CK2Plus - Suggestion Thread

[themrwho]

Just ALT+TAB'd out of a game to post this: once a Kingdom is formed evidently it stays forever!

When it comes to empires, you need 150 holdings to form and once formed, if you go seriously lower than the minimum_holdings_needed_to_form number, your empire dissolves (which makes sense to me).

Should it not be the same with Kingdoms? We have a shadow of Mercia in my game at the moment down to 22 holdings and still clinging on to its former glory. Why not dissolve and become separate dukedoms?

(disclaimer: I'm hoping some easy picks here )

 

[zeress]

What about fringe cases like Navara which was historically tiny but nonetheless persisted for a long time.

 

[Friedrich von Deutschland]

What about fringe cases like Navara which was historically tiny but nonetheless persisted for a long time.

Thing is the same can be said about empires(Byzantium anyone). There isn't really a perfect solution to this however I think requiring the kingdom/empire hold fewer than X holdings AND control less that 45%(?) of its de jure territory(assuming it has any, titular titles aren't subject to this) it will devolve. Best of both worlds in my opinion.

 

[Rylock]

Thing is the same can be said about empires(Byzantium anyone). There isn't really a perfect solution to this however I think requiring the kingdom/empire hold fewer than X holdings AND control less that 45%(?) of its de jure territory(assuming it has any, titular titles aren't subject to this) it will devolve. Best of both worlds in my opinion.

There's no easy way to check what percentage of a title's de jure territory you hold, however. So that's far easier said than done.

We've considered destroying a kingdom title when the ruler holds NO territory in its de jure land, but otherwise the only way a kingdom title is destroyed currently is if it falls to a landless heir or if its crown authority is reduced below 0 (provided it was at least 1 previously).

 

[themrwho]

Mercia is down to one county. 3 holdings. The end is near...

I have a new suggestion though (or complaint): I am most displeased with the -40 opinion modifier that sometimes happens when you go to Pilgrimage. It's something locks on to you and it seems there's no way to shake it off.

If you kill your baby child, Pope, in his infinite wisdom, pops up in a few month/years and offers you a way out for the mere 100 gold cost (or something like that).
If you happen to go to Pilgrimage, and be unlucky enough to LIKE Muslims/Jews, you're screwed for life. This is not a great experience:
there is no option to NOT choose it (one can only choose Muslim or Jew button which in the end lead to -40 anyway)
and
once this laser guided medieval missile locks on to you, there is no way out.

It's basically killing that character for me. It's almost like 'your character is dead' text. Can we not water it down to -10? Can we not add another option there something like Zealous maybe (the opposite of open arms to all other religions, isn't it?).

it is a dice roll, once it rolls, character is screwed bad = this mechanic is bad. It is teaching you not to go to Pilgrimage

EDIT: the path I would like to choose: my character in about 800 AD goes all the way from Essex to Jerusalem and it's not to make new friends. He doesn't like other religions and has no understanding empathy whatsoever. He is just waiting for the Crusades to begin to kill as many humans of other religions as possible (don't judge him with 2010s eyes - he's socially very acceptable by his peers). He will be zealous at first chance in the next 24 months. Current game mechanic is forcing him to embrace Muslims or Jews. My character is being forced into developing multiple personality disorder.

 

[Rylock]

The Pilgrimage is a pretty long and complex vanilla event chain. I'm not interested in touching it, but maybe someone else will.

 

[Hector of Troy]

My suggestion is to make the Islamic empires stronger and more stable. It's been only 15 years of gameplay at the 769 bookmark, and the Umayyad and the Abbasid have already imploded. They both have high decadence, very low vassal limits, low income and low morale troops, and there are many revolts at a time everywhere. The Christians have already taken half of Iberia.

Of course I might be mistaken, but my first impressions are that they are even weaker and less stable than in vanilla, which seems to make them a very easy prey against the Byzantines and the Christian kingdoms. It would be more fun IMO if they would be able to put up a fair fight, but those are just my thoughts.

 

[Rylock]

It completely varies, actually. Sometimes the Abbasid implodes, sometimes (frequently, in fact) in blobs like there's no tomorrow (though, to be fair, not as bad as the Abbasids sometimes do in vanilla). Indeed, they blob often enough that we're considering more steps to make it difficult for them when they do. The Ummayads usually tend to hold their own, but I have seen them fall apart on occasion. It mostly depends on what kind of rulers they both get.

 

[Hector of Troy]

From my recent vanilla experience, The Abbasid have been made very very weak since the latest patch. The green blob is an illusion. I've played two campaigns and they did not beat the Byzantine Empire once, not a single time. All their holy wars and jihads failed. It's truth they will keep together as a blob for some two hundred years or less, but that is simply due to the fact The Byzantine AI will stop attacking them after a while, otherwise The Abbasid wouldn't stand a chance.

In Iberia it's even worse. There's no Reconquista war at all. Around 867, the peninsula will most likely have been completely controlled by Christians. Anyway, I've been playing my current CK2 plus campaign as a Buddhist, which will give me a good opportunity to see how the wars between the Islamic and Christians/Orthodox empires will unfold.

I remember playing this mod a long time ago, and, contrarily to vanilla outcomes, which are always predictably the same, I enjoyed watching the different scenarios CK2+ would provide. In Iberia, for example, sometimes the Umayyads would lose badly, whilst in other occasions they would not only prevail over the peninsula, but would even go as far as threatening the HRE.

 

[Kalista]

From my recent vanilla experience, The Abbasid have been made very very weak since the latest patch. The green blob is an illusion. I've played two campaigns and they did not beat the Byzantine Empire once, not a single time. All their holy wars and jihads failed. It's truth they will keep together as a blob for some two hundred years or less, but that is simply due to the fact The Byzantine AI will stop attacking them after a while, otherwise The Abbasid wouldn't stand a chance.

In Iberia it's even worse. There's no Reconquista war at all. Around 867, the peninsula will most likely have been completely controlled by Christians. Anyway, I've been playing my current CK2 plus campaign as a Buddhist, which will give me a good opportunity to see how the wars between the Islamic and Christians/Orthodox empires will unfold.

I remember playing this mod a long time ago, and, contrarily to vanilla outcomes, which are always predictably the same, I enjoyed watching the different scenarios CK2+ would provide. In Iberia, for example, sometimes the Umayyads would lose badly, whilst in other occasions they would not only prevail over the peninsula, but would even go as far as threatening the HRE.

Results should vary between different campaigns. In my test games I've litterally seen the muslims either implode early or make empires that made me envious of them. It all comes down to their rulers and that of their targets.

 

[LordPeter]

Results should vary between different campaigns. In my test games I've litterally seen the muslims either implode early or make empires that made me envious of them. It all comes down to their rulers and that of their targets.

I must agree here.
In my last campaign, ToG start, the Ummayads would slowly get driven out by Cristian Iberia, though they still hold more than 50% of Iberia at ~1000 and have gained some foothold in Africa. Abbasids on the other hand are blobbing like crazy, even taking from Byzantines and Georgia (which is personal union with Hungary, but still)! The only reason they haven't yet swallowed half the world - is my realm, actually, tactically sneaking in a Holy War while they were fighting 1 offensive Holy War and 1 Revolt (for different ruler) already. They won both these wars, but I managed to sneak away with Tigris...
Anyway, the point is: It is right, blobbing and collapsing of Muslim Realms varies.
It is a good idea to monitor this, and take some notes on how frequent both things happen, but right now I think there is no need to change something.

 

[Soulbourne]

Just a minor thing that I have no concept of the difficulty of: Would it be possible to allow one to make "Marches" of great duke vassals? Like you grant a duke a second title and then give an honorary marquis title or such, which drops their taxes to 0 or something and allows them to be called as an ally into any war? I know that historically marches were given great autonomy and allowances of the ruling line so that they could better defend the territory against a dangerous enemy, but there's no real way to mimic this in ck2 as of yet that I'm aware of.

While this would be abusable potentially for large empires, it could allow certian nations with more dangerous starts a better chance. For instance, if you play a pagan that inevitably borders the karliming empire your bound to get into some holy wars you have little chance of. And after raising tribal authority up towards reforming(or reforming itself) you get into a position of more control but less troops than calling vassals as allies. An ability to restore some of the more developed ones as ready allies would possibly make the wars easier with the major troop bonus, assuming you havent expanded to a point to crush them in a slug fest.

 

[Rylock]

Just a minor thing that I have no concept of the difficulty of: Would it be possible to allow one to make "Marches" of great duke vassals? Like you grant a duke a second title and then give an honorary marquis title or such, which drops their taxes to 0 or something and allows them to be called as an ally into any war?

No, not really.

 

[Tabris01]

I think you should "update" to Ancient Religions Reborn (If you haven't already done so, and I overlooked)

 

[Rylock]

I think you should "update" to Ancient Religions Reborn (If you haven't already done so, and I overlooked)

Why? There's a number of things from AR we didn't port over, because we didn't want them, and quite a few of the events have since changed...but if the original has advanced in some significant way, we might consider doing the work for porting it over again.

 

[Jack45]

Maybe tone down wars of religious unity, my liege the HREmperor decided to set up an antipope and within 5years was declared on by England, France (defeated) and Hungary (ongoing). Obviously there should be opposition to setting up an antipope but it's not like everybody in Europe should suddenly drop everything and attack the antipope's liege because of it...

Edit: Also, why do I get kinslayer when I kill my wife? Kinslaying is about killing a relative and my wife is not related to me by blood... You already get -20 dishonourable (-40 for some characters it seems), the combined -50/70 malus makes even trying to kill your wife stupid because if you get caught you might as well quit the game...

 

[zeress]

Edit: Also, why do I get kinslayer when I kill my wife? Kinslaying is about killing a relative and my wife is not related to me by blood... You already get -20 dishonourable (-40 for some characters it seems), the combined -50/70 malus makes even trying to kill your wife stupid because if you get caught you might as well quit the game...

While I am uncertain whether or not mechanically that is intended, your wife was iirc considered your kin during that time.

I could be wrong about that though, so pardon my mistake if I am mistaken as I am little bit hazy due to illness

 

[LordPeter]

While I am uncertain whether or not mechanically that is intended, your wife was iirc considered your kin during that time.

I could be wrong about that though, so pardon my mistake if I am mistaken as I am little bit hazy due to illness

At least that's what the game considers it: Your wife becomes your family (as indicated by the little drop of blood).
So technically not the mod, but vanilla game working here.

@zeress : Get well soon

 

[Tusade]

What happens with the HRE when Bizantium mends the great schism and the HR Emperor becomes orthodox?

Because, if the HRE is not catholic or fraticelli, the HRE makes no sense.

 

[Aigavlov]

Sorry I made some research in the mod and I found it with the CE and the HRE. I found myself really stupid now ^_^