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unmerged(19458)

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Sep 9, 2003
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Re: Rule questions....

Originally posted by TrainWreck
Well, I suppose these are good ideas....although I do not know when they are SUPPOSED to occur. Will need some help here (DAW...?:D ).

Better late than never eh? One major thing my regular group does is use our own war entry system. We ignore in game WE. I don't suggest that the new group use this system right away. I suggest we go with the basic exploit preventing rules to follow until such time as the gaming group is solidified.

House Rules:

These rules are based on a 2 alliance system. UK, France, USA and USSR are allied. Germany, Japan, Italy and Balkan minors are Axis. When possible, sides will always pit 4 human players against 4 human players.

1. No tech trades to human or non-human positions except as follows:
A) UK only to a HUMAN controlled CW minor. UK may send 2 techs of 20IC or greater value and 3 techs of under 20IC value per year. The CW country may NOT send any to the UK.
B) The Axis may send 2 techs (total) of any value per year to a HUMAN controlled axis minor. The minor may NOT send any techs back to the other Axis members.

2. We use base manpower levels (1.05c) except:
A) Germany is provided an additional 350mp points to give them a fighting chance against the USSR.
B) Any minor CW or Axis is provided an additional 250mp points.
NOTE: The MP changes and tech rules are there to make playing a minor a viable and somewhat enjoyable experience for the players having to play them.

3. Military Access through neutral nations is PROHIBITED. Players may not use it or ask for it from a neutral nation.

4. No more than 10 units may be given to a neutral nation as expeditionary forces by each individual player.

5. Supplies and resources may not be sent to non-allied countries. Exception is:
A) Countries may send supplies and resources to nations of like political alignment as long as both are peace or both are at war. Example: UK may send to a liberal democrat Poland but not to a paternal autocrat Argentina. A neutral USA could not send supplies to the UK if the UK was at war.
NOTE: This prohibits the democratic allies from sending a neutral communist USSR supplies and resources. Once both are at war, supplies may be sent.

6. The USA player will play France until France falls. The following restrictions will apply:
A) No more than 10 divisions & 5 air squadrons may be stationed outside of mainland French territory.
B) No fortifications may be built within France prior to France being at war. This includes the construction of AA. The Maginot Line provinces are exempt from this clause.

7. During times of peace, the game will be run at normal to above normal speed. When wars are being fought, the game will be run at slow speed. Increases or decreases in game speed require an agreement by all players. Player desired pauses are NOT PERMITTED except by majority vote. Exceptions:
A) If a player's forces should be sent on a stupid retreat (we all know what those are), the player may immediately pause the game and request a redirect of those forces to another valid province. The non-retreating combatant has the right to ask for a vote if he feels the redirection is improper (almost never happens).
NOTE: The enactment of this rule requires the player requesting the redirect to tell the host the name of the leader(s) and to which province they should be sent instead. Once this information is provided and any contests settled, everyone exits the game. The host will edit the save file (takes 2-3 minutes) and rehosts the game.

8. The ONLY valid player positions are:
A) France/USA
B) UK
C) USSR
D) Any CW minor (Canada, Australia, New Zealand or South Africa)
E) Germany
F) Japan
G) Italy
H) Balkan minors (Hungary, Romania or Bulgaria)

Expectations and Common Sense:
Players are expected to play their position regardless of the fortunes of war. If you are getting it handed to you, you are expected to continue playing. Everyone will get their turn in the barrel, so be a good sport.
Looking at the save file between sessions (other than looking at your own position with the game on pause) is considered cheating. Be a good sport and respect your fellow players.
Any disputes will be settled by a majority group vote. In the case of a tie, the group owner (TrainWreck) will have the final say.

I will host a ventrilo voice server with allied and axis channels during the session. Players may use this (the quality is great) as it saves a great deal of typing and speeds communication. In game communication between the axis and allied players must obviously still be typed. Get the ventrilo software at http://www.ventrilo.com/download.php . You want the client software.

TrainWreck, advise me if you have any questions on these. I'll be happy to explain and I may have forgotten something.
 

unmerged(9876)

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Jun 19, 2002
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A couple of questions:
6. The USA player will play France until France falls.

If a player wants to play the USA for the entire game (for research reasons, mainly), I do not find this a problem. Does that make it too easy on the German player?

7. During times of peace, the game will be run at normal to above normal speed. When wars are being fought, the game will be run at slow speed. Increases or decreases in game speed require an agreement by all players. Player desired pauses are NOT PERMITTED except by majority vote.

  • I think dial-up connections may limit this top speed to 'normal', but we will find out.
  • Pauses, if necessary, should be allowed early in the game. I especially want to consider this early in the game as some of us newer players may have questions, etc. Of course, common sense applies, but I do not want to stress anybody too much as we get used to it.
  • I saw a thread about removing leader pics to increase speed for dial-up. Have you tried this? I may, since the pics apparently slow down the game quite a bit when changing leaders.

I will host a ventrilo voice server with allied and axis channels during the session.

Not sure I will have the spare bandwidth, but will try.....
 

unmerged(19458)

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If the USA player wants to stick with the USA, thats fine. The UK or CW minor player can be given military control of France for free and control their units. Same restrictions apply however in regards to French units and fortifications.

Pauses: I encourage you take make pauses the exception and not the norm. If you allow players to pause whenever "they" feel it is necessary, you'll complete about 1 month of game time per session. If someone has a question about the rules or policies then by all means pause and ask away. For normal game play, you really need to avoid pausing or the progress will make things very tedious. When playing at slow or very slow during war time, it is rare that things would occur at a pace which would make someone feel the need to pause. Besides, a great strategy is for one side to plan multiple attacks on the same date. This really stresses the recipient as it would have stressed a real world general staff. Again, the game is moving so slow that it would only cause their hearts to skip a beat or two before they got things squared away. :)

Voice Server: I haven't had anyone use the voice server on dialup. I guess giving it a try is the best idea. If it doesn't work out for dialup people, then they'll have to get back to exercising their fingers. :)
 

jxa536

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I have to concur with DAW on the pause issue. In the one MP game I participated in (with just one opponent) it seemed like half of the time was spent in game pause.

Perhaps a fair option would be to have the host pause the game at start for troop disposition, leader and minister selection, initial research and production choices, convoy setup and trades.

After that, it will certainly be a challenge to keep up with limited pauses, but it should be fun!
 

unmerged(19458)

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jxa536, I agree. My normal group usually pauses at the start and at the end of the sessions for everyone to get readjusted and to perform housekeeping tasks. Especially at the start of the game. The UK player will need 5-10 minutes just to get his convoys straightened out. :)

If TrainWreck approves the houserules, all we need do is select countries. If everyone lists their top 4 choices, he should be able to start telling people where they will be. I'll make placing me easy. I'll play any position from Germany on down to Canada. Put me where I'm needed. I believe one or two people from my regular group have expressed interest in playing in this group also should we be short of players.

DAW
 

Mad Mac

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I will be out of the loop until Sunday morning (I sent Trainwreck an email as well) but am tanned, rested and ready to go. But since I will be w/out my computer until Sunday, I'll give you my top 4 choices:

1. Germany
2. US
3. USSR
4. Japan

Thanks
 

unmerged(19458)

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House Rule Addendum

Add rule #9. While at peace, offensive world market trading is prohibited. This means that a neutral Uk may NOT trade for rubber or oil on the world market to try and keep it out of the hands of the axis. A neutral USA may not trade for oil. So if you don't need it, you are not permitted to trade for it. Once at war, offensive world market trades are perfectly acceptable.

TrainWreck, could you post a list of the current players you've accepted in to the group?

EDIT: Games will be started on the hard/normal settings.
 
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jxa536

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Minor (Roumania etc.)
USSR
Italy
France/USA

I'm flexible though
 

Willard

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Hi all-

Just found this thread and wanted to throw my hat into the ring.
I have played HOI several times in MP and numerous times in SP.

I guess I am an average player that enjoys more historical games than gamey stuff.

I have cable modem and live in Virginia (EST timezone). Sundays are really good for me in the 300pm-900pm time range. The only problem would be work (my job sometimes has weird hours). However I usually know way ahead of time when I have to work Sunday afternoons.

Please add me to the list of players or if that list is full, as a designated replacement/standby player.

Thanks,

Will
 

unmerged(15974)

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Apr 3, 2003
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my choices

1. Tannu Tuva
2. Luxemborg
3. Bhutan

Just Kidding


1. Italy
2. UK
3. Romania
4. USA
 

unmerged(9876)

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Okay, I will have to peruse all the information I have here. I will add Willard to the list of S6-9 people (there is a joke in there somewhere...) and check out the preferences.

I would prefer, I suppose:
Japan
Italy
USA
(these are the only ones I have played much in SP).

DAW, the rules look fine, and I understand about the pauses. I just wanted to make sure that everyone knows that in an EMERGENCY, feel free to pause.

How long (game time) does an average session to last? I was thinking that we would run on 'normal' (instead of 'above normal') after the intial setup to let everyone get comfortable with real time, no pauses. Also, a break of 15 minutes or so at 1.5 hours of play? Bathroom and micor managing time....
 

unmerged(18417)

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need to do a pause once every year. That way you can do your "Build more IC" stuff. That might be a good break time. However, running on nromal speed, you will be able to walk away from your computer for several minutes at a time without anything happening, at least until war breaks out. So u might not even need a break. I caqn still take any country, but my order of preference is.
1. SU
2. UK
3. US
4. Germany
5. Italy
6. Nat Chi
7. France
8. Japan

Hope that helps.
Oh yeah, on V-net, my name is AF Junky,

Thanks
 

unmerged(9876)

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DAW,

Question for you. You have 4 on 4 set-up, but have the same player playing France/USA in the rules. This is only seven players. If the France player switches to the US, is the 8th player a CW minor? Or can the French player switch to a CW minor and a single player play the US the whole time?

And...got everybody's preferences but yours...or I missed them, let me go back and check. As soon as I get them (or find them) I will post proposed positions.
 

unmerged(19458)

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Correct, the 4th ally is a CW minor. The CW minor is very helpful to the UK player as they can help control some of the minors and keep watch on certain fronts. If you've ever played the UK in MP, you'd know how useful having a CW minor is.

I did place my choices further back in the thread. I made mine easy, I'll play anything from Germany to Canada. Put me where you need me.
 

unmerged(9876)

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Ah! Found it! Sorry, was scanning for lists :)

Well, you would end up as the CW minor; however, no one really 'picked' France, hence the second part of my question...do you want to play France until the fall, then a commonwealth, if the US player wants to start as US? Or militarily control France? Open to ideas.

Otherwise, the list reads:
Allies:
UK ------------- Ihategfafb
USA ----------- Web Hop
USSR --------- Sneaky Ivan
CW ------------ DAW


Axis:
Germany ----- Mad Mac
Italy ---------- Thrdarmy
Japan --------- TrainWreck
Minor --------- Jxa536


Let me know if I got this wrong anywhere...I think everyone got their first, except two of you had SU as #1. Sneaky got it because of the chain reaction that resulted in everyone with their No. 2, instead of just Ihategfafb at No. 2.

Web Hop, I think that we need to decide what you and DAW want to do with France. I guess from the original discussion, you can start with France and switch, or just stay US the whole time.

EDIT:
Regarding experience level. It sounds like Ihate and DAW are the two most experienced...and on the same side. How much experience is on the Axis? I have no MP, although quite a bit of Japanese experience in SP. Is this going to be an issue? I could switch to CW minor and let DAW play Japan, that may help quite a bit....
 
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unmerged(19458)

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Putting me in as a CW minor won't effect the axis game a great deal. It will however make for a better game as far as the UK goes. The Axis will need to keep on their toes which is good. I think the US player should for balance purposes run France until they fall. This lets the AI screw up the USA for a couple years and helps maintain play balance. If the US player feels strongly about it, then I'll just take MC of France from Canada.

Are we launching the game this coming Sunday at 6pm est? And are we launching from VNet? I can provide an IP to all the players if you'd prefer not to launch from VNet.

Ihategfafb, PM me, we need to discuss strategy. :)
 

unmerged(15974)

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I'm ready to go as Italy!!

6pm EST right?

I'll make sure I can actually log into a MP lobby later today to see if it freezes me up or not.