Civilian Traffic

[General Karthos]

Suggestion for a friend. Why not include some civilian traffic along common trade routes? Something that you could assign a small ship to protect, just to ensure they get safely to their destination and aren't snatched up by pirates. Something you'd protect more powerfully during times of war, so that an opportunistic enemy doesn't interdict your interplanetary commerce.

Just a thought. Maybe a DLC devoted to civilian traffic and merchant marines?

 

[mrinku]

Yeah, I'd be in that.

 

[Ramiel]

Been mentioned several times as an idea, it'd likely fit with an inevitable trade DLC. Past Paradox games have always used more abstracted trade networks and routes, no actual ships moving around - if there were in Stellaris, I'd bet they'd only be a graphical feature. There's also a potential issue with system resources; you'd suddenly be adding hundreds, maybe thousands of little ships moving all over the galaxy, each and every one needing to be tracked and handled accordingly (even if only graphically).

 

[HighGain]

Search under "Trade" and a whole list of threads will come up with discussions and great ideas for a future Commerce & Trade DLC. From what I read, I'd summarize that the ideas fall into 3 major categories:

(1) Economy modeled closer to HOI4 or DWU: Resources with physical locations (planets, ships, stations...), civilian freighters that move said resources within empires and convoys that trade with other empires. Provides for resource hubs, shipping, and logistics chains that are not directly controlled by an empire government, but can be encouraged, protected, and attacked. Those that favor this approach feel it would give greater depth to empire management, warfare, and
provides for a viable reason for pirates. Performance is a major cited concern, but I haven't seen the devs weigh-in on whether this approach is / is not doable... it seems doable in the HOI4 dev diaries... but Stellaris isn't HOI.

(2) Abstracted economy: More like EU4 with abstracted trade routes & trade centers. Simulates a private economy and trade in a simpler fashion, but still provides for extra game depth and strategic choices for players. Those that favor this approach are either concerned about performance and / or don't see option 1 as value added depth nor fun... but the potential tedious need to micromanage a massive commerce simulation.

(3) Hybrid Approach? Some have suggested various hybrid approaches centered on creating trade routes that provide various benefits between empires and have periodically generated trade ships / convoys based on the supposed volume of trade on these routes... convoys that can be protected and raided for tangible losses and gains for the respective parties.

Based on the community discussions and hints by the devs, a commerce & trade DLC is very likely, just a matter of when & which approach Paradox chooses to implement. I've got my favored choice, but I'll save my thoughts. Hope this helps.

 

[SacremPyrobolum]

I hope they add it in but not as a DLC but as a free updated. I don't want to be nickled and dimed for cosmetics like I am for CK2 and EU4.

I loved how in Sins of a Solar Empire you would get civilian trading ships spawn and move around. I loved following them during down times in cinematic mode.

 

[General Karthos]

Been mentioned several times as an idea, it'd likely fit with an inevitable trade DLC. Past Paradox games have always used more abstracted trade networks and routes, no actual ships moving around - if there were in Stellaris, I'd bet they'd only be a graphical feature. There's also a potential issue with system resources; you'd suddenly be adding hundreds, maybe thousands of little ships moving all over the galaxy, each and every one needing to be tracked and handled accordingly (even if only graphically).

I think it would be cool/neat/whatever word you use, but I agree that I'm not sure it would be practical. Still, I'm not sure how dangerous pirates would be without civilian shipping lanes to prey on, even if only abstractly. (In EU3, you need to have one large ship constructed for each overseas colony to make sure you got its production.) This was an abstraction of piracy and other corruption.

 

[Ramiel]

Yeah, that sort of abstraction is exactly what I'd expect. Actually, we've already got pirates/raiders in-game, so I'd expect their ships to affect any abstracted civilian ships on trade routes within a certain range (likely a system, maybe smaller).

I hope they add it in but not as a DLC but as a free updated. I don't want to be nickled and dimed for cosmetics like I am for CK2 and EU4.

The fact the 'nickel and dimes' applies only to optional cosmetic DLC is one of the best parts of Paradox's policy. If this sort of thing were to be added it would most certainly be a mechanical addition, not just cosmetic, and would easily be just one part of a major DLC pack.

 

[Brian Bóroimhe]

Search under "Trade" and a whole list of threads will come up with discussions and great ideas for a future Commerce & Trade DLC. From what I read, I'd summarize that the ideas fall into 3 major categories:

(1) Economy modeled closer to HOI4 or DWU: Resources with physical locations (planets, ships, stations...), civilian freighters that move said resources within empires and convoys that trade with other empires. Provides for resource hubs, shipping, and logistics chains that are not directly controlled by an empire government, but can be encouraged, protected, and attacked. Those that favor this approach feel it would give greater depth to empire management, warfare, and
provides for a viable reason for pirates. Performance is a major cited concern, but I haven't seen the devs weigh-in on whether this approach is / is not doable... it seems doable in the HOI4 dev diaries... but Stellaris isn't HOI.

(2) Abstracted economy: More like EU4 with abstracted trade routes & trade centers. Simulates a private economy and trade in a simpler fashion, but still provides for extra game depth and strategic choices for players. Those that favor this approach are either concerned about performance and / or don't see option 1 as value added depth nor fun... but the potential tedious need to micromanage a massive commerce simulation.

(3) Hybrid Approach? Some have suggested various hybrid approaches centered on creating trade routes that provide various benefits between empires and have periodically generated trade ships / convoys based on the supposed volume of trade on these routes... convoys that can be protected and raided for tangible losses and gains for the respective parties.

Based on the community discussions and hints by the devs, a commerce & trade DLC is very likely, just a matter of when & which approach Paradox chooses to implement. I've got my favored choice, but I'll save my thoughts. Hope this helps.

This is an excellent summary of the discussions that have taken place in previous threads.

 

[KonradKurze202]

I hope they add it in but not as a DLC but as a free updated. I don't want to be nickled and dimed for cosmetics like I am for CK2 and EU4.

Then PDS would go out of business. They've continually improved/added to EU4 ever since release. They literally have whole teams working on already released games, that kind of development not only deserves a reward, but requires it. Common Sense, Art of War, Conquest of Paradis, El Dorado, they all added brand new features and improved on existing ones, had they been free they never would have happened. A trade DLC and an espionage DLC and a migrant fleet / Star Lords DLC are all greatly looked forward to (by myself and many others). If PDS cannot charge money for those features there are two options:
1) They are not done at all, as it would be cost prohibitive.
2) They are done poorly / low budgetly as anything else is cost prohibitive.

Personally I want them to devote all the resources needed to make these features great, and I am willing to pay 15-20$ to get that.

 

[SacremPyrobolum]

Then PDS would go out of business. They've continually improved/added to EU4 ever since release. They literally have whole teams working on already released games, that kind of development not only deserves a reward, but requires it. Common Sense, Art of War, Conquest of Paradis, El Dorado, they all added brand new features and improved on existing ones, had they been free they never would have happened. A trade DLC and an espionage DLC and a migrant fleet / Star Lords DLC are all greatly looked forward to (by myself and many others). If PDS cannot charge money for those features there are two options:
1) They are not done at all, as it would be cost prohibitive.
2) They are done poorly / low budgetly as anything else is cost prohibitive.

Personally I want them to devote all the resources needed to make these features great, and I am willing to pay 15-20$ to get that.

It is not my place to worry about Paradox's bottom line. If they make something worth buying, I'll buy it, if not I won't. I won't pay for civilian ships flying around.

 

[KonradKurze202]

It is not my place to worry about Paradox's bottom line. If they make something worth buying, I'll buy it, if not I won't. I won't pay for civilian ships flying around.

Of course not, if they released a DLC than added nought but random civilian ships flying around pointlessly I wouldn't buy it either. But I want a full sized Trade DLC, that makes it a fully functional and important part of the game, and that is where civilian fleets ought to be added. And that is what I would pay for. I love PDS's full sized DLCs and I buy most of them, I expect I'll buy most of them for Stellaris as well. If PDS changed their strategy to not release expansions for their games it would be a sad day for all of us.