rome Gold
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
@Meneth As a fellow norseman I feel you should be aware that "Oslosyslar" in the age of pagan Norway is highly anachronistic. Firstly Oslo is thought to be (re)founded by Hardrada in the late 1060s, before that it was merely a village. Secondly the unit "Oslosyslar" didn't appear before the late 1100s and didn't have that name, but Oslóarsýsla.

I know this is probably a bit nit-picky, but it will bother people like me and historical accuracy is usually a good thing.
 

Guthix

Major
Oct 18, 2016
631
5
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife Pre-Order
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
Are feudal and clan governments inherently tied to religion like in ck2? Like, can a Catholic tribal Ireland, for instance, turn into a clan-based governmant upon government reformation?

I didn't see any mod poata about this and I'm really hoping I can get an answer!
 

Aquamancer

Second Lieutenant
May 7, 2018
175
81
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Crusader Kings II
Are feudal and clan governments inherently tied to religion like in ck2? Like, can a Catholic tribal Ireland, for instance, turn into a clan-based governmant upon government reformation?

I didn't see any mod poata about this and I'm really hoping I can get an answer!
I think they are not, considering that Scotland was mentioned as an example of a European nation that will use the clan government.
 

Jargoduk

Recruit
Aug 10, 2016
4
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Victoria 2
  • Prison Architect
  • War of the Roses
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Magicka 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
Please do not add mana into this game. It already ruined imperator on release. A mana system does not equal fun. Monarchy points, mana, whatever. This system doesn't look like it's going to work well with the ERE succession system either. I do not suppose they will be available on release either.
Mana is an excuse for bad game design.
 

vandevere

From the Great State of Denial
Jun 13, 2013
2.351
947
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury

Winterwolf00

Captain
May 4, 2012
335
345
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Victoria 2
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • King Arthur II
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
There really is no reason to give only pagans and tribals the ability to raid their neighbors.
Not only is there no reason to blanketly give pagans(which is an incredibly broad term to start with) the ability to raid but Jews, Muslims, and Christians have raided their neighbors for loot in history.
 

Staal

Emperor of Prussia
Feb 15, 2012
194
21
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • 500k Club
  • War of the Roses
I also don't like dumbing down the succession law names. Renaming gavelkind to partition is fine, as CK2 used it somewhat ahistorically for everyone. But getting rid of "primogeniture" is bad. That's a well established word that's also used in the real world. Simple language describing what the laws do can be used in tooltips.
Agreed, I really dislike all the succession law naming changes.
 

Masternachos

the Affable
Jun 10, 2010
1.057
130
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife Pre-Order
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
You guys really took the feedback about feudal contracts! These look amazing, there are so many specific options and variables. I'm honestly more excited to be a vassal now to make my ruler grant me eternal council power and my own coinage.
Simply being able to say "This direct vassal of mine can do this, but my other direct vassal can't" is a great upgrade from CK2's all-or-nothing (or rather, everybody-or-nobody) implementation.
 

polskaGOLA

Colonel
Sep 2, 2009
1.168
24
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
A little late with this dev diary but a major gripe I had about the succession laws in CK2 was the inability to handle the Rota System of the Ruthenian principalities of the old Kievan Rus'.

Worse, since succession laws were hard-coded in CK2, they were unable to be modified by modders.

Ideally, this type of succession is included in the game on-launch, but I wouldn't mind seeing it implemented in a future Kievan Rus' themed DLC package. Ultimately, I just want the game designers to ensure that something like this is not hard-coded this time around! @Meneth