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Kennelly

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I agree with Yakman,they should not receive a missionary bonus.The Arabs,yes they converted most of the areas they conquered,but the Turks did not.The non-Muslim provinces the Ottomans conquered,like Lebanon or Syria have up till today remained with a significant non Muslim or more specific non-Sunni poulation,like Lebanon,Syria or Armenia.Bulgaria or Serbia were under Ottoman control for nearly 500 years,but still no significant Muslim conversions were put through.The few exceptions were Albania/Macedonia and Bosnia (and here only a wealthy minority),but these could be done through event as are the other ones like Constantinople or Smyrna province already.
With a missionary bonus,Hungary,Romania and Greece wil be fully Muslim in the end.
 

tatertot18

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Yes, but I find it very satisfying in a game as the Ottoman Empire to be able to successfully convert the areas that they couldn't. Any regions without Arab, Turkish, Greek, or Slavonic are not going to be easily converted anyways, as it is far too costly without the culture. Next thing you know the bonuses for Orthodox will be removed cause Russia is able to convert all the Asian steppes peoples.
 

Yakman

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That's completely "un-Ottoman" though. They were never trying to convert people. It hurts the game.

GET RID OF SUNNI MISSIONARIES!!!
 

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Listen, as you said there were conversions in this time period historically. Not enough to justify a bonus, but certainly not little enough to warrant a penalty. Making conversions simply via event is far too much determinsm for me.
 

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Jinnai said:
Listen, as you said there were conversions in this time period historically. Not enough to justify a bonus, but certainly not little enough to warrant a penalty.
I dunno about "certainly", but I'd agree that they should be able to get missionaries at some slider settings. Frankly, giving them missionaries at 44% of the slider settings is probably more than enough. We'll see how it plays out.
 

doktarr

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chegitz guevara said:
If you go max narrowminded, you still get plenty of missionaries.
Especially when you consider that the computer almost never places more than one missionary at a time anyway. If the AI gets more than .1/year, they have all they need.
 

unmerged(6159)

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Because the Ottomans will have to go narrowminded to be able to convert?
 

Sindai

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tatertot18 said:
When will these changes be implemented so I know not to download any further versions?

You realize it's a pretty trivial thing it is to edit the religions.csv yourself, right? Heck, you can do it with Notepad.
 

doktarr

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tatertot18 said:
When will these changes be implemented so I know not to download any further versions?
  1. You will still get missionaries at innovativeness<5. At zero innovativeness, it is harly a limitation at all, since it is very rare to have both the money and the opportunity to send more than two missionaries a year.
  2. The only real change here is that we now have the flexibility to limit whether the AI gets missionaries through the use of initial DP sliders and event effects. Humans will pretty much still be able to go crazy ahistorical if they want.
  3. If you really hate the change, it's trivially easy to change it back. Open up religion.csv; it's pretty much self-explanatory.
  4. Even if you couldn't change it back, would you really give up every future refinement of the AGCEEP for this one change? That's a fairly ridiculous stand, given the amount of fixing that's still going on. You could always play the Ottomans in vanilla if it was that big a deal to you.
  5. The changes are already implemented in the latest patch.
  6. I find your complaints a bit odd, given your choice of avatar ;)
 

unmerged(6159)

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So the answer to his question is that he needs to have 1.2.9 or earlier? :)
 

chegitz guevara

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Or you could just copy the religion.csv from vanilla EU2 into the AGCEEP folder. Anyway, tatertot18 the changes are, among other things, to make the Ottos more stable. As everyone knows, they have a very difficult time with stablity, owing to having three or more religions, multiple non-state cultures, etc, even when expanding historically.
 

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Forcing the Ottomans to push for narrowminded in order to convert would be good for their stability. It's really what happened historically anyhow.
 

doktarr

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Isaac Brock said:
So the answer to his question is that he needs to have 1.2.9 or earlier? :)
Isaac, the only thing between you and a beating is a 14 hour drive.
 

tatertot18

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doktarr said:
I find your complaints a bit odd, given your choice of avatar ;)[/list]

Thats understandable. My obsession is more with the city of Constantinople first, and the empires that ruled from it second. Thus, I am a fan of both the Byzantine or Eastern Roman Empire and the Ottoman Turks. As a disgruntled former Catholic both appeal to me, and I kinda like the idea of converting the Balkans wholey to Islam, kinda makes me wonder what-if.
 

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chegitz guevara said:
Or you could just copy the religion.csv from vanilla EU2 into the AGCEEP folder. Anyway, tatertot18 the changes are, among other things, to make the Ottos more stable. As everyone knows, they have a very difficult time with stablity, owing to having three or more religions, multiple non-state cultures, etc, even when expanding historically.

Yes, I understand this. I understand that the main part of AGCEEP is to make the experience quite historical. But at the same time certain areas are allowing for breaks with history. In a recent game as England I missed the English Civil War completely by chosing to oppose Parliment but not fight them. Thus Cromwell never rose to power and the monarchy remained throughout. There is an event system that allows for Burgundy to claim the mantle of France. So, my question is what about an event system that allows for an ahistorical Ottoman Empire. Perhaps if you can have all of your cores conquered that are created by certain rulers taking the throne you can trigger random conversions. Basically the opposite of the Turkish defeat event where if you fail to gain several key cores (I'm a little foggy on this as I never get it triggered :) ) but instead it rewards you with a random conversion or 2. On the same note, are there provisions in place if you absorb the Austrian Empire?? Perhaps an event that adds another culture or a wave of conversions. Any ideas on this?
 

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There is absolutely nothing to stop the Ottomans from going very narrowminded and converting all of the Balkans. You have the cultures to do it quite easily.

I'm not sure why the Ottomans should get 'rewards'. In my opinion (just my opinion mind you) what makes the game so good is that it doesn't 'steamroll' - there are mechanisms in the game that avoid the situation in so many games where once you reach a certain size there is no challenge. Adding a bunch of extra cores and cultures would go against that. Just my opinion.
 

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Who's to say an Ottoman Empire that conquered all of Austria wouldn't already be a steamroller? And as far as rewards, the option of accepting this conversions would come with stability hits that may very well make an Ottoman Empire think twice about it.