Capitalists keep building bad factories!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[robinfisichella]

Serioulsy not sure what I'm supposed to do about these mong capitalists which insist on building

-canned food
-explosives
-fertlizer

which all immeadiatly go bust in my oversized persia.

Not sure how to stop them building the wrong things or how to stop these things going bust. I tried war to gain more rgo's and tech to increase the efficiency of the factory but they keep building these randomones despite my top 5 rgos being

timber
coal
cotton
wool
grain

Which gives you some idea that in 50 years of capitalism so far they havent even managed to exceed the rgo ability of the artisans!!!!!!!!!

 

[EUnderhill]

Serioulsy not sure what I'm supposed to do about these mong capitalists which insist on building

-canned food
-explosives
-fertlizer

which all immeadiatly go bust in my oversized persia.

Not sure how to stop them building the wrong things or how to stop these things going bust. I tried war to gain more rgo's and tech to increase the efficiency of the factory but they keep building these randomones despite my top 5 rgos being

timber
coal
cotton
wool
grain

Which gives you some idea that in 50 years of capitalism so far they havent even managed to exceed the rgo ability of the artisans!!!!!!!!!

IIRC the artisans produce at about the level of the third-tier techs, so it is probably to expected to be a long time before your factories will be more efficient...plus, with the ROW having a head-start, playing catch-up is what one should expect to play.

 

[robinfisichella]

I was doing ok for a time. Glass outputs went into my top 1 or 2 outputs. But now its 1911 and things have gone from bad to worse.

The biggest issue is the cost of the goods used to make stuff in my factories. Its just too much, double the price of the thing I'm producing.

In this case is it best to switch to a government type that allows me to build factories or go to LF government to see if this makes things cheaper?

At the moment I'm an inverventionlist conservative.

 

[EUnderhill]

I was doing ok for a time. Glass outputs went into my top 1 or 2 outputs. But now its 1911 and things have gone from bad to worse.

The biggest issue is the cost of the goods used to make stuff in my factories. Its just too much, double the price of the thing I'm producing.

In this case is it best to switch to a government type that allows me to build factories or go to LF government to see if this makes things cheaper?

At the moment I'm an inverventionlist conservative.

Perhaps you would be better off just exporting the raw materials if they are that pricey.

 

[grimkm]

I was doing ok for a time. Glass outputs went into my top 1 or 2 outputs. But now its 1911 and things have gone from bad to worse.

The biggest issue is the cost of the goods used to make stuff in my factories. Its just too much, double the price of the thing I'm producing.

In this case is it best to switch to a government type that allows me to build factories or go to LF government to see if this makes things cheaper?

At the moment I'm an inverventionlist conservative.

It's hard to insanely difficult to industrialise a former unciv nation until the top tier factories are unlocked, phones, electric gear, cars, planes and tanks..of course, as long as you have access to rubber. Whoever has sphered you probably also has a functioning industrial sector by this point, seriously undermining yours. I take it you are sphered as Persia. Incite a revolution.

LF rather than interventionist is slightly better. The capis will build factories and bankrupted once will remain just long enough for your industry to develop and not just a constant loop of canned food, artillery, etc. Alternatively, use your NF to try to boost likelihood of certain industry.

 

[robinfisichella]

It's hard to insanely difficult to industrialise a former unciv nation until the top tier factories are unlocked, phones, electric gear, cars, planes and tanks..of course, as long as you have access to rubber. Whoever has sphered you probably also has a functioning industrial sector by this point, seriously undermining yours. I take it you are sphered as Persia. Incite a revolution.

LF rather than interventionist is slightly better. The capis will build factories and bankrupted once will remain just long enough for your industry to develop and not just a constant loop of canned food, artillery, etc. Alternatively, use your NF to try to boost likelihood of certain industry.

Thanks, well it's getting late game now and I have just researched the techs to get telephones etc so is it worth NF on all those industries.

What do you mean by "incite a revolution"? You mean for a liberal one? I am strongly sphered by Russia and almost everyone else, but Russia is the one building loads of rail roads in my country and 1 factory. I take it it would be a bad idea to unsphere myself from everyone?

At the moment I have no access to rubber, I have tried, the closest place is Egypt which has been dismantled by Brazil, Italy, France and the ottoman Empire and Spain! The only bit they lift is the bit with all the rubber near ethiopia. The problem is every time i DoW them some GP intervenes. However Russia just invited me to their alliance so maybe I can desuade any interventions against me, though sine my last CB succeeded France (who previously destroyed Egypt) is their protector! WTF!

Anyway the only other place I can get rubber is Brunei, I'm not sure if I can transport my army all the way over there?

 

[robinfisichella]

OH and one thing I DO have is OIL! I invaded Dubai, bahrain etc some time ago and they sporned oil as well as some in Persia national territory. I have been NFing the chemical industry in Abu Dhabi but so far only a fuel factory has been built in Persia.

Does it matter where I NF something, it seems the capis are reluctant to build in Abu Dhabi even with NF.

 

[VoodooEconomist]

Anyway the only other place I can get rubber is Brunei, I'm not sure if I can transport my army all the way over there?

Transporting armies is ridiculously easy in Vicky2 unless you're an AI. I say go for it!

 

[robinfisichella]

Transporting armies is ridiculously easy in Vicky2 unless you're an AI. I say go for it!

Yeah thats curious they didnt put a range on fleets? Only downside I can see is the skull thing degrading organisation. Am I right in saying it takes more supplies for troops overseas?

 

[VoodooEconomist]

Yeah thats curious they didnt put a range on fleets? Only downside I can see is the skull thing degrading organisation. Am I right in saying it takes more supplies for troops overseas?

They simplified it, because the AI couldn't handle such a concept, and was sending troops from Canada to South America via the Indian Ocean, and completely disregarding attrition. As far as I know it makes no difference if the unit is overseas or just in foreign territory, the costs are the same, meaning that falling back to occupied territory in an overseas war is a good strategy. However the attrition to your boats will increase with the distance from your Naval Bases.

Really the whole naval side of the game, not just the naval combat but the role the navies had in the economy, trade, and supply, as well as running a colonial empire and influencing diplomacy is in the gutter. It's working, but not fun enough. I hope they improve upon it with an expansion or something, but then again I'm aware I'm too much of an enthusiast to ever be fully satisfied, so I'm not that angry

 

[grimkm]

OH and one thing I DO have is OIL! I invaded Dubai, bahrain etc some time ago and they sporned oil as well as some in Persia national territory. I have been NFing the chemical industry in Abu Dhabi but so far only a fuel factory has been built in Persia.

Does it matter where I NF something, it seems the capis are reluctant to build in Abu Dhabi even with NF.

Theres only a couple of factories like steel and lumber which need to be in the provinces with the resources as far as I'm aware. Abu Dhabi has a very low population, and if you conquered them after you civilized and they were still an unciv, its a colony with no possibilties of having a factory built. I find provinces with less than 100k pop tend to industrialise quite poorly.

My other comment about a revolution would just be to allow whatever rebels rise to take your capitol for a year, it resets all your diplomatic relationships, including removing you from any sphere. But if they are building you factories and railroads, thats mighty nice of them. Actually, Persia is quite vulnerable for attacks as well..all that oil and coal is so tempting.

Also, never attack a country in somebodies sphere, or someone with friendly relations with a gp. Egypt is always being almost sphered by someone to build the suez canal, but due to constant attacks by the ottoman empire, it also suffers alot of revolutions.

And finally, leave failed factories, dont destroy them. It's one method to decipher what idnustries will work, as well as not having the same factory constructed 15 times over.

 

[robinfisichella]

Theres only a couple of factories like steel and lumber which need to be in the provinces with the resources as far as I'm aware. Abu Dhabi has a very low population, and if you conquered them after you civilized and they were still an unciv, its a colony with no possibilties of having a factory built. I find provinces with less than 100k pop tend to industrialise quite poorly.

My other comment about a revolution would just be to allow whatever rebels rise to take your capitol for a year, it resets all your diplomatic relationships, including removing you from any sphere. But if they are building you factories and railroads, thats mighty nice of them. Actually, Persia is quite vulnerable for attacks as well..all that oil and coal is so tempting.

Also, never attack a country in somebodies sphere, or someone with friendly relations with a gp. Egypt is always being almost sphered by someone to build the suez canal, but due to constant attacks by the ottoman empire, it also suffers alot of revolutions.

And finally, leave failed factories, dont destroy them. It's one method to decipher what idnustries will work, as well as not having the same factory constructed 15 times over.

Great thanks all useful info. Just one more question on what you said about "no possibility of building in abu dhabi" is that a hard and fast rule? i.e. can you not build factories in nations you have conquered which WERE unciv at the time of annexation? Or is it just a lack of pops etc?

 

[Comradebot]

All too often this has been my experience. Nothin' like the AI throwing up a glass factory when you don't have any coal in the early game! And it seems oddly fond of the explosives and small arms factories...

 

[Phantom077]

In my very first Victoria II AHD game that I finished recently playing at Ottoman Empire on Very Easy, I got frustrated with the capitalists. Too many of my factories relied on subsidies, leading me to spend about $3,000 to $5,500 every day by late game!! When I tried weaning them off of subsidies, they plummet in employment, giving me thousands and thousands of unemployed craftsmen and then go bankrupt.

So to try to save money, I simply closed factories - not destroy them so I can open them again should unemployed craftsmen increase. By late game, about more than one-third of my factories were closed factories.

Seriously, why are capitalists made to be so retarded in Victoria II AHD? Why do capitalists spam new factories or factory expansions when there are no craftsmen to fill them, or when there's no need for them, supply-wise or market-wise?

Is there some kind of patch available to make capitalists less retarded?

Another question. I saw capitalists construct dozens or more factories at a time without ceasing for most of the game. But when I go to Production and to the Projects screen, the number of Projects does not correlate at all with the number of factories actually being constructed. What gives?

 

[VoodooEconomist]

It's still better than it was in vanilla. There not only would they choose badly, they wouldn't do it so often - here at least they have a chance to fund something that the market will support (even if by accident).

 

[Phantom077]

But my capitalists, more often than not, are building factories that are NOT supported by the market.

 

[EUnderhill]

In my very first Victoria II AHD game that I finished recently playing at Ottoman Empire on Very Easy, I got frustrated with the capitalists. Too many of my factories relied on subsidies, leading me to spend about $3,000 to $5,500 every day by late game!! When I tried weaning them off of subsidies, they plummet in employment, giving me thousands and thousands of unemployed craftsmen and then go bankrupt.

So to try to save money, I simply closed factories - not destroy them so I can open them again should unemployed craftsmen increase. By late game, about more than one-third of my factories were closed factories.

Seriously, why are capitalists made to be so retarded in Victoria II AHD? Why do capitalists spam new factories or factory expansions when there are no craftsmen to fill them, or when there's no need for them, supply-wise or market-wise?

Is there some kind of patch available to make capitalists less retarded?

Another question. I saw capitalists construct dozens or more factories at a time without ceasing for most of the game. But when I go to Production and to the Projects screen, the number of Projects does not correlate at all with the number of factories actually being constructed. What gives?

The projects screen tells only what the capitalists are planning to build and still at the material-accumulation stage. Once construction actually starts, it moves to the production screen.

 

[grimkm]

Great thanks all useful info. Just one more question on what you said about "no possibility of building in abu dhabi" is that a hard and fast rule? i.e. can you not build factories in nations you have conquered which WERE unciv at the time of annexation? Or is it just a lack of pops etc?

If you conquor unciv territory as an unciv, it is a proper state the day you westernise. If you conquor unciv territory after westernising, it is a colony. As it's so small, all you need is 1% of accepted culture bureacrats in the province to convert it to a state, then you may construct factories in it. But factories won't make you much money as a half staffed level 1 venture due to the low population. It just really isn't worth it unless you can attract huge numbers of your pop to migrate with new job opportunities and such.

 

[Phantom077]

The projects screen tells only what the capitalists are planning to build and still at the material-accumulation stage. Once construction actually starts, it moves to the production screen.

Ah, okay.

So how do you deal with retarded capitalists in your games?

 

[VoodooEconomist]

I try to keep the difference between the support for Liberal and Conservative as slim as possible, so that I can influence the elections from time to time and build some factories, then let the Libs back and hope for the best.