Can I have some legitimacy, please?

[Comradebot]

Playing as Khiva (1511 start) and trying to follow in the Seljuks footsteps by marching west.

• Around when I was about to invade Persia for the very first time, I had a Sultan (er, shouldn't it be Khan? Whatever.) live into his 70s. His heir died unexpectedly, and rather than risk a PU under the Ottomans I took the "maid" event option to give myself a talented, if weak claimed, heir.
• Sultan promptly dies and I get left in a decade long regency with next to no legitimacy.
• Kid grows up, proceeds to live into his 70s as well... and wouldn't you know it, his most recent heir (a couple others died prior) also gets event killed. Still not wanting to be under a PU with the Ottomans, I once again take the decision to get the weak claimed bastard.
• Sultan dies less than a week later, leaving me with a 15 year regency.
• Soon-to-be-Sultan is 14, just weeks away from taking the throne...
• I get hit with the dreaded "A New Sultan" event: heir is murdered, new Sultan is a 0/0/0 and also has painfully low legitimacy.
• Naturally, he immediately has an heir... also a weak claimant.

By my estimation, I've now spent well over a century mostly in the red in terms of legitimacy, only once sniffing the low sixties thanks to the "build a grand palace" event. Indeed, my entire conquest of Persia (they now exist as a 2PM in the Steppes) was done while fighting the effects of low legitimacy. Thankfully, the son of the usurper's heir is a strong claimant, and is a 4/6/6 to boot.

Which means he will absolutely have a hunting accident and get replaced with a 0/1/0, who will endure a decade long regency council.

 

[unmerged(177849)]

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Cultural_events#Diwani_Script should help a bit.

That's assuming that Khiva's government counts as a monarchy, but I think it does.

 

[sgt.stickybomb]

lol that sucks dude, I think muslim nations should have a different legitamcy mechanic that western nations. something like if you have a strong army to back you up and you are not losing any wars, then your legitimacy should be 100% since no one will dare question your rule.

 

[Golladan]

His heir died unexpectedly, and rather than risk a PU under the Ottomans I took the "maid" event option to give myself a talented, if weak claimed, heir.

i was under the impression that players were not allowed to fall into a PU under another nation. Was this changed?

 

[Comradebot]

i was under the impression that players were not allowed to fall into a PU under another nation. Was this changed?

From what I understand you can't be inherited if you're in a PU, but you've always been at risk of getting PUed. Heck, its actually happened to me before in a different playthrough. So, friendly advice: the Personal Union blade can swing the other way if you're really unlucky, and had I not taken the choice to have a bastard I would've almost certainly instead found myself under a PU with the Ottomans (but with a shiny new temple somewhere in Baluchistan!)

And usually I wouldn't mind, but at the time I could probably only filed ~30k troops and hadn't Westernized yet, so a PU under the Ottomans would be hard to get out of.

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Cultural_events#Diwani_Script should help a bit.

That's assuming that Khiva's government counts as a monarchy, but I think it does.

Naturally, there haven't been any +2 Artists since before this whole mess started. I'm thinking in the future as a Muslim nation I'm going to start looking for them right at the start of the game if I have the money, regardless if I need one then or not. Diwani Script is one of the single most awesome events in the game.

 

[dharper]

lol that sucks dude, I think muslim nations should have a different legitamcy mechanic that western nations. something like if you have a strong army to back you up and you are not losing any wars, then your legitimacy should be 100% since no one will dare question your rule.

What? Muslim rulers had their legitimacy questioned all the time, both by religious leaders (Sufi Shiekhs and Ulama jurists) and by other noble families who had some claim to the throne. The Ottomans were famous for their succession wars - they instituted a rule that all brothers of the Sultan be strangled to avoid them in the future. The Timurids and other Muslim Mongols also had more than their fair share of succession crises. In Morocco, you have a case where the ruling dynasty was ousted by an aristocratic family, and in Algiers, you have a case where the ruling dynasty never had control over the entire country. In Tunisia the Muslim rulers had to bribe local tribes to accept their legitimacy.

Honestly, if anything, I'd give Muslims a penalty to legitimacy. A small one, just enough that it pushes them to more succession wars.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

What? Muslim rulers had their legitimacy questioned all the time, both by religious leaders (Sufi Shiekhs and Ulama jurists) and by other noble families who had some claim to the throne. The Ottomans were famous for their succession wars - they instituted a rule that all brothers of the Sultan be strangled to avoid them in the future. The Timurids and other Muslim Mongols also had more than their fair share of succession crises. In Morocco, you have a case where the ruling dynasty was ousted by an aristocratic family, and in Algiers, you have a case where the ruling dynasty never had control over the entire country. In Tunisia the Muslim rulers had to bribe local tribes to accept their legitimacy.

Honestly, if anything, I'd give Muslims a penalty to legitimacy. A small one, just enough that it pushes them to more succession wars.

Nations outside Europe do not need further nerfs.

 

[mgoetze]

Try playing as a Steppe Horde sometime... woo tribal succession crisis! -70 Legitimacy, yay!

I do think there should be some ways to regain legitimacy a bit faster than is currently possible. Doubling the legitimacy gain from prestige and royal marriages sounds about right to me.

 

[delpiero1234]

Can I have some legitimacy, please?

Maybe if you give some Swede a special treatment.

 

[unmerged(144805)]

In my mughal game I cant seem to get above 30 then My king dies with a weak claim heir rinse repeat. I have since shelved that game.

I think I will try again soon, but i feel your pain!

 

[Dakilla TM]

That's just plain bad luck. Heirs constantly dying and having bastards take their place, yeah, not fun. In my Mughals game I was at risk of getting PUed by Brunei, and that threat seems to pop up more now!

 

[wetblowdryer]

From my memory, Khiva is an Iqta. I wonder if that has anything to do with your issues.