Capturing "too low infrastructure" province

[unmerged(175069)]

As tittle stated, how do I do that?

I tried with motorized, infantry(All kinds) whereas my allied British managed to take a few of those province using a motorized infantry division.

 

[SickMonkey]

They are (usually) automatically captured when you capture adjacent provinces.

 

[Sangeli]

They are (usually) automatically captured when you capture adjacent provinces.

If it is province that you can surround, then ya. But often times the super low infastructure provinces are boundry provinces. And plus, if you can't pass through it what difference does it make if you have it?

 

[unmerged(51418)]

If it is province that you can surround, then ya. But often times the super low infastructure provinces are boundry provinces. And plus, if you can't pass through it what difference does it make if you have it?

Resources?
Or you can then build infras in there and then outflank your enemy.

 

[Sangeli]

Resources?
Or you can then build infras in there and then outflank your enemy.

Recources? I don't think any of them have resources. And yes, I have thought about that last strategy lol. But I would probably hold myself back from doing that, at least in most circumstances.

 

[unmerged(51418)]

Recources? I don't think any of them have resources. And yes, I have thought about that last strategy lol. But I would probably hold myself back from doing that, at least in most circumstances.

By the way, wouldn't be more realistic if some units could actually enter provinces with low infra?
I mean, few areas are really unpassable for a barefeeted unit, especially if they're grouped with an ENG unit.

I would divide it in three levels:

Level 1 (infra 1-3): accessible only by feet units (INF, MTN, etc.) with ENG giving bonuses and other attached units (ART, AC, etc.) removing the possibility.

Level 2 (infra 4-6): accessible even by by mobile units (ARM, MEC, MOT) but only if they have ENG attached with them.

Level 3 (infra 7-10): accessible to everybody.

Anybody agrees?

 

[Sangeli]

I don't like that. The reason why a province is unnaccesible to a unit is not that it is actually unnaccessible by the unit, but that it can't be supplied. Units in the middle of the desert can't have any supply reach them and since IRL units don't have 30 days of supply with them, its better off just making them impassible.

 

[unmerged(51418)]

I don't like that. The reason why a province is unnaccesible to a unit is not that it is actually unnaccessible by the unit, but that it can't be supplied. Units in the middle of the desert can't have any supply reach them and since IRL units don't have 30 days of supply with them, its better off just making them impassible.

That's a good point, but I was actually thinking at something like the "Chindits" raids in Burma.
They were air resupplied and managed to walk all the way though an impassable jungle.
They didn't achieve very much and their casualties were horrendous, but they achieved one of the main purposes of warfare: they were where the enemy didn't expect them to be.

 

[unmerged(91248)]

@ C. Uaua

I think it's a good idea that infantry should be allowed into any provence (even those with only level 1 infrastructure) and that other, larger units can't. There should be movement and supply penalties for these units though.

I think I'd leave out the level 2 portion though, as it seems a bit too fiddley.

 

[SAS]

I like the idea of allowing the units into the low INFA provinces but just making the attrition very high.

 

[panzeroo]

this is where modding in units like commandoes and light infantry comes into play...

 

[Jazumir]

1) There are impassable with ressources - look in southern egypt for examples.

2) I´d also like exceptions to the impassable rule. I´d just make it that, though - an exception, not a whole new set of rules. uhem thinking about it, it might get rather complex anyways:
- only certain types of brigades allowed into impassables - and only into those bordering passables (for supply)
+ ENG in any type of terrain
+ MTN in mountains (and hills?)
- double attrition in impassables should prevent stacks or major operations there.
Something along these lines...

 

[SickMonkey]

Tibet has a victory point in an impassable province.

Anyway, don't think of the provinces as "impassable", but rather "impassable by division-sized formations" and it makes more sense.

 

[Jazumir]

Tibet has a victory point in an impassable province.

Anyway, don't think of the provinces as "impassable", but rather "impassable by division-sized formations" and it makes more sense.

So, Tibet is invincible, then, uh? Oh wait, you could maybe bomb them into submission...

But the size of the unit cant be the limiting factor in game, since you´d then just send in a bunch of independent brigades. Speed and attrition should make sending in too much prohibitive on its own, acting as a soft-limit.

 

[SickMonkey]

So, Tibet is invincible, then, uh? Oh wait, you could maybe bomb them into submission...

But the size of the unit cant be the limiting factor in game, since you´d then just send in a bunch of independent brigades. Speed and attrition should make sending in too much prohibitive on its own, acting as a soft-limit.

Well, you can still surround the province to get it.

The AI is not good with "soft limits". Anyway, it would only mean a bunch of units retreating out into the Sahara and run around forever requiring you to put units nearby to keep watch (like in HoI1 and 2, i think).

 

[unmerged(300879)]

I wanna ask hwo to pass trough a province with infra 1, whiel the owner doesnt even have the poss. to upgrade it (Belgium). I read that INF should pass, it's year 1944 and my inf cant pass trough it, and the whoel div. is only made by inf.

 

[Sirveri]

Well, you can still surround the province to get it.

The AI is not good with "soft limits". Anyway, it would only mean a bunch of units retreating out into the Sahara and run around forever requiring you to put units nearby to keep watch (like in HoI1 and 2, i think).

Hoi2 had impassable terrain as well. Infra 1 is the same as hoi2 in that regards.

 

[unmerged(139259)]

Hoi2 had impassable terrain as well. Infra 1 is the same as hoi2 in that regards.

AFAIK, HOI2 had no impassable terrain and/or provinces. I think it was handled by impassable boundaries between provinces. Therefore, you could block a province from all sides, or just from selected ones, to allow units to enter province from west, but not from north, for example.



Btw: I'm voting against semi-passable infra. The way it is now is not bad and works good enough. Low infra simply represents territories impassable for larger formations, such as divisions, as it was noted above. However, even single brigades would not pass it without severe problems with attrition. And while lower level units (such as battalions) are not in game, what would be the point of having infra=1 provinces passable for single brigades? To prolonge their certain death caused by starvation? To confuse AI? Isn't it better if a unit actually surrenders instead of retreats into low infra province and dies several days later?

 

[Darkrenown]

I wanna ask hwo to pass trough a province with infra 1, whiel the owner doesnt even have the poss. to upgrade it (Belgium). I read that INF should pass, it's year 1944 and my inf cant pass trough it, and the whoel div. is only made by inf.

No, Inf cannot pass through it. No one can. It is impassable.

 

[unmerged(139259)]

Anyway, does anyone know how the engine exactly handles occupation of impassable provinces? Is it automatically calculated by the engine or is it defined somewhere in the files? Is it tied to one neighbouring province? Or to the whole region? So, if we have 4-province region and one province is impassable, then when the other 3 provinces from that region are controlled by one nation, then also the fourth province will switch the sides. How it comes they switch they sides even if not directly captured?