CK3 Dev Diary #1 - Dynasties & Houses

CK3 Dev Diary #1 - Dynasties & Houses

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Varren

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While I do think that adding in Cadet branches is a good idea, in my opinion it shouldnt be a button press but a natural process. If a King has three children (A, B, and C) that inherit the Kingdom (A) and two other titles (say a duchy each for B and C) then the children of B and C should form a Cadet branch of the Dynasty once the children of A inherit the Kingdom (because they are no longer heirs to the main line). I think a natural process would be better for the flavour of the game.
Surely that would be unworkable with gavelkind (unless you want dozens of cadet branches for each dynasty).
 
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Gnostiko

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How will cadet branches work for non-Western/non-feudal realms? As well, what about their naming conventions? [Dynasty name] + de/of doesn't make sense for cultures who didn't really use topical names like Western Europeans e.g. House Komnenos ek Thessalonica is gibberish.
 

Gurkhal

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How will cadet branches work for non-Western/non-feudal realms? As well, what about their naming conventions? [Dynasty name] + de/of doesn't make sense for cultures who didn't really use topical names like Western Europeans e.g. House Komnenos ek Thessalonica is gibberish.
While I agree its gibberish, I find it a very practical gibberish so I personally wouldn't mind if they kept this part.
 

Spekkio

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Surely that would be unworkable with gavelkind (unless you want dozens of cadet branches for each dynasty).
I guess you could have different rules for different inheritance types. I still think a workable natural system would be better than a button press.
 

JSB217118

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Will the Dynast be able to arrange marriages for his heirs?
 

elvain

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How will cadet branches work for non-Western/non-feudal realms? As well, what about their naming conventions? [Dynasty name] + de/of doesn't make sense for cultures who didn't really use topical names like Western Europeans e.g. House Komnenos ek Thessalonica is gibberish.
In the Arab-Berber world, the new tribes, which were in fact cadet tribes/clans of the grand tribe, got name after their founder, or first distinctive leader.

So branches of the famous Banū Hilāl (Sons of Hilāl) were branched into Banū Riyāḥ, Banū At̲h̲bad̲j̲ and Banū Zug̲h̲ba - after 3 brothers bearing these names, later branches of those tribes were also named after their founders or first leaders.
If the names have repeated, which of course happened, the tribes were given additional names, so we have Banū ʿAmīr as well as Banū ʿAmīr b. Ṣaʿṣaʿa etc.

Other cultures might follow different paths of naming
Bohemian noble families were a mixture - there were Vítkovci (family of Vítek), Hroznatovci (family of Hroznata) or the most famous ones Přemyslovci (Přemyslids) and Slavníkovci (Slavníkids), but their later branches were usually named after their main castle - in fact Vítkovci z Rožmberka, Vítkovci z Krumlova etc.
 

Thorv

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Will there be an option to disable Lamarckian inheritance, pseudo-science and supernatural events?
 

hormag

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oh boy can't wait to see all the mods, the whole concept of Houses makes me think of two things
1. houses of morrowind
2. silmarillion (house of hador, house of finarfin etc)
and seeing an adequate (i hope), playable (refer to previous parenthesis) adaptation of either (and many others, too) makes me even more hyped up for the game, if it's possible to get any more hyped. The anticipation is killing me aaa
 

Superlazerninja12

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So, do bastards that aren't legitimized but are recognized create a new house within your dynasty or do they make a new completely unrelated dynasty like they did in CK2?
 

PrDelahaye

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I'm not sure the legacy system makes sense to me yet. It's supposed to represent what kind of people your dynasty members are, but the legacies you will get is an individual choice by the dynasty head. So I suppose this represents that the dynasty head decides how dynasty members should behave to improve it ? In that case, shouldn't the actual effects only activate after some time of having your dynasty members act according to the legacies you chose (for example, improved chance to get genetically blessed heirs only if enough dynasty members, living or dead, have had positive genetic traits) ? Perhaps with some effects even deactivating if you have walked away for too long from the path of your ancestors (like going back to normal bad trait chance if you marry too many people with these traits) ? I'm taking Blood as an example, but it makes sense with other tracks as well, like war, how are you supposed to keep being good at war if no one in the dynasty keeps learning the tactics created by your ancestors ? And shouldn't it take some time focusing on war to have all your dynasty become renowned warriors ?

So, to sum up, I don't disagree with the idea of spending renown for legacies, but it would make more sense in my opinion if the effect was something like "increases chance of dynasty members adopting specific behavior (for example, choosing spouses with good traits for Blood track) and if given condition met (for example for Blood it could be having a high enough value of [number of good traits - number of bad traits] in the dynasty) then good effect activates".
 
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Varren

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I'm taking Blood as an example, but it makes sense with other tracks as well, like war, how are you supposed to keep being good at war if no one in the dynasty keeps learning the tactics created by your ancestors ?
Blood's a bit of a bad example, since it's pure fantasy included to appease the eugenics crowd. The others are just part of the education that any of your dynasts receive. There's no need to worry about whether people are "learning the tactics created by your ancestors," because that's assumed to happen in the background.
 

PrDelahaye

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Blood's a bit of a bad example, since it's pure fantasy included to appease the eugenics crowd.
To be honest, I wrote this comment because of the eugenics track. It doesn't make sense, but since even some of the devs like it, there's no way they are going to delete it, and it looked to me like having requirements besides spending renown was the only compromise between the existence of blood legacies and legacies making more sense than "stopping revocating titles from my family for some time makes me able to decide to have more smart descendants". That being said, while not really being necessary to justify the existence of the other legacy tracks, extra requirements to keep the effects of your legacies active would not be absurd and might even be useful to make the endgame more enjoyable by making it harder to use several powerful legacy effects simultaneously.
 

ShadyGuy_SuspiciousGoal

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Hi Devs, can you tell us more about the family tree? Has there been any improvements made to the family tree viewer? Can we export the family tree? Will there be more filters or character search? What happens when your family tree turns into a family circle? Will the relationships be moddable? For example, can we add extra relationship definition, such as "uncle who is older than my father" and "wife of uncle who is older than my father" type of thing? These are very common in Asian cultures.
 
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Will Steel

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I personally don't even understand waht you mean by that. Can somebody explain?
The game doesn't have "relationship titles" beyond basic ones like "father/mother/uncle/grandfather/great grandfather/brother/sister" and a few more added in later patches. Anything more complex than that in CK2 was watered down to "Your Kinsman". Even great-great grandparents didn't have a title IIRC.

It worked, and it was much better than CK1, but it wasn't very immersive especially since those relationships meant a lot in historical context.

@ShadyGuy_SuspiciousGoal is asking if the more complex, detailed relationship titles are implemented in CK3 (or if they can be modded in, alongside general improvements to family tree system). Things like "2nd cousin once removed" or "maternal cousin" or such are some of examples I could think of, alongside the ones he gave.

And I fully support that idea. I love family trees in games and I would love it if they have been improved in CK3. :) Family tree in CK2 was fine but it was sometimes glitched and didn't always work well after Zoroastrianism was introduced in the game.
 
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ShadyGuy_SuspiciousGoal

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I personally don't even understand waht you mean by that. Can somebody explain?
In certain patrilineal kinship system there's an emphasis on the eldest son and they even have a special relationship title to be addressed. So in China, you don't ever address your uncle by name but by tittle such as "Big Uncle" (1st son of your grandpa) and so on. As it stands we can't really mod that into the game. (or I'm just not good enough at modding)
 
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WolfAleron

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The game doesn't have "relationship titles" beyond basic ones like "father/mother/uncle/grandfather/great grandfather/brother/sister" and a few more added in later patches. Anything more complex than that in CK2 was watered down to "Your Kinsman". Even great-great grandparents didn't have a title IIRC.

It worked, and it was much better than CK1, but it wasn't very immersive especially since those relationships meant a lot in historical context.

@ShadyGuy_SuspiciousGoal is asking if the more complex, detailed relationship titles are implemented in CK3 (or if they can be modded in, alongside general improvements to family tree system). Things like "2nd cousin once removed" or "maternal cousin" or such are some of examples I could think of, alongside the ones he gave.

And I fully support that idea. I love family trees in games and I would love it if they have been improved in CK3. :) Family tree in CK2 was fine but it was sometimes glitched and didn't always work well after Zoroastrianism was introduced in the game.
I see. I did notice that. One would hope that new engine will give more advanced mechanics. ALso, maybe they'll add china someday, since there's Map going pretty much to core chinese provinces. Anyways, nice explanations, cheers.
 
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